Mid season slump with Bromley

[DannyH22]

I'm currently in my 4th season with Bromley and with the exception of my first season, I always have a great start only to drop off after about 18 games. We won the league in the first seasons using a simple flat 4-4-2, but I can't seem to recreate that form since. The same tactic that I had success with in season 1 worked wonders for the first half of the second season but eventually it went downhill.

While I understand that obviously I can't expect to use the same tactics over and over again and achieve success, everything I've tried since just doesn't seem to give me the consistency I need. One issue I think we have is we are currently the weakest team in the league, in terms of strength, so I think we get bullied a bit. As much as I'm enjoying this game, it's driving me insane! I consider myself a very good FMer and I've had a lot of success over the years, including in LLM, but I can't get over this hump right now.

I guess I'm asking what tactics and instructions you've had success with in regards to LLM on this years game?

 

[WJ]

You'd be surprised at how much you learn from just watching the tactic in action.

What does other people's success and their tactics and their teams have to do with your struggles?

The fact that it has worked for you in the first halves of seasons, would indicate that you are either very attacking or you rely purely on playing very quick/direct. If you do well, by mid-season (especially after you've played everyone once) teams will start to take you much more seriously. They'll be more defensive, so less open at the back. This is where your tactic then probably fails - the space that was there before, isn't now and it's not good enough at breaking teams down who are more cautious.

Again, this is just generally what happens. If you want more specific advice, provide more info and highlight specific issues.

 

[DannyH22]

Oh im not shocked that it's happening, it's to be expected, I'm just annoyed that I can't work out what needs to change after we hit the slump. I've tried making slight changes - attack to control, direct to short - and I've tried making drastic changes by completely changing my formation to focus on a narrower line up that attempts to keep the ball.

We've actually massively overachieved every season so I should be happy that I've achieved at least a mid table finish every year, but I'm not. In reality the squad isn't great, besides a few shining lights, due to being one of the smaller teams in the league and players picking other teams over us. I don't have the players with the ability to exploit one particular style of play.

I guess the simple answer is to just concentrate on getting the players, but I figured it couldn't harm to ask for advice.

 

[WJ]

Like I said, watching the game would have showed you this all. You seem to be having tactical issues and you've gone from one extreme to another. Attacking mentality HAS very direct passing already. You made it even MORE direct. You were playing right into the hands of the teams not pushing up.

Direct to Short is a big change too and will alter the way your tactic plays a lot. The fact that you don't mention role/duty changes in addition is a bit worrying.

In fact, I'd be inclined to think that your still have tactical issues, but using an Attacking or even Control mentality (so an attacking tactic) when you're the weakest team in the league is a big chance to take.

 

[Igneos79]

Everything depends on your reputation. If your reputation has grown, teams will defend from you, and if you haven't managed to get great players over four seasons, it is normal you will struggle. It also works the other way around, everyone can attack you, and you need to defend or counter them. In LLM, speed kills. Get fast adv. forwards and wingers, keep possession and play slow, and use the fact they are attacking you by exploiting space they leave behind by instructing your defence to pump ball into box or clear ball to flanks and your forwards to keep possession. Or, if you have great players, control the match, pressurize them and try to control or attack quickly and directly. If you are experiencing slumps in form, it could be because your player's aren't fit and you are forcing high tempo. Remember that if you intend to close down more, that will tire them out, so you need to push up to squish space and tire them out less.

 

[DannyH22]

Like I said, watching the game would have showed you this all. You seem to be having tactical issues and you've gone from one extreme to another. Attacking mentality HAS very direct passing already. You made it even MORE direct. You were playing right into the hands of the teams not pushing up.

Direct to Short is a big change too and will alter the way your tactic plays a lot. The fact that you don't mention role/duty changes in addition is a bit worrying.

In fact, I'd be inclined to think that your still have tactical issues, but using an Attacking or even Control mentality (so an attacking tactic) when you're the weakest team in the league is a big chance to take.

my players tend to play to their strongest roles, normally with a ball winning midfielder and some sort of playmaker in the centre with a target man and poacher sat up top.

Yeah i have gone through extremes in trying to re-find form but trying to only slightly alter my roles and instructions hasn't worked either.

Youre right in saying that I'm taking risks with my mentality while being a weaker team but sometimes you can't be afraid to take risks - as evidenced by the first half of the seasons. I should probably try something that keeps my team tight and takes advantage of any mistakes from the opposition, but I'm a sucker for attacking.

Appreciate the advice anyway.

 

[WJ]

You're taking MASSIVE risks by playing a ball-winning midfielder next to any player. A little less if that playmaker has a Defend duty, but somehow I don't think so. Either way, that role is risky in a 4-4-2.

Like I said, risk taking works for you, clearly, in the first part of the season. When the space you're exploiting vanishes when teams are more cautious, your tactic fails to create its own space.

 

[DannyH22]

You're taking MASSIVE risks by playing a ball-winning midfielder next to any player. A little less if that playmaker has a Defend duty, but somehow I don't think so. Either way, that role is risky in a 4-4-2.

Like I said, risk taking works for you, clearly, in the first part of the season. When the space you're exploiting vanishes when teams are more cautious, your tactic fails to create its own space.

I think my logic is that I like having him there to win the ball and break up play because I don't feel overly confident when defending, especially as my keeper is prone to making mistakes.

I think I will try and play a more conservative (boring) style of football for the remainer of the season and see how I go. Perhaps a counter with fast wingers to pump the ball into the box.

 

[WJ]

I think my logic is that I like having him there to win the ball and break up play because I don't feel overly confident when defending, especially as my keeper is prone to making mistakes.

The ball-winning midfielder will leave his partner exposed quite a lot. In a 2-man midfield, that's dangerous.

 

[DannyH22]

The ball-winning midfielder will leave his partner exposed quite a lot. In a 2-man midfield, that's dangerous.

I've stoppe playing with a BWM as my midfielders clearly aren't good enough. I've tried some new stuff, slow short passing with various mentalities but nothing is working for me. I've never hit a patch like this before.

 

[Igneos79]

you need to wait for at least 10 games before your players get fully acustomed to a new style of play. Rigid, structured, shorter passing, clear ball to flanks, play narrower, drop deeper, stand off more, stay on feet, lower tempo and more disciplined are TI's that I know work for a fact and have tested it. If it doesn't work with it, you need to change player roles and duties. For which I would recommend the former sticky guide, but thanks to same people it's gone...

 

[WJ]

I've stoppe playing with a BWM as my midfielders clearly aren't good enough. I've tried some new stuff, slow short passing with various mentalities but nothing is working for me. I've never hit a patch like this before.

What exactly are you expecting with the weakest team? You seem to be just changing random things now. Take a step back, think about what it is you want to do and try implement that. Then WATCH the games to see what's happening.

 

[DannyH22]

What exactly are you expecting with the weakest team? You seem to be just changing random things now. Take a step back, think about what it is you want to do and try implement that. Then WATCH the games to see what's happening.

Mee are the weakest team in terms of actual physical strength, not necessarily in overall talent. I have two very good goalscorers - both with over 20 goals at the mid way point - and I've got good midfielders who are somewhat inconsistent ATM the moment. I need more reliable CBs and a better keeper but I can't change that currently.

The things I'm changing are happening gradually over several games to try and change the things that I know we need to change. I do watch the games and I'm aware of the things we do wrong. We switch off and concede a lot of late goals, oftentimes losing the game in the final ten minutes. our major issue is that we give the ball away in silly situations and more often than not we concede because of it. My players lack focus and it costs us. Even though we quite often will win the possession game, I never feel safe when the opposition attack us.

 

[WJ]

I still don't buy we switch off line. If you know this, then tighten up? Switch to a more defensive formation? There's plenty you can do. Possession means little. IIRC, on average, 57% of games are won by the team with the most possession. The stat is a couple of years old, but it wouldn't have changed much.

 

[DannyH22]

I still don't buy we switch off line. If you know this, then tighten up? Switch to a more defensive formation? There's plenty you can do. Possession means little. IIRC, on average, 57% of games are won by the team with the most possession. The stat is a couple of years old, but it wouldn't have changed much.

I adjust my mentality/TIs according to how we are doing during the game, but when it's 0-0 with ten minutes to go I'm not going to tighten up and hold out for the draw. It's at these points that we tend to through it away. My team makes silly mistakes late on - I think I've given away 3 penalties in extra time in the last month or so.

I personally don't like playing defensively as its not something I've ever had much success with in any FM game. I don't want my team attacked for 90 minutes because my back line isn't good enough to stop opposing teams from scoring for that long.

My best players are my two strikers, two wingers and there's possibly 3 CMs who are there or there abouts.

 

[WJ]

Well, then the key point would be to minimise the 0-0 situations.

 

[DannyH22]

Well, then the key point would be to minimise the 0-0 situations.

And that's obviously something else I'm trying to do. Find a balance between scoring and not conceding. The holy grail.

 

[goddard01]

i think You're acquiring massive risks through actively playing a ball-winning midfielder close to any kind of gambler. Somewhat fewer in the event in which playmaker carries a Guard responsibility, yet somehow I do not think therefore. In either case, in which position is actually high risk in a very 4-4-2.