Seriously Need Help With Defending

[Dickybran]

I'm playing with Newcastle. I have signed Dann, Cahill and Varane. In my old save with Spurs I used the Stopper/Cover defence style which worked well. I think I can do the same with the defenders I have but it does not seem to be working. I then tried Defend/Defend which seemed to work ok, but still not great. I think I need advise on the closing down sliders. With Stopper/Cover I've tried having the covering defender with closing down set to 0 and own area, then with the stopper cover halfway in my own half, and to the halfway line, but nothing seems to be working. With Defend/Defend I have both CBs set to close down to the halfway line. Where should I have the sliders set for both styles of defending? I also play quite deep.

 

[Raikan007]

this is a hard subject to give correct advice on as it comes down to the players and the tactic you are using

I always have my 2 Cb's set up rather similarly, closing down etc! I like them to stay in line and avoid rushing out to defend and leavning a gap behind for the other striker to run into...

Its a risk/reward system! You could adopt a new approach of having two Stoppers even, but having your keeper playing sweeper and having your fullbacks man mark to help cover...

I normally use both Cover defenders, if I dont have the type of players for it for the team I start with I find one! good pace/anticiaption

Cover/Defend normally works the best for me over a period if you had to average it out!

The closing down I suggest leave as defualt for the role/duty and see how it goes from there

 

[barcelonic]

if you're up against a team using wingers/inside forwards, then consider setting your full/wing backs to mark that player 'Specific'-ally in their advanced settings.

Although watch the game as if they are a particularly good side they may be roaming and it could backfire, but most of the time it is wise i find

just remember you don't need a stopper if you have an anchorman and you don't need a cover if you have a good sweeper keeper

also, CBs aren't always that proficient at passing so when playing direct it sometimes helps to have your CBs playing shorter than everyone else, so they don't boot the ball upfield and lose possession - if this does happen use a defensive midfielder to try to win the inevitable headed ball forward by your opponent. I atually like this tactic as my DM is v good and recycles possession even when my forwards lose the aerial challenges. Never underestimate a DM or Anchorman in front of your back four

EDIT: What do your backroom team say are your team's main sttrenghts/weaknesses? Compared to others in the league?

If you can say what those four or five things might be it could give me a better understanding of your team

 

[Dickybran]

Ok cheers guys. One other thing, with Cover/Stopper and Defend/Defend should I play Zonal or Man Marking?

 

[Raikan007]

always set your Cb's to zonal marking and no tight marking this allows for more intercepts

 

[Dickybran]

Sorry Barcelonic, I only just read the last bit of your message. I will have to have a look tonight at my backrooms feedback, but to be honest the rest of my team are playing really well. Creating plenty of chances and having a fair amount of possession. It's just the defence I've been having trouble with. I'll have a look anyway and let you know. Thanks again!

 

[barcelonic]

Sorry Barcelonic, I only just read the last bit of your message. I will have to have a look tonight at my backrooms feedback, but to be honest the rest of my team are playing really well. Creating plenty of chances and having a fair amount of possession. It's just the defence I've been having trouble with. I'll have a look anyway and let you know. Thanks again!

in which case maybe describe your tactic - just formation and width. depth & passing style

if you are attacking well then the problem is recycling possession - do you use a DM/anchorman? they are invaluable.
i have zonal defending for my CBs but sometimes i set my full backs to mark Specifically the opposition wingers, which is the same as man marking - the more clever the winger however, the more they can stretch your play so I use it sparingly usually my whole back four is set to zonal because I defend deep anyways.

also this may be obvious but try to put the CB in the right side, eg. Left footed, put him CBL and right footed CBR - with strikers I do the opposite mostly

check your CBs Position tab to see if they have any 'weak' feet and then if so chat to them about 'avoiding use of weaker foot'

i wouldn't rotate the back line as much as the rest of the squad - consistency is good. And every defence should have its own unofficial (or official up to you) captain. Someone with good teamwork and is usually your best experienced CB. Many of my players think that Chiellini "organises the defence well" - so I use him. If you see something like that in a personality or scout report consider them perhaps.

Personality actually makes a bigger difference than i used to think - i have one CB who isn't one my team sheet but i keep him around for the big matches because he "relishes" the big matches, not "enjoys" but "relishes" - every time he plays a big game he plays magnificently - and then I shelve him again while i use my better players in the league etc... lol

 

[Dickybran]

Jesus Christ this is ******* me off. I decided to stick with defend/defend. Things seemed ok for a while. Only losing 1-0 to Liverpool and Chelsea, and in those games their goals came from a corner and an amazing long range effort. We then drew 0-0 away to Espanyol. But then was losing 5-0 to Man U and rage quit. My defence were all over the place. 'Shocking' to quote Alan Hansen. I've not had my CB's on closing down and yet Andy Carroll drew them in and nipped past them far too many times. Against Man U they broke on the counter attack, one of my CBs was just the last man just outside our area but didn't come over the close the man down until it was too late. Just out of interest, is changing to defend/defend or stopper/cover something you need your defence need to adapt to? I still think it's something to do with my closing down sliders. I can't believe how badly I'm doing defensively when in recent saves with Spurs I won the league year after year, and the champions league once. That was defending with Stopper/Cover. So frustrating!

Thought I'd better mention I have Dann, Cahill and Varane as my main choice CBs. I'm trying to get Dann and Cahill as a partnership as I think Varane is still a bit too young.

 

[barcelonic]

Try playing narrower. I play deep and very narrow and "Pump ball into box" - when the opposition counters me then its usually a full back as my last man, assuming it doesnt fall to my DM.
From what you said it sounds like you play quite wide.
What is your shape/formation?
And where are your sliders at roughly?



PS.
As for the Carroll situation - if a team uses a tall, strong target man against you and he's alone up front change the opposition instructions to never close him down. This means your back two will keep its shape and not create the space for the wingers to drift into. It is his job to stretch play for those wingers, so by 'Never' closing him down he becomes ineffective because as a striker he is outnumbered.

 

[Dickybran]

I always play narrow against top teams. I usually play 4-4-2, but against Man I played 4-1-3-2 with a anchorman. I have my wingbacks on support but run from deep rarely.

 

[barcelonic]

I always play narrow against top teams. I usually play 4-4-2, but against Man I played 4-1-3-2 with a anchorman. I have my wingbacks on support but run from deep rarely.

i've not had much luck myself with 4132. i play a 442 diamond with wide midfielders on automatic. Instead of speedsters i look for similar attributes to a MC but lots of stamina and decent marking

this is because the way i see it a player behind the strikers is great for a good attack and DM/anchorman crucial for good defense, and the opposition varies so having both allows for all kinds of teams to take you on.

But with the tactic you are using it sounds as though width could be a factor if you are only failing at defence and not attack - with me its usually the other way around lol - and also perhaps what is more important than cover vs stopper is what role your anchorman is playing, eg. DM Sup, DM Def or Anchorman - remember to change the role to suit players strengths whenever possible. Switch to basic player options and the important attributes will be highlighted - sometime a player who doesn't look like much might actually have attributes as high as 15 for the important attributes for a certain role, even if the rest are low. So sometimes my MC in a 442 would be a ball winning midfielder, sometimes a deep lying playmer etc.. The key is finding balance (between defence and attack i mean); to each line of the formation.

I can't offer much more im afraid as 4-1-3-2 is not one i've used much or had success with. Best of luck though

 

[Dickybran]

No I said I mainly play 4-4-2. It was only against Man U that I tried 4-1-3-2.

---------- Post added at 02:11 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:38 AM ----------

Update: I started again after my rage quit, lost 2-0 to Liverpool but we defended quite well, conceding the 2nd goal from a corner in injury time. Then went onto beat Chelsea 2-1. I'm now playing Slask in Europe. We are winning 4-0 at halftime and my defence looked comfortable. But there was one moment where Slask were counter-attacking, both Dann and Cahill were closing down the same player and the halfway line right on the side-line. There other striker run down the middle completely unmarked and onto an easy throw ball. I have Dann on defend, closing down 6 clicks. Cahill as cover, own area. They both have decent decision making stats. I just don't get it!

 

[barcelonic]

I usually have my two CBs the same or similar to each other - im not sure if your CB should be closing down that much

One ruke of thumb i do in Team Instrictuions is to either Press More if up against a weaker side and stand off more if even or against a good team. Buit that applies to all players - trouble with CBs closing down is it allows the opposition to yank him out of position - might work better with man marking but for Zonal i would say that the last person you want closing down too much is you CBs.

Just my opinion tho you could be onto something but generally myself i try to keep the back two doing similar things

Also decision is good but teamwork better - plus Anticippation, Positioning & Acceleration are important attributes for a Covering CB or Stopper (personally though you shouldn't even need stopper when using a DM)

 

[Dickybran]

Since my last message things are starting to go well. I decided Dann was the problem, so I brought in Williamson who doesn't have good speed or acceleration, but has better decision making. I'm playing him as a stopper and Cahill covering. In the last 7 games I have beat Chelsea 2-1, Man U 3-1, Coventry 3-0, drew 2-2 with Arsenal, Werden Bremen 3-0, and am currently beating Stoke 4-0. So far so good.

Thanks again for your help guys!

 

[barcelonic]

good to hear

ye pace isnt that important anyway for a CB - but acceleration & anticipation are very good.

decisions is good and teamwork too, but you can't underestimate the importance of Anticipation with centre backs.