Can somebody please explain counter attackign tactic to me?

[Kurt1212]

Like how do I make an effective counter attacking tactic? If anybody remembers the man utd vs r.madrid game last year, both managers said the other team was great at counter attacking, I want to make a tactic that is great counter attacking.. Any tips/help on to what makes a great tactic?

 

[Newcastledownunder]

What team? I'd try and have the style be rigid and counter, with low creative freedom, and quite direct style of play, either with a target man to aim at, or to exploit the wings. High pace would be recommended for your wingers, and I'd say 4-1-1-2-2 would do well as a formation, with a deep lying playmaker and a box to box midfielder along with two wingers higher up the pitch and a target man/advanced forward alongside a poacher.

 

[MANUMAD]

1) Counter attacking is very difficult to implement for top teams. Difficult but impossible.
2) You cant use counter attacking against every opponent. Its suicidal. Use it against equal/better opponents or opponents with toploaded formations (ie fewer people at the back).
3) Easiest way to implement counter attacking football is through shouts (as per passion4fm's very good articles here Football Manager Touchline Instructions - Adapt Tactics | Passion for Football Manager 2013). This allows you to be flexible in match in view of the above.
4) What you shud be looking for is deep defence, wing attack, direct passing and perhaps narrow formation.

 

[apvmoreira]

I agree that counter is easier to use with shouts, like pump ball into the box, use the flanks, but you will also need pacey wingers and striker (for me counter tactics use a 4-3-3), run with ball, cross from 3/4, and quick tempo, no time wasting.

The D-Line should not be too down, or else the other team will have time to get player back since yours need to run more space, but you cannot use it higher, for obvious reasons.

The mids should be BMW, with determination, aggression, tackle and stamina.

I don't agree with a narrow formation since the majority of teams that play counter IRL explore the flanks, not the middle.

In my tactic, me best way to explore counters is after a free kick or a corner, and to meet that i always put one winger and the striker in attack and the other winger in front of the box. All the others should into the box to clear the ball to the winger outside, who will then run and/or pass the ball to the other 2. Since the center backs are in your box, and the other team will normally have the 2 FBs at the back, you can find yourself with 3 vs 2 man and the counter is done

So, in conclusion:

Defenders: good header, tacklers and excellent positioning
Mids: stamina, tackle, determination and agression
Wingers: pace, pace pace
Striker: composure, pace
ALL: team work

 

[MANUMAD]

I said "perhaps" narrow. I think it depends on the opponent and the formation used. If you want to be compact in defence you can wing counter no probs.

 

[apvmoreira]

I think it depends on the opponent and the formation used.

I have to disagree. In my game/tactic philosophy, the other team is the one who needs to adapt to you.

If you force a team to play possession for you to play counter, 2 things can happen:

1 - the other team is equal/bigger - they are familiar with this, so the play a high defense line, thats good for you
2 - minor team: that are not familiar with it, they will have ball but will not know what to do with it, the they will not be a menace.

One thing for sure: you cannot use OIs

 

[TheBetterHalf]

I said "perhaps" narrow. I think it depends on the opponent and the formation used. If you want to be compact in defence you can wing counter no probs.

I agree here. For me, it's best to use a more narrow formation, meaning that we flood the Center of the park like in a 451 and channel the play through the middle onto our wingers actually using the width. So, a 451, focus play through the middle, medium or wide width.

 

[MANUMAD]

I agree here. For me, it's best to use a more narrow formation, meaning that we flood the Center of the park like in a 451 and channel the play through the middle onto our wingers actually using the width. So, a 451, focus play through the middle, medium or wide width.

I see both yours and apvmoreira's points. I meant narrow AND wing attack. I know its unorthodox but it somehow works. Especially in wing back formations ...

 

[TheBetterHalf]

I have to disagree
One thing for sure: you cannot use OIs

For me, OIs re crucial for me when playing Counter. Like hen putting pressure on their playmaker to make poorer decisions, putting pressure on their Holding Ballwinner. I don't know how many times I have pushed/forces him back in the field and stolen the ball just as his teammates has made their runs forward, us outnumbering them in a swift counter attack. Like when targeting their deep dropping and holding linkman in their single FC formation to make sure that they don't get to hold possession in advanced positions and just like on the earlier examples, we can steal the ball just in time to make a more direct ball putting us in a position where we can make a counter attack.

 

[TheBetterHalf]

I see both yours and apvmoreira's points. I meant narrow AND wing attack. I know its unorthodox but it somehow works. Especially in wing back formations ...

That's exactly how I do it. I play narrow and really wanting to have the wingers more involved and play wide when wanting the central players to have more space. This is in my opinion a flaw within the TC settings, that the CPU is unable to do so. If wanting more width , they have to focus down the flanks and vice versa.

 

[apvmoreira]

For me, OIs re crucial for me when playing Counter. Like hen putting pressure on their playmaker to make poorer decisions, putting pressure on their Holding Ballwinner. I don't know how many times I have pushed/forces him back in the field and stolen the ball just as his teammates has made their runs forward, us outnumbering them in a swift counter attack. Like when targeting their deep dropping and holding linkman in their single FC formation to make sure that they don't get to hold possession in advanced positions and just like on the earlier examples, we can steal the ball just in time to make a more direct ball putting us in a position where we can make a counter attack.

OIs are dangerous, they change your way to defend and can make things worst.

Btw, when you say 451, it may be the same 433, as you use 4 defenders, 3 mids, 2 wingers and 1 striker, right?

 

[TheBetterHalf]

OIs are dangerous, they change your way to defend and can make things worst.

Btw, when you say 451, it may be the same 433, as you use 4 defenders, 3 mids, 2 wingers and 1 striker, right?

Naturally, but that goes for every action you take unless you know the impact and what it effects.

With 451, I mean either a flat 451, one with DMC and AMR/L or 3 MCs and AMR/L

 

[Scotty98TR]

If you fancy a long read, this was an answer to someone asking me about this sort of stuff via PM (Although as I said to him, this is just describing one of my counter-attacking tactics, there are tonnes of ways to create a solid defense and counter attack)

ask as much as you like mate, I don't mind!

There are several ways to set up a really solid defense, if I could a screenshot of your squad (Or if you haven't made any significant transfers just tell me what team) then I could tell you what I'd recommend?

(In italics I have written the theory behind deep counter-attacking in general, in bold I have written how I set up my counter attacking tactic whenever I can (In case you can't be bothered reading all the theory! )
In general though, for the rock-solid defending tactic you want to cover every dangerous area of the final 3rd. You also need to make sure you have players in positions where not only will they be covering the danger-zones, they also need to be able to break away and recieve the ball.
The positions of the players in your formation are generally the defensive positions they take when the opponent has the ball (But can be affected by shouts, team instructions, player instructions and positions of the opposition players).

Therefore, I set up my team with this formation:
http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/719/2013061100002u.jpg

DEFENSIVE:
This means the only space in the final third when all my players have managed to get back is in between my DMs and AP. I cover this by telling my AP to tightly zonal mark everyone just inside by own half.

All my other players are set to Zonal mark, with closing down and tight marking varying between the players (screenshots below).


ATTACKING:
Now to how I make the tactic successful offensively. Obviously I want to get the ball forward quickly, but I don't want it to be rushed, and I want to be able to keep the ball when I am not counter-attacking (E.g after I have taken a goal kick and I am in possession). There fore I set the tempo to the point just after it changes from "Normal" to "Quick". I also leave the time wasting as it is (DON'T make it rarely, it will mean your players won't have time to think!)

I set the player who is going to get the ball forward as my playmaker (In this case my AP, but it could be your winger). For this particular version of the tactic I have made by striker my target man with run onto ball, but normally I wouldn't set a target man, unless I have someone really good.

The DMs are essentially Box-to-box midfielders who start off in the DM position. However, one is more defensive than the other (In this case the one on the left, but that was randomly decided). I have changed the player instructions of both DMs (See below) to make them solid defensively, but also both are strong attacking threats!
My Wingers both cut inside and roam from position, so they are running straight at the other net off the ball, and can pick up counter attacking through balls from deep!
(Don't have any players (except, if you, want your striker) holding up the ball!)


Screenshots:
Team Instructions: http://img826.imageshack.us/img826/1992/2013061100005.jpg
Player Instructions: Wingers (Both the same): http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/4492/2013061100003.jpg
More Defensive DM: http://img705.imageshack.us/img705/3798/2013061100004.jpg
More attacking DM: http://img826.imageshack.us/img826/1992/2013061100005.jpg

(I also have my striker to tightly marking, zonally and all over pitch, meaning he often wins the ball up high up the field! (If you notice in a game that they are using a Pirlo type player (A playmaker who is quite close or in his own half) then reduce the closing down to around just a little bit futher on than 'Own half'!)

 

[Kurt1212]

Thanks for all your replys.

 

[Kurt1212]

ALSO: SCOTTY DELETE YOUR PMS SO I CAN REPLY.. haha

 

[Scotty98TR]

ALSO: SCOTTY DELETE YOUR PMS SO I CAN REPLY.. haha

Sorry, I have now!