Effective pressing help

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rrj2415

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Could anybody offer tips or help that will allow me to press a bit more effectively? What seems to happen is my lone striker will press one CB and he will play it across to the other CB who will then just find a pass usually to their closest winger (lcb usually pass to lw or their rcb will usually find their rw) and from there their winger will either turn on the ball and run if he isn't tightly marker or if not he will set it back to a midfielder who has plenty of space and time. If that situation doesn't happen, the cb may also just pass to the nearest full back and he will do the same procedure passing to the winger, or if not he can find a cm easily. It just seems Asif my players will wait until one of their players has not only recieved the ball, but then had a touch before my player even starts to press the opponent and by that time he is ready to play his pass and just bounces it around my player going to press whether it be my st, winger or cm. I have tried many things such as tight/man marking, OI's etc and IMO tight marking just makes things worse. They will be tight to the player however they will not stay tight to him, for example my centre midfielder will be tightly marking their cm. Their cm will then still recieve the ball and instead of my cm staying tight and forcing him backwards, my cm will them stand off him and allow him to turn, which will then leave even more space in behind my cm and he will be drawn into where the ball is and their cm will find an easy pass into their st or cam, or maybe even wide player. I have even watched half of a game on full against Tottenham and i couldn't be more sure that yes my players are pressing, but yes they are doing it after the opposition has had a touch or two and are already looking for their pass. I'm the ideal world my players would be closing down as the ball is travelling e.g. My st would press their CB forcing him to pass to a cm or fb with either my cm or winger on his way to press the man recieving the ball as its travelling rather than waiting for him to have a touch or two and then going to press ending up being stuck in no mans land as they bounce the ball around him. Or in an even better situation, when pressing thei players I would put them under pressure to early that they haven't had time to take a touch and find a pass and would have to just clear their lines so that my cbs could just hear it back at them. However in my hope for this, in reality they will just have time on the ball and can easily find a pass to their st of they wish to do so.

my tactic is as follows

gk mignolet
wb (a) clyne cb (d) skrtel and sakho wb (a) moreno
half back Lucas leiva
cm (a)/ btb milner/henderson dlp (s) emre can
ramadatuer (sorry spelling, a) lallana/firmino/maybe milner if (s) coutinho/ibe
cf (s) origi/RARELY benteke (will be sturridge when fit)

counter, higher tempo, work ball into box, close long down and d-line on max.

pi's are shoot less for all that are available, cb's close down much less, hb close down less, wb's stay wider and experimenting with mark tighter, more closing down and less closing down.

and help or advice etc would be appreciated
 
The Tighter Marking and Prevent Short GK Distribution Team Instructions would help for a high press. Stay On Feet works to keep shape during presses and Get Stuck In ups your aggression. Both can be used depending on what you need in the game.

Also, I'd suggest upping the mentality from Counter to either Control or Attacking. Players will be positioned higher up the pitch and will be more aggressive.

Player wise, you'll have to give importance to the following stats: Determination, Work Rate, Teamwork and Decisions. Stamina is a nice to have as well.
 
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CaptiveBridge said:
The Tighter Marking and Prevent Short GK Distribution Team Instructions would help for a high press. Stay On Feet works to keep shape during presses and Get Stuck In ups your aggression. Both can be used depending on what you need in the game.

Also, I'd suggest upping the mentality from Counter to either Control or Attacking. Players will be positioned higher up the pitch and will be more aggressive.

Player wise, you'll have to give importance to the following stats: Determination, Work Rate, Teamwork and Decisions. Stamina is a nice to have as well.
Click to expand...

Is there actually anything to do with my tactic that I should change? Thanks
 
Yes, though I'm just going to repeat what I typed before.

Use the Tighter Marking and Prevent Short GK Distribution TIs.

Use Get Stuck In and Stay On Feet situationally, example: the first can be used a on a wet pitch, the second can be used to maintain shape while pressing if trying to hold a narrow lead. If you don't want everyone to Get Stuck In, you can use the Tackle Harder PI for your offensive players.

Increase the mentality to Control or Attacking to have players push higher up the pitch and take more risks off the ball when pressing. If your aim is to Counter-Press, Counter is not the best mentality for that. Using Attacking/Control with a Fluid/Very Fluid team shape will cause you to try and win the ball higher up the pitch. However, you will have to balance out the player roles some, the right sided WB would be better on support to not expose you down the right and the CM(a) would be more balanced as a CM(s) or BTB.
 
CaptiveBridge said:
Yes, though I'm just going to repeat what I typed before.

Use the Tighter Marking and Prevent Short GK Distribution TIs.

Use Get Stuck In and Stay On Feet situationally, example: the first can be used a on a wet pitch, the second can be used to maintain shape while pressing if trying to hold a narrow lead. If you don't want everyone to Get Stuck In, you can use the Tackle Harder PI for your offensive players.

Increase the mentality to Control or Attacking to have players push higher up the pitch and take more risks off the ball when pressing. If your aim is to Counter-Press, Counter is not the best mentality for that. Using Attacking/Control with a Fluid/Very Fluid team shape will cause you to try and win the ball higher up the pitch. However, you will have to balance out the player roles some, the right sided WB would be better on support to not expose you down the right and the CM(a) would be more balanced as a CM(s) or BTB.
Click to expand...

my thinking behind counter way to actually activate the counter attack when we win the ball back, where as that will not happen on attacking/control as far as I am aware?
 
Regardless of Mentality, your team will counter when a counter is on. However Counter increases the likelihood of the team deciding that a counter is on. To quote Cleon:

"Under the hood of the sophisticated match engine (or none sophisticated depending on which side of the fence you are on) counter attacks are triggered automatically on Football Manager. For those of you who remember the old slider system then you’ll recall the old ‘tick box’ for counter attacks. In old terms, the impact of the counter box being ticked was that a counter attack was started when there were less than X opposing players between the ball carrier and the opposing goal. Ticking the box meant that X was a bigger number than with the box unticked, making it more likely that a team tried to catch the opposition on the break when winning back the ball. Well this still exists but is all done under the hood now and has been since the swap over from the sliders to the tactics creator." The Art of Counter Attacking Football

Counter increase the number of times your team will attempt a counter, but a counter will still happen on every Mentality. However, since you want to press high and trigger counter pressing events, Counter wouldn't be the best mentality for you. It sounds that you're looking to win the ball high and fast which doesn't mesh completely with the game definition of the Counter mentality.

It sounds as if you want your players to be more aggressive higher up the pitch. As you increase Mentality from Contain to Overload, the average positions of the players and how high up they choose to engage their opponent moves higher up the pitch. Every mentality will allow you to counter, just some more than others, but your questions seem more directed at pressing higher and higher mentalities push your team higher up the pitch.
 
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I don't think that you'll get any effective pressing with the Counter mentality, also I don't think that Raumdeuter role makes any pressing at all
 
CaptiveBridge said:
Regardless of Mentality, your team will counter when a counter is on. However Counter increases the likelihood of the team deciding that a counter is on. To quote Cleon:

"Under the hood of the sophisticated match engine (or none sophisticated depending on which side of the fence you are on) counter attacks are triggered automatically on Football Manager. For those of you who remember the old slider system then you’ll recall the old ‘tick box’ for counter attacks. In old terms, the impact of the counter box being ticked was that a counter attack was started when there were less than X opposing players between the ball carrier and the opposing goal. Ticking the box meant that X was a bigger number than with the box unticked, making it more likely that a team tried to catch the opposition on the break when winning back the ball. Well this still exists but is all done under the hood now and has been since the swap over from the sliders to the tactics creator." The Art of Counter Attacking Football

Counter increase the number of times your team will attempt a counter, but a counter will still happen on every Mentality. However, since you want to press high and trigger counter pressing events, Counter wouldn't be the best mentality for you. It sounds that you're looking to win the ball high and fast which doesn't mesh completely with the game definition of the Counter mentality.

It sounds as if you want your players to be more aggressive higher up the pitch. As you increase Mentality from Contain to Overload, the average positions of the players and how high up they choose to engage their opponent moves higher up the pitch. Every mentality will allow you to counter, just some more than others, but your questions seem more directed at pressing higher and higher mentalities push your team higher up the pitch.
Click to expand...

Thanks a lot for that I had in mind that counter attacks would only trigger on defensive counter and overload. Bearing that in mind what ypu have saod does make a lot of sense, like an attacking mentality would encourage the players to press the ball more without having to think about what's behind them as they are more concentrating on the attacking side which is what I want. Thank you for that but one last question would be about the rw role. If the ram will not contribute to pressing much (I'm guessing like a treq just looking for space) then what other role would be suitable? I don't really see firmino as a playmaker and I already have a playmaker with emre can. I also am reluctant to play him as a winger as I want him to be a player getting into the box and grabbing a few goals. I do not want him to be spending most of his time on the touch line especially with attacking Wing backs. And then again inside forward attack would be my only other option however he isn't a player I want to be getting on the ball and running into an area where my cm is standing. In my time of fm I have also never really had success using inside forwards cutting into their weaker foot. The final role available would be the wide target man, however I have never used this role and let's face it he has neither the height nor strength that would benefit my team in any way to make me want to play him at a target man which would encourage them to play long direct balls for him to hold up.

i think the ram really is how I want him to play moving around finding spaces to recieve the ball and retain possession and also be a goal threat in the box sometimes Being almost like a treq/shadow striker out on the wing. However what do you think would be best to keep him playing a part in the press system?
 
Try signing players with high work and teamwork. For eg, a player like Dirk Kuyt will press no matter what role you give him.
 
The Raumdeuter will still press high with Attacking, Fluid/Very Fluid, Mark Tighter, Prevent Short GK Distribution, Much Higher Line, and Close Down Much More. With those settings most attacking roles will press high with the notable exception of the Treq. The major difference will be how far back the player is willing to come back and help out the defence. An Inside Forward on attack will drop back farther than a Raumdeuter; not by much, though. The thing with running a Raum or IF(a) is that your full back on the same side can become exposed because of both wanting to stay higher up the pitch. There are many workarounds you can do to make up for it though.

Both the IF(a) and Raum will operate like a false ten (Shadow Striker is a false ten role) out wide, just different flavours. The Raum roams more, The IF(a) dribbles more.

As far as Firmino goes, basing this off how he is in my current save (2017) he has good enough stats to press: Stamina, Work Rate, Aggression, Decisions, Teamwork. His Determination and Concentration are a bit too poor to get the best out of him as a Raumdeuter though. However, you can still tweak the Inside Forward on attack duty to operate a bit more like a Raumdeuter by giving him the PIs to Sit Narrower and Roam From Position. He will dribble more than the Raum, but his movement would be similar and it will put less strain on his weaker mental attributes. The IF(a) would link with your other players more
 
Try to add "Use Tight Marking", "Much Higher D-Line" and "Close Down More" TIs, it should greatly increase the pressure that your team put on the opposition
 
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