Help with 3 Man Utd teams (94, 99 , early 2000)

donkarlito

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Nov 18, 2008
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New laptop new save this time I thought I would be my local team Fleetwood Town FC. After trying a direct counter attacking style it was killing my lone striker (couldnt go more then two games due to chasing so many long balls spent more time on holiday then playing).

Next came possession thinking slow pace might be better if I carry on I will have no team by end of the season.

So I thought I would go with a Sir Alex Ferguson approach with tactics and other things.

First up Man Utd 1994 - Don't know much about how this side played too young at the time all I have read is the wingers push up, the two cm's hold there positions Cantona drops deep and Hughes acts like a target man.

*from Inverting a pyramid
Nobody described it as such at the time, but the Manchester United side of 1993-94, with Paul Ince and Roy Keane sitting deep in the midfield, Ryan Giggs and Andriy Kancheslskis pushing forward wide and Eric Cantona dropping off Mark Hughes used something very close to a 4-2-3-1.

Philosophy - Rigid
Passing - Default
Creative - Freedom ??
Closing Down - ??
Tackling - Default
Man Marking
Crossing - Default
Roaming - ??


Im going for flat 4-4-2. dont know this side well so maybe 4-2-3-1

GK Peter Schmeichel - Sweeper Keeper?
DR Paul Parker - Full back - auto
DL Dennis Irwin - Wing Back - auto
DC Steve Bruce - Center back - defend
DC Gary Pallister - Center Back - defend
MR Andrei Kanchelskis - winger - attack
ML Ryan Giggs - winger - attack
MC Roy keane - Ball winner - defend
MC Paul Ince - Centre Midfielder - support
Stcl Eric Cantona - Deep lying fwd?- attack
Stcr Mark Hughes - Targetman - support?

Next 1999

Philosophy - Rigid
Passing - Default
Creative Freedom - More Expressive
Closing Down - ??
Tackling - Default
Man Marking
Crossing - Float Crosses
Roaming - ??

flat 4-4-2

GK Peter Schmeichel - Sweeper Keeper?
DR Gary Neville - Full back - automatic
DL Dennis Irwin - Wing Back - automatic
DC Jaap Stam - Limited Center back - defend
DC Ronny Johnsen - Center Back - defend
MR David Beckham - wide midfielder - attack
ML Ryan Giggs - winger - attack
MC Roy Keane - B2B
MC Paul Scholes - Advance playmaker - support
Stcl Dwight Yorke - DLP attack or TQ
Stcr Andy Cole - Poacher - Attack

Early 2000's (young rooney and ronaldo)

4-4-1-1

Philosophy - Rigid
Passing - Default
Creative Freedom - More Expressive
Closing Down - Default
Tackling - Default
Marking - Default
Crossing - Default
Roaming - More roaming

GK Howard - Keeper
DR Gary Neville - Full Back - automatic
DL Gabriel Heinze - Full Back - automatic
DC Rio Ferdinand - Ball playing Center back - defend
DC Mikaël Silvestre - Center Back - defend
MR Cristiano Ronaldo - Winger - attack
ML Ryan Giggs - winger - attack
MC Roy Keane - Ball winner - Def
MC Paul Scholes - Advance playmaker - support
AMCL Wayne Rooney - Inside fwd attack or TQ
STCR Ruud van Nistelrooy - Poacher - Attack

any opinions would help alot thanks.
 
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bebetu

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Jan 26, 2012
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From my experience 3 at the back tactics loose to much from offensive threat and gain to little defense compared with 4 at back tactics.In other words its not working properly mainly because of ME and its not worthing.Of course it can give results with big teams but only because of superior quality of players and not of tactic itself.
Creators of this game must study more teams like Barcelona,Napoli,Udinese etc to see that 3 at back formations can be extremely offensive(Barcelona style)or extremely defensive(german rigid formations with 3 at the back).
 

bebetu

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Jan 26, 2012
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From my experience 3 at the back tactics loose to much from offensive threat and gain to little defense compared with 4 at back tactics.In other words its not working properly mainly because of ME and its not worthing.Of course it can give results with big teams but only because of superior quality of players and not of tactic itself.
Creators of this game must study more teams like Barcelona,Napoli,Udinese etc to see that 3 at back formations can be insanely offensive(Barcelona style or bielsa style)or extremely defensive(german rigid formations with 3 at the back just an example).
 
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fuelledbypassion

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Dec 11, 2009
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United '94

* Disciplined creativity (apart from Cantona, and possibly Giggs & Kanchelskis). Cantona was the hub of every attack and should be the playmaker/trequartista.
* No roaming except from Cantona.
* Less closing down generally with just Ince and Keane doing the leg work, allowing quick counter attacks down both flanks.
* Ince as ball winner/ box to box, Keane as more of a box to box player back then. Hughes as target man (attack) or advanced forward.

United '99

* More roaming and closing down higher up the pitch, with two very willing workers up front that closed down more.
* Keane as ball winner (support), Yorke as deep lying forward (attack)

United Early 00's

* Ronaldo pushed higher up the pitch (possibly even to STR at times), made as target man and playmaker and given less closing down than the rest of the team, inside forward (attack).
* Rooney as complete forward (support).
* Scholes began to develop the deep lying playmaker role, Giggs became more of a supportive winger to counter-balance the attacking Ronaldo.
 

donkarlito

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United Early 00's

* Ronaldo pushed higher up the pitch (possibly even to STR at times), made as target man and playmaker and given less closing down than the rest of the team, inside forward (attack).
* Rooney as complete forward (support).
* Scholes began to develop the deep lying playmaker role, Giggs became more of a supportive winger to counter-balance the attacking Ronaldo.
looking at what you have wrote would a 4-2-3-1 asymmetric would be better
 

fuelledbypassion

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looking at what you have wrote would a 4-2-3-1 asymmetric would be better
Yeah quite possibly. Ronaldo wasn't as big an attacking outlet in the early 00's, but was far more effective later in his United career playing as I have said. 4-2-3-1 asymmetric is a really good tactic in fm too, I had a lot of success with Dortmund using it last year
 

donkarlito

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Yeah quite possibly. Ronaldo wasn't as big an attacking outlet in the early 00's, but was far more effective later in his United career playing as I have said. 4-2-3-1 asymmetric is a really good tactic in fm too, I had a lot of success with Dortmund using it last year
If Im going with 4-2-3-1 asymmetric Keane would be a defensive mid defend then a anchorman, Rooney as a Inside FWD or a TQ
 
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united762000

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Manchester United are far from rigid. You should play a very fluid attacking game. all of those teams you described finished the season top goalscorers and played breathetaking football. especially the 93-94 team, in my personal opinion the best united team of the modern era. that team could have won the champions league had the stupid 3 foreigner rule not been in place by uefa to puposely hamper english sides. in that team both keane and ince played aggressive box to box games and giggs and kanchelskis were very attack minded wingers and cantona was free to play how he liked. play a 4-2-3-1. very fluid and attacking.
 

donkarlito

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Manchester United are far from rigid. You should play a very fluid attacking game. all of those teams you described finished the season top goalscorers and played breathetaking football. especially the 93-94 team, in my personal opinion the best united team of the modern era. that team could have won the champions league had the stupid 3 foreigner rule not been in place by uefa to puposely hamper english sides. in that team both keane and ince played aggressive box to box games and giggs and kanchelskis were very attack minded wingers and cantona was free to play how he liked. play a 4-2-3-1. very fluid and attacking.
"Real World Equivalent: Sir Alex Ferguson (Manchester United)
It may seem odd to equate a “rigid” philosophy with a team famous for its attacking football in recent years, but one of the other traits of Manchester United has been their stability. Players such as Nicky **** and Darren Fletcher over the years have thrived in their specific roles despite being far less illustrious than some of their teammates. Everyone has a role and a purpose, which has led United to be as famed for their clean sheets as their goals. The extra freedom given to their forward players has meant that, given the superb technical and mental attributes of their squad, the team can produce aesthetic attacking football as well as grinding out results when needed."
From Tactical Theorems 10

To me that sums up SAF, how many times have have Man Utd gone X amount games keeping a clean sheets yes united are an attacking team but there is always structure to the team. I admit the since Ronaldo, Tevez and Rooney days the philosophy maybe more fluid
 

united762000

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the players all have roles as does every player for every team in the world but the way in which United played was with fast flowing fluid football. if they played a rigid game then the stats don't add up during that season United used 25 different oufield players in all competitions and scored 134 goals scored by 15 different player. the defence scored 12 goals between them alone. giggs and kanchelskis were both wingers in the traditional sense but still strayed from their positions and bagged 27 goals between them. ronaldo took this to the next level and became the ultimate floating winger. lee sharpe managed to grab 11 goals for himself in his best season for the club. i love the 93-94 team. it was our best team with the best goalkeeper in the world in goal and a young fresh faced giggsy tearing defences apart and the genius of eric cantona with his collar up turning out man of the match performances as if by fun.
 

silv3rf0xx

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Jul 13, 2010
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the players all have roles as does every player for every team in the world but the way in which United played was with fast flowing fluid football. if they played a rigid game then the stats don't add up during that season United used 25 different oufield players in all competitions and scored 134 goals scored by 15 different player. the defence scored 12 goals between them alone. giggs and kanchelskis were both wingers in the traditional sense but still strayed from their positions and bagged 27 goals between them. ronaldo took this to the next level and became the ultimate floating winger. lee sharpe managed to grab 11 goals for himself in his best season for the club. i love the 93-94 team. it was our best team with the best goalkeeper in the world in goal and a young fresh faced giggsy tearing defences apart and the genius of eric cantona with his collar up turning out man of the match performances as if by fun.

wrong it was structured the extra flair would come from the specific roles of the attacking players
 
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