Retraining: fellaini as cb went great what about Ramsey as rb?

Aurelio is a quality CM as deep lying playmaker. 92% pass completion for me while Raul Meireles has been out.
 
Tsakis said:
Sadly, as I said, in the save I am considering using Ramsey as fB, I don't have sagna...

His pace is indeed a problem, but I imagine he can reach high enough lvls at acceleration at least... With maxed aerobic training and quickness focus maybe? I am not sure...

Regarding his passing-crossing thing: I can't see why people believe that SBs should not try through balls... His ability will not be waisted if you give him the right instructions.. As for crossing that is is no good I believe that you are mistaken.. Crossing isn't all about crossing stat the same way passing is not all about passing stat either... creativity, anticipation, decisions and technique (as well as strength, composure, agility and balance if there is tight marking involved) play a crucial role if a cross will be successful ... Maybe teamwork as well but less than passing, because when on a crossing position most times shot is not an option (dribbling is though).

I created a team from the bottom (4 strikerish possitions) so changing my formation to fit ramsey that is not even good at the start of the game(and making my strikers unhappy for the lack of playing time) is not an option.

Acceleration and pace are my concerns but I will fast forward a save to figure if he can reach a considerable level...
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i understand your reasoning and it would be interesting to see if it works out, however he isnt that sort of player, the fellaini to cb works because he can already tackle etc etc and moving him to cb is still utilising his strengths. moving ramsey to rb is wasting his biggest strength - his passing. unless you going to train him to switch the ball to the other flank and play long balls etc its a bit of a waste and holding him back.

and if you push him forward more he will be caught out time and time again and from what i can remember his positioning isnt the best either so its not like he could make up for a lack of pace with positioning. by all means it could be trained and improved but it seems like your trying to put a square peg in a round hole.
 
i kno he is not the best player in the world but try converting waldo ponce into an achor man, he has the attckin midfielder in his pocket all game
 
Give they guy a break with these sarcastic re-training suggestions. He has a honest proposition. Don't post if you don't have anything useful to say. Anyway OT, I think it's not impossible to get Ramsey to do well as a RB but he does lack some essential stats like acceleration, marking, tackling, strength to some extent. In addition, I know you said that you have Fabregas as your CM playmaker and you also have enough cover for him, but that is unfortunately his best position. Ramsey has excellent passing, creativity, decision, and first-touch stats. As a result, the CM playmaker role is his best position. But, like I said, it's always worth a try. Nothing wrong with experimenting.
 
Tsakis said:
@ eyrinomos & vanjagl

Come on guys.. This joke is getting old even if this post is new.. I can't understand if you re making fun of fellaini as cb or ramsei as fb... Fellaini is TESTED and he is doing more than good!

Thanks raikan! I also find essential to hava a versatile squad.. It helps me having happy players with much playing time and many in match solutions for formations and subs..

Have you ever trained anyone to a position completely unfamiliar to? Does position learning eats up CA and if yes how much? Any training recommendation for the Ramsey project?
Click to expand...

lol, i was serious. Vidic would be world class defansive foward.
 
JonoMUFC said:
Andrea Poli to an AMC?
Click to expand...

Sure, but you can play him in the same position he is already trained as a playmaker...

So, made some testing about the ramsey project and I got some really interesting results...

The problems that I faced and might distorted the outcome were:

1) I only loaded England EPL with small database for the game to run holiday fast in order to have quick results.. This resulted in having poor options regarding the coaches(and I was bored to bother for a quick experiment to be honest) so NO TOP COACHES used at this..

2) I forgot to check the auto renewals thing so for more than a year I had no coach for defence tacktics and aerobics(it was covered by other coaches but those were the main areas of ramsey's training regime)

3) I was sacked by the club after 3,5 years (I wonder why..(H):p) And from my experience training goes back to default when a AI manager takes control...

The positives to this experiment were the tudors I had available... I asked Rosicky and Fabergas to tudor Ramsey, although it might be a good idea to learn him to try long range passes first..

So here he is:







Preatty impressive huh? One of the facts I forgot to report was that ramsey has random PA though.. that means that this could be the "good" ramsey (meaning 185 and above)...
He also was 3 times runner up european defender of the year..

So my verdict is that ramsey can be a leading RB.. With the proper training and playing time, I believe his stats can become even more personalized to this position and in a human managed team (hence a more competitive one) he could win a lot more prizes...

Last but not least, Ramsey is still a cranking midfielder, with lots of usefull PPMS and great stats to become a quicker xavi version (really good as a Ball winning or deep lying playm mid)...
 
I must say that he turned out very well! but with the right amount of playing time, he will as everyone knows that he is -10 PA...

I would rather buy a cracking Rb and use Ramsey in his best natural position from the get go...

read this thread about the CA and PA with regards to training PPM's, New positions etc etc....
he looses alot of PA as he uses a certain amount of points, say 24 or so to retrain... hence only being like 169 at most :)

http://www.fm-base.co.uk/forum/f101/the-complete-ca-pa-thread-t48054.html
 
I dont actually believe that raikan... 24 ability is too much, especially for a player that has already the position in yellow...

I have some proof for that, I am just waiting to see how a player I am retraining now will end up.. It seems a bit hard to adopt in a position he don't have at all...
But judging from how he is now he got the position in yellow compared with a future save I have in which he developed without adding a position, I have to say that it is nearly impossible for the position to eat up 24 points... And the guy has nothing to do with this position! Ramsey was already trained in some extend!

All those are in game experiments though, I might have to get my hands on an editor and sleek with real numbers...
 
I was being thumbsucking mate....

my point being...

Play your best players in their natural positions...

Retrain average players for cover and sqaud depth ;)

its a waste of talent in my opinion... its like what Sir Alex has done with Anderson since joining from Porto, he was this awesome, creative, attacking, dribbling machine and he tried to mould/retrain him into the Roy Keane role...

he is only now allowing Anderson the freedom and play him in his natural attacking free role and he is playing like a different player...

thats my point ;)
 
I just think it's cos Anderson is poo (H). I'm not an in game FM engine expert, but in my experience, play someone enough with a 4* + training in all sections and they're bound to get better, I'm still not convinced by Ramsey at right back, seems a waste of talent, time and energy just to get him to that level.

In that accelerated save of yours, how long was it before he started getting regular 7.00+ ratings at right back? I bet your team suffered as a result, waiting for him to improve. That last sentence just made me think of Lucas for us, yeah he's starting to come good now, but boy have we suffered in the time it took him to get there
 
As you can see from the 3rd screenshoot (career) he had no apps for 2 years (it is natural I guess, half of the first year he was injured and severed ability wise).. After that he started with 7.14 the first year (we can assume he was played as a right back and not as a mid then because of the intended lack of RBs to force the engine to give him games.. I failed though as they used djourou there, at least when I stopped the ff to set fabergas as his tutor)...

After that he was a charm, having craking seasons rated:
7,41 / 17 apps at 2012-13
7,98(!) / 34 apps at 2013/14

and so on, you can check the screenie if you wish...

The only thing that made me worry is what raikan said about PA.. I am convinced that ramsey didnt lost 24PA for sure but maybe there was a loss indeed...
Also I am conserned because I might just be that lucky to hit the jackpot 195-200PA ramsey in that save and that is the reason ramsey turned so good...

On the other hand that was just an accelerated save from one night, Having him in my team in a regular game might prove much more beneficial.. As I stated above his training changed after 3 years and he was without coaches for a while...

Also I cant understand why you all speaking for such a waste, HE CAN STILL PLAY AS A MID and in fact a great one.. His speed and newly aquired defensive abilities are more than welcome and personaly I found them more handy than those 2 more points of passing/creativity...

I will keep you updated with an other experiment that will really solve us the questions we have about retraining and also will add this player as a potential RB to the shortlists of the patient ones...

I wont reveal the name yet I will only give you some info to spice things up.. After all there are a lot of people in here that know the game well enough to figure who he is...

3 clues:
1) He has a fixed PA of 180
2) He has by far more favorable abilities than ramsey for a RB
3) He does not have the RB position even in red...
 
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dude, you need to take a chill pill!

no one is saying its not a good idea... you are pretty much talking to yourself here, I have barely read what you have said....

I never said he did lose 24 points, I was just implying that he would have lost some points....

he has made a good right back, well done :) would you like a noddy badge with that?

you can even turn him into a Winger, Striker, Left back, etc... his PA is that good :)

so what I am saying is, dont think you have invented the wheel here when most of the other members have done something very similar ;)
 
You have to excuse me for the defensive stance raikan, there are 36 posts in that thread and at least half of them were a sarcastic retraining proposition... In fact that led me to the conclusion that retraining (especially to positions a player does not have at all) is a bit of clouded area..

I tried to find some decent info about retraining since I really like this option and yet I found nothing... I can't recall if this is from this forum or an other but someone claimed that you can't train a player in a position that he has no current ability in!

Anyway I might got wrong what you said, I figured you claimed that retraining Ramsey ate up 24 points of his PA.. But this is not the point, the point is that I would really like to how much PA retraining really takes... And if there is no ready answer about this I will test it and share the results with you!^^)
 
I ve seen a thread a week ago saying that stevie Gerrard would make a awesome striker...so yeah...retraining is a good way to not waste money on another players...
 
I did not say it ate up exaclty 24 points bud!! it was an estimate....

just remember, I was saying that it is good retraining, however, not when you use your best and most promising player, I personally would grow said player in his natural position and buy another player for the position I need...

but on the other hand, for normal players I always retrain them to give my sqaud depth... I just dont waste one of my youngsters PA retraining him :)

end of....
 
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