Pierre-Divorick Aurigi is much better.
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Pierre-Divorick Aurigi is much better.
Scouseinthehouse
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Lol. Whatever anyone wants to call him currently fits. The change in him over this season from pre Klopp to now has been ridiculous. Many of us, no less myself, had serious doubts he'd ever make a striker. Let alone cut it at this level. He had no confidence and looked like a little kid out there. 'He'll never make a striker so long as he has a hole in his ****' was my (quaint) damnation of him when we finally got to see him pre-season. Then Klopp comes in, and by his own admission the mere fact he had a manager that fully believed in him and wasn't afraid to play him boosted him ten fold, and his game has just steadily developed from that point on. He's apparently been hitting the weights and it's really starting to show with the added strength to his physique. He's gone from fourth choice and not getting a look in to arguably the best we have at leading the line and holding it up with his strength and pace. And now the extra work on the training pitch is starting to pay off with him starting to add goals he looks like he could be a real gem.
Still a LONG way to go in his development. But the progression thus far in 6 short months and the growth left for a kid that turns 21 in a weeks time really excites you. His ceiling is massive. To take his goal, albeit via a deflection, and lead the line like that on by far and away the biggest stage he'd ever played on Thursday and give some top class defenders fits all night was awesome to see.
Utd fans the other thread laughed (thankfully others got it without any bias) when we made the comparison to he and Martial last summer at the respective starts of their careers. And they have brought that up mockingly after the Frenchman's faster start in England than the Belgium. Not too many looking at two super young kids if they're honest would be laughing now.
Personally, VERY happy to hold my hands up and say I was DEAD wrong on Divock.
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Liverpool fans and their delusion. Nothing has changed.
19 August 2003 : by Chris Bascombe, Liverpool Echo
Why Le Tallec will be our Ronaldo
In most cases, paying £12m for a teenager would be considered rank stupidity, over-indulgence or, at the very least, a gamble which even Chris Kirkland's dad would shy away from.
When Manchester United do it, it's a stroke of transfer genius.
According to everyone who they make listen, United have just signed the best teenager in the world. By God are we hearing about it.
I'm not doubting Ronaldo's abilities. Clearly he's a talented kid who may be on the threshold of greatness. It just strikes me as rather odd that no-one has given the same attention to Liverpool's equally stunning new teenage recruit.
It seems Gerard Houllier's mistake with Anthony Le Tallec was to buy him early rather than delay until everyone in Europe wanted him. Obviously, Liverpool should have waited until Le Tallec's value was £12m.
Soon enough, the rest of the nation will wake up to the fact Le Tallec and Ronaldo played in the same world youth championships not so long ago and it was the Liverpool new boy who was voted the best player.
No doubt both Gerard and Sir Alex watched those same youth championships in Malaysia a few years back and noticed the same players.
Indeed, Liverpool had already signed Le Tallec by then and were strongly linked with Ronaldo themselves, but can't afford to splash out like United.
Time will tell who's got the better deal, but for value for money I know who I'm backing. It's a bit like Houllier and Ferguson have both dined at the same top class restaurant and had their pick of the best main courses on the menu.
Houllier has managed to get his dish at a quarter of the cost Ferguson has paid, and yet it's his rival who is getting all the praise.
Indeed, I'm getting an eerie sense of deja vu when it comes to the man dubbed TLT who's about to explode onto the Premiership. I remember how slow our London based number one writers were to realise who Steven Gerrard was a few years back.
The Kop Magazine I once wrote even launched a campaign to get him in the England squad, so little attention was he receiving. Then, when the rest of the country noticed a year later, they decided to make him their own property.
It was a similar story with Wayne Rooney at Everton. A friend of mine who works on a national newspaper tried to get a feature on Rooney into his paper in the summer of 2002. They were having none of it. How times changed three months later when "Rooney Opens Crisp Packet" stories were making the front page.
Le Tallec won't get the same attention as Rooney, Gerrard or Michael Owen because he ain't English. But the few glimpses I've had of him remind me so much of the first time I saw Gerrard.
So young, yet so full of class. So clearly ready to play at the highest level and begin the learning curve which will take him to the top of the game.
One of the most encouraging, but sadly overlooked parts of Sunday was Le Tallec's being named a sub. Pity he didn't get on, although Houllier said he was prepared to play the youngster if the circumstances of the game had been different.
The career paths of Le Tallec and Ronaldo are sure to cross regularly over the next decade. Should the French gem prove himself the better player, you never know, maybe the manager who signed him will get a bit of credit.
How awful it was to watch on Sunday, don't you think?
A team flooding the midfield, sitting back, making no effort to take the game to their opponents but content to hit on the break.
I mean? One man up front against one your biggest rivals? What were they thinking? And how they paid a price for their caution when in the late stages their opponents scored a well deserved goal.
Liverpool? Try Chelsea.
Chelsea were impressive, but it seems Claudio Ranieri is allowed to use these counter-attacking tactics while Liverpool are not.
I dare not think of the reaction had Gerard Houllier taken a team to Stamford Bridge and played one striker. Even if his side won!
Last week, I wrote a column saying whatever happened this season, it would be progress to leave Anfield feeling suitably entertained. Well, I was. It was a fine match between two excellent sides and Liverpool contributed to it.
All that was wrong with the performance was the result. Entertaining,
losing football is still better than boring, losing football. The next
trick is to entertain and win, something I'm sure will happen if Liverpool play with the same commitment and attacking intent they showed on Sunday (and have Steven Gerrard in the side),
Of course, the TV and radio bandits had decided Bruno Cheyrou and Igor Biscan were going to be rubbish regardless of what happened. Cheyrou and Biscan had their best games for the club on Sunday. Whether that's still good enough is another matter, but they weren't Liverpool's worst players.
No, that honour went to those beyond criticism whose name is likely to be sung first and loudest.
Liverpool lost because they didn't defend properly when they were called upon. Something which cost them key points last year too but is conveniently overlooked by cowards who pick easy targets.
Why Le Tallec will be our Ronaldo
In most cases, paying £12m for a teenager would be considered rank stupidity, over-indulgence or, at the very least, a gamble which even Chris Kirkland's dad would shy away from.
When Manchester United do it, it's a stroke of transfer genius.
According to everyone who they make listen, United have just signed the best teenager in the world. By God are we hearing about it.
I'm not doubting Ronaldo's abilities. Clearly he's a talented kid who may be on the threshold of greatness. It just strikes me as rather odd that no-one has given the same attention to Liverpool's equally stunning new teenage recruit.
It seems Gerard Houllier's mistake with Anthony Le Tallec was to buy him early rather than delay until everyone in Europe wanted him. Obviously, Liverpool should have waited until Le Tallec's value was £12m.
Soon enough, the rest of the nation will wake up to the fact Le Tallec and Ronaldo played in the same world youth championships not so long ago and it was the Liverpool new boy who was voted the best player.
No doubt both Gerard and Sir Alex watched those same youth championships in Malaysia a few years back and noticed the same players.
Indeed, Liverpool had already signed Le Tallec by then and were strongly linked with Ronaldo themselves, but can't afford to splash out like United.
Time will tell who's got the better deal, but for value for money I know who I'm backing. It's a bit like Houllier and Ferguson have both dined at the same top class restaurant and had their pick of the best main courses on the menu.
Houllier has managed to get his dish at a quarter of the cost Ferguson has paid, and yet it's his rival who is getting all the praise.
Indeed, I'm getting an eerie sense of deja vu when it comes to the man dubbed TLT who's about to explode onto the Premiership. I remember how slow our London based number one writers were to realise who Steven Gerrard was a few years back.
The Kop Magazine I once wrote even launched a campaign to get him in the England squad, so little attention was he receiving. Then, when the rest of the country noticed a year later, they decided to make him their own property.
It was a similar story with Wayne Rooney at Everton. A friend of mine who works on a national newspaper tried to get a feature on Rooney into his paper in the summer of 2002. They were having none of it. How times changed three months later when "Rooney Opens Crisp Packet" stories were making the front page.
Le Tallec won't get the same attention as Rooney, Gerrard or Michael Owen because he ain't English. But the few glimpses I've had of him remind me so much of the first time I saw Gerrard.
So young, yet so full of class. So clearly ready to play at the highest level and begin the learning curve which will take him to the top of the game.
One of the most encouraging, but sadly overlooked parts of Sunday was Le Tallec's being named a sub. Pity he didn't get on, although Houllier said he was prepared to play the youngster if the circumstances of the game had been different.
The career paths of Le Tallec and Ronaldo are sure to cross regularly over the next decade. Should the French gem prove himself the better player, you never know, maybe the manager who signed him will get a bit of credit.
How awful it was to watch on Sunday, don't you think?
A team flooding the midfield, sitting back, making no effort to take the game to their opponents but content to hit on the break.
I mean? One man up front against one your biggest rivals? What were they thinking? And how they paid a price for their caution when in the late stages their opponents scored a well deserved goal.
Liverpool? Try Chelsea.
Chelsea were impressive, but it seems Claudio Ranieri is allowed to use these counter-attacking tactics while Liverpool are not.
I dare not think of the reaction had Gerard Houllier taken a team to Stamford Bridge and played one striker. Even if his side won!
Last week, I wrote a column saying whatever happened this season, it would be progress to leave Anfield feeling suitably entertained. Well, I was. It was a fine match between two excellent sides and Liverpool contributed to it.
All that was wrong with the performance was the result. Entertaining,
losing football is still better than boring, losing football. The next
trick is to entertain and win, something I'm sure will happen if Liverpool play with the same commitment and attacking intent they showed on Sunday (and have Steven Gerrard in the side),
Of course, the TV and radio bandits had decided Bruno Cheyrou and Igor Biscan were going to be rubbish regardless of what happened. Cheyrou and Biscan had their best games for the club on Sunday. Whether that's still good enough is another matter, but they weren't Liverpool's worst players.
No, that honour went to those beyond criticism whose name is likely to be sung first and loudest.
Liverpool lost because they didn't defend properly when they were called upon. Something which cost them key points last year too but is conveniently overlooked by cowards who pick easy targets.
Average Joe
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I would have posted the link to the thread where Liverpool fans discussed the move but shame Liverpool echo were so embarrassed they deleted that particular link.
Average Joe
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Anyone could do this from anywhere though mate. I bet if I spent 10 mins looking back at old articles and forum posts from United fans I could find stuff like this lol
Agreed on that one. But we are not talking about just some random guys on internet, he is well paid scouse journalist.
Btw, we are looking at the repeat of the history once again with this comparison.
Average Joe
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Man in Liverpool writing for Liverpool echo favoured Liverpool in his story. Not a huge shock to be honest. Loads of journalists and publications are biased whether they make it obvious or not haha. I tend to view journalists pretty much the same as any bloke I chat to in the pub, he has his opinion and that's fair enough even if I don't agree. Some journalists do steal a living though haha.
"Btw, we are looking at the repeat of the history once again with this comparison." - What you mean mate?
Edit* do you mean the Martial / Origi comparison mentioned earlier in the thread?
Yes. Origi and Martial comparison. Not exactly the same path as one became one of the best alltime and other was a pub player but Martial will be much better player.
Comparing respective starts and saying they are same is wrong. I have give many examples of players who started young and very well but went on to achieve nothing or settled midtable.
Re the rest of the post, meh. You can consider in whatever way you want to, I have a very clear opinion on how they rate the players.
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And you are 100% sure this wont happen to Martial?
How do you know Origi wont go on to be a better player? Right now, I would say they are not far off each other, with Martial being the slightly better. However, in terms of who will be a better player, it is literally impossible to predict.
I find it funny why people even bring stuff like this up.
Average Joe
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Weird isn't it. Make a big joke of that article then make very similar statements basically.
"How could that guy rate Le Tallec over Ronaldo!?
Martial will be a much better player than Origi"
Hindsight and foresight working very well!
Average Joe
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But all Scouse said was that he rated Origi wrongly and that he was mocked for saying Martial and Origi have had fairly similar starts to their Prem career with Martial getting his going well a lot faster.
No direct comparison on cost or talent or whatever that I've seen anyway.
Just that they are similar ages, both brought in to the same league and one started faster but the other is catching up well now.
Then an article was posted....lol
By watching them play? Just like how Ronaldo and Pennant were compared and it was very much clear how Ronaldo was superior talent.
You watch the players and make your own opinion.
You don't need a hindsight to see Ronaldo was one of the best talent in the world football. Terrible use of the word "hindsight" imo. That's nothing but a typical biased article with no question of benefit of hindsight
If you say Bebe will be a better footballer than Nani/Ronaldo then you will be rightly called out and no one will use hindsight argument.
Like I said, you watch and make up your mind. Not with some random stats, btw which I used last season to show Blind is more or less as good as Matic.
Then you missed most of the posts. Go and check his posts when Martial was signed then you will know.
There was direct comparison on cost, talent and everything.
Average Joe
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Yeah Pato was once looking like a world beater. Then he....stopped looking like one.
(please don't mention Bebe he doesn't count in any argument, someone must have seen SOMETHING in him though for United to buy him!)
I was using "hindsight" on Le Tallec, he was supposed to be a very good looking prospect and to write him off NOW because he turned out **** is....wrong
Scouse thougt Origi would be ***** though loool. He's happy he is being proved wrong.
epic terrorist
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It is so difficult to predict what will happen with players sometimes, I mean I follow Brazilian football and people think that in England we over hype players my god when they find someone there who can play in the number 10 it is lie the second coming of Jesus. Ganso or Adryan (there was also a guy who replaced Adryan in the FLamengo team that same season who played a few games and he was lauded more than Adryan name escapes me). They get compared to ZIco after a handful of matches then usually fade into obscurity its not even funny.
I think it is too early to decide which of these will go on to be better than the other, I am actually a big fan of Origi and have been since his Lille days. Always struck me as an explosive type of player, but it will be if he can be explosive on a consistent basis, and that is always the case which separates the players who are explosive. Looks to be playing without pressure which is what he will thrive off imo, so the exlosiveness comes out naturally rather than being forced which is why players like him tend to struggle. It is one of the main reasons Mahrez has had the season he has had because Ranieri somehow has let him play without pressure.
As for Martial hard for me to say what level he is at as I do not see United all that often, but from what I can ascertain he needs to be in a more front fronted team. I think people will make the comparisons because similar age with rival clubs but way to early to be making a judgement on who is better.
I think it is too early to decide which of these will go on to be better than the other, I am actually a big fan of Origi and have been since his Lille days. Always struck me as an explosive type of player, but it will be if he can be explosive on a consistent basis, and that is always the case which separates the players who are explosive. Looks to be playing without pressure which is what he will thrive off imo, so the exlosiveness comes out naturally rather than being forced which is why players like him tend to struggle. It is one of the main reasons Mahrez has had the season he has had because Ranieri somehow has let him play without pressure.
As for Martial hard for me to say what level he is at as I do not see United all that often, but from what I can ascertain he needs to be in a more front fronted team. I think people will make the comparisons because similar age with rival clubs but way to early to be making a judgement on who is better.
Only thing that stopped Pato was his injury, well also his affair with Galliani's daughter. Obviously there are 100s of failed talents and player can be very unlucky and out with carrer ending injury. We can't argue about all that. Why go so far when there are Andersons, Morrisons.
In terms of talent and judging by individual brilliance, Martial has it all and will go on to become better player.
Like I said, you are arguing without checking the context or his posts when Martial was signed. So can't help there mate.
Re Le Tallec, lets agree to disagree. It was nothing but head in the **** article.
Scouseinthehouse
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Well this is a new development.
My number one fan can't get anything out of me as I refuse to acknowledge low life's who use death to point score and see absolutely no wrong in it.
So now he argues about me with others. Obsession really is an unhealthy trait.
Sorry you got dragged in Joe but it's much easier to not answer and enable. And much more peaceful.
So moving on ..... (Please. Mercifully.).
My number one fan can't get anything out of me as I refuse to acknowledge low life's who use death to point score and see absolutely no wrong in it.
So now he argues about me with others. Obsession really is an unhealthy trait.
Sorry you got dragged in Joe but it's much easier to not answer and enable. And much more peaceful.
So moving on ..... (Please. Mercifully.).