The Manchester United Thread

[sunilvk7]

Sighs and as I already told you, opinions change when a manager is leading the champions to relegation plus all the other stuff he has pulled this year. And the fact is, you know 90% of what I am saying will happen with Pep returning is correct which is why your only line of attack seems to be 'oh look at you hating Mourinho' ... It really isn't the case. I am very fond of him still. But this won't end well and you know that as well

And I could flip it back on loads of United fans who used to call him classless but now are falling over themselves to hire him. I suppose values and traditions fly out of the window when results go awry but what the ****, we all know that and it's just stupid to make this petty accusations

I never backed away from it and I still call him classless manager.

90% of what you say will happen? Please don't start again with your logical assumptions which was a massive fail everytime. Till last month he was the best manager in the world for you and you had doubts on Pep, but now that Pep is joining City, it will be hard for Jose to win? Isn't it contradicting?

For me it's simple. Try all out for Pep and if he is not convinced then go for Jose for obvious reasons. There aren't many better than him and I wouldn't even put Jose in top 3 managers in the world.

 

[sunilvk7]

Graham Hunter mentioned many times that Pep loves ManUtd job and his plan is to ManUtd job followed by Brazil job to lead them in world cup 2022.

Hopefully we go all out for Pep. If that's the case wouldn't mind sticking with Van Gaal for the rest of the season. But if Pep is not available hopefully Jose takes over mid season.

 

[Alcaraz]

I never backed away from it and I still call him classless manager.

90% of what you say will happen? Please don't start again with your logical assumptions which was a massive fail everytime. Till last month he was the best manager in the world for you and you had doubts on Pep, but now that Pep is joining City, it will be hard for Jose to win? Isn't it contradicting?

.

Okay if you truly believe Mourinho will remain a fairy once Pep arrived then go right ahead and believe that. He was barely tolerable for most (not me) when he was behaving like a tool this season. I can't imagine how it will be once Pep arrives and starts winning which is very plausible as City have a better squad and comparable resources. There are no assumptions. There are valid criticisms to why you shouldn't hire Jose especially with Pep arriving but if you don't want to retort to them and still continue on ad hominem attacks then that is your choice

And I had doubts over Pep? Can't seem to remember at all. If I did it's because Chelsea squad is not engineered for his style and his past record includes managing teams with world class players and little competition. So question marks do remain over his ability. But history has shown that when Pep and Jose had comparable squads and resources, Pep wiped the floor with him both on the field and off it. Can't see it changing this time especially as Pep has a significantly stronger squad this time around

And anyways as I said, I would be more happy if you hired him because it means Chelsea are favourites to land Simeone. If not, Chelsea are going to end up with the rather uninspiring Pelligerini. So you might not want to dismiss me by accusing me of biasedness

Anyways I don't even think Mourinho will be United manager so there is that. I reckon board will stick with LVG

 

[Alcaraz]

Graham Hunter mentioned many times that Pep loves ManUtd job and his plan is to ManUtd job followed by Brazil job to lead them in world cup 2022.

Hopefully we go all out for Pep. If that's the case wouldn't mind sticking with Van Gaal for the rest of the season. But if Pep is not available hopefully Jose takes over mid season.

Why not Simeone, Unai Emery or Pochettino? Genuine question as all will be better fits for United than Mourinho

 

[sunilvk7]

Okay if you truly believe Mourinho will remain a fairy once Pep arrived then go right ahead and believe that. He was barely tolerable for most (not me) when he was behaving like a tool this season. I can't imagine how it will be once Pep arrives and starts winning which is very plausible as City have a better squad and comparable resources. There are no assumptions. There are valid criticisms to why you shouldn't hire Jose especially with Pep arriving but if you don't want to retort to them and still continue on ad hominem attacks then that is your choice

So not anyone in PL should hire Jose because Pep will be in PL. That logic.

And I had doubts over Pep? Can't seem to remember at all. If I did it's because Chelsea squad is not engineered for his style and his past record includes managing teams with world class players and little competition. So question marks do remain over his ability. But history has shown that when Pep and Jose had comparable squads and resources, Pep wiped the floor with him both on the field and off it. Can't see it changing this time especially as Pep has a significantly stronger squad this time around

Doubts on Pep was not about him taking over Chelsea. It was Pep as Manager vs Jose.

Funny use of words when I said the same thing, you guys argued Pep had unreal squad now it's level playing field when Jose was at Madrid.

 

[sunilvk7]

Why not Simeone, Unai Emery or Pochettino? Genuine question as all will be better fits for United than Mourinho

Not sure Simeone will be managing PL. Read somewhere that he doesn't like England.

Emery and Poch? Yes. Would love to see them at United.

 

[Alcaraz]

So not anyone in PL should hire Jose because Pep will be in PL. That logic.



Doubts on Pep was not about him taking over Chelsea. It was Pep as Manager vs Jose.

Funny use of words when I said the same thing, you guys argued Pep had unreal squad now it's level playing field when Jose was at Madrid.

Yeah I genuinely think no one in the PL should hire him with Pep around. Pep's success brought out a terrible side of Jose that I really don't want to see again as someone who still likes the man a lot. I would prefer Jose to take a break and clear his head because the Madrid job has changed him and he needs to figure it out

All I said was that it will be much harder for Jose to guarentee titles with Pep around which is true. Pep is the only manager who has wiped the floor with Jose. And you agree with it as well since you admit you 'said the same thing' so you are now arguing just for the sake of it

 

[sunilvk7]

Yeah I genuinely think no one in the PL should hire him with Pep around. Pep's success brought out a terrible side of Jose that I really don't want to see again as someone who still likes the man a lot. I would prefer Jose to take a break and clear his head because the Madrid job has changed him and he needs to figure it out

All I said was that it will be much harder for Jose to guarentee titles with Pep around which is true. Pep is the only manager who has wiped the floor with Jose. And you agree with it as well since you admit you 'said the same thing' so you are now arguing just for the sake of it

This doesn't make any sense. So with Pep, it's harder for Jose to win trophies. So we have to hire someone who won't win trophies at all as Pep is the best manager in the world.

Jose is the best bet to win few trophies which is very much important for ManUtd strategy.

What I said back then, I will say it even today. I'm not bipolar. My views doesn't change with who is in charge of which club. Pep was brilliant against Jose that doesn't mean we shouldn't hire Jose.

 

[Alcaraz]

This doesn't make any sense. So with Pep, it's harder for Jose to win trophies. So we have to hire someone who won't win trophies at all as Pep is the best manager in the world.

Jose is the best bet to win few trophies which is very much important for ManUtd strategy.

What I said back then, I will say it even today. I'm not bipolar. My views doesn't change with who is in charge of which club. Pep was brilliant against Jose that doesn't mean we shouldn't hire Jose.

No the main thing going for Jose right now is that he can win trophies. United fans who are in support of hiring him probably know he is classless, won't bring through youth players and will likely leave on bad terms but they feel he will at least guarentee 1-2 trophies in the process. I am saying that even that is no longer a sure thing if Pep goes to a rival club so on the balance of probability, Jose is simply not a risk worth taking especially when you consider all the negatives

You should try hard for Pep. If not, I would start for Pochettino or Unai Emery. Both fit United's profile much better than Jose. Both bring through youth and play good football. Both are calm individuals who don't draw controversy to the club. Yes they have smaller chance than Jose of winning trophies but even Jose won't have a fantastic chance with Pep, Klopp and possibly Simeone in opposing dug outs. So then you would have to ask yourself that does a decent shot at winning trophies out weigh the possible negatives of Jose reign?

 

[Alcaraz]

And I agree regarding Klopp. He must be feeling like a right tool now. If he waited till the summer, he would have his pick of jobs at big clubs with more resources once Pep chose his. Now he is stuck with a massive rebuilding job at Liverpool with a fraction of the resources that City, United and Chelsea have

 

[sunilvk7]

No the main thing going for Jose right now is that he can win trophies. United fans who are in support of hiring him probably know he is classless, won't bring through youth players and will likely leave on bad terms but they feel he will at least guarentee 1-2 trophies in the process. I am saying that even that is no longer a sure thing if Pep goes to a rival club so on the balance of probability, Jose is simply not a risk worth taking especially when you consider all the negatives

You should try hard for Pep. If not, I would start for Pochettino or Unai Emery. Both fit United's profile much better than Jose. Both bring through youth and play good football. Both are calm individuals who don't draw controversy to the club. Yes they have smaller chance than Jose of winning trophies but even Jose won't have a fantastic chance with Pep, Klopp and possibly Simeone in opposing dug outs. So then you would have to ask yourself that does a decent shot at winning trophies out weigh the possible negatives of Jose reign?

Re class thing, I have already addressed it. There is no such thing as class in football. Pep was involved in some doping **** when he was a player, his Barca team had ties with that doping doctor. Great Italian managers turned blind eye on doping and many match fixing scandals. Saying that there are many things I hate in Jose, one of them is his constant fights with managers and taking it to personal level.

We made blunder in appointing Moyes. Van Gaal was a very good choice when we did but for various reasons it's not working as expected. So we just can't mess up anymore appointments.

Football is short term now. There is no concept of long term. My only worry with Jose is his lack of interest in young players which is massively important at United.

I wouldn't worry too much about Pep vs Jose. SAF vs Wenger was more intense than this.

 

[Alcaraz]

Re class thing, I have already addressed it. There is no such thing as class in football. Pep was involved in some doping **** when he was a player, his Barca team had ties with that doping doctor. Great Italian managers turned blind eye on doping and many match fixing scandals. Saying that there are many things I hate in Jose, one of them is his constant fights with managers and taking it to personal level.

We made blunder in appointing Moyes. Van Gaal was a very good choice when we did but for various reasons it's not working as expected. So we just can't mess up anymore appointments.

Football is short term now. There is no concept of long term. My only worry with Jose is his lack of interest in young players which is massively important at United.

I wouldn't worry too much about Pep vs Jose. SAF vs Wenger was more intense than this.

I don't think SAF vs Wenger ever descended to that farce that El Clasico became. And eventually there was a grudging respect between the two which calmed things down and I doubt that's going to happen here

All I am saying is, Jose's behaviour was already hard to tolerate for most fans. Imagine that with his arch-nemesis on the scene now. I just don't see it improving and it will likely worsen. Also along with young players, United fans have been screaming at LVG for attacking football which Jose isn't known for either. He had Hazard, Oscar, Costa and Fabregas at Chelsea and played defensive. Won't improve with Carrick, Fellaini and an out-of-sorts Rooney

 

[sunilvk7]

I don't think SAF vs Wenger ever descended to that farce that El Clasico became. And eventually there was a grudging respect between the two which calmed things down and I doubt that's going to happen here

All I am saying is, Jose's behaviour was already hard to tolerate for most fans. Imagine that with his arch-nemesis on the scene now. I just don't see it improving and it will likely worsen. Also along with young players, United fans have been screaming at LVG for attacking football which Jose isn't known for either. He had Hazard, Oscar, Costa and Fabregas at Chelsea and played defensive. Won't improve with Carrick, Fellaini and an out-of-sorts Rooney

SAF vs Wenger was much worse. Arsenal vs ManUtd in the later 90s and early 2000s was just pain in the *** and there was no respect between the teams. Wenger and SAF patched up when Wenger was no longer threat to the league positon.

Carrick and Fellaini are not first choice. It's laughable few others also used this line. Schneiderlin and Schweinsteiger are our first choice midfield players. We have very good squad but because of manager they are not able to express themselves. When ManUtd played attacking football Van Gaal said it made his **** twitch and then we were back to boring game.

Schneiderlin, Schweinsteiger, Herrera, Mata, Martial, Depay is more than good enough to play good football and to score goals. For all the boring jibe, Chelsea scored 2nd and 3rd highest number of goals in last 2 seasons. United had 7 shots on target in 4 home games. Anything is an upgrade now.

 

[Alcaraz]

SAF vs Wenger was much worse. Arsenal vs ManUtd in the later 90s and early 2000s was just pain in the *** and there was no respect between the teams. Wenger and SAF patched up when Wenger was no longer threat to the league positon.

Carrick and Fellaini are not first choice. It's laughable few others also used this line. Schneiderlin and Schweinsteiger are our first choice midfield players. We have very good squad but because of manager they are not able to express themselves. When ManUtd played attacking football Van Gaal said it made his **** twitch and then we were back to boring game.

Schneiderlin, Schweinsteiger, Herrera, Mata, Martial, Depay is more than good enough to play good football and to score goals. For all the boring jibe, Chelsea scored 2nd and 3rd highest number of goals in last 2 seasons. United had 7 shots on target in 4 home games. Anything is an upgrade now.

I will take your word on SAF and Wenger although I cannot imagine anything topping El Clasico

And regardless of how many goals Jose got Chelsea scoring, as soon as we lost a game, he would revert back to boring defensive tactics which is no different from LVG. In the 1st season, it was the Sunderland game in the league cup and second season was Spurs game. Don't expect attacking football. It will be rigid. When you win it's fine but when you lose, it's terrible

 

[sunilvk7]

 

[zzeezzy]

For me it's simple. Try all out for Pep and if he is not convinced then go for Jose for obvious reasons. There aren't many better than him and I wouldn't even put Jose in top 3 managers in the world.

I'm not a fan of Jose managing United at all, as I've made clear, but you lost me here.

 

[sunilvk7]

I'm not a fan of Jose managing United at all, as I've made clear, but you lost me here.

Jose is not among the top 3 managers in the world and it's the case from last few seasons.

 

[zzeezzy]

Jose is easily in top 3 managers of the world right now, he has done more special things than any other manager in that category as well I would argue. His success with Porto and Inter was special, easy to forget all the stuff he has won. One bad season with Chelsea doesn't make him fall out of that bracket considering he won the title season before.

I'm not a fan of him coming to United but some people are doing him a disservice and over-rating Pep. Pep is still largely yet to face a truly challenging job in my opinion, he has been poor in Europe with Bayern, winning titles domestically doesn't really say a lot.

 

[Scouseinthehouse]

..... Looks like Klopp will regret his decision big time. He would have been favourite for Chelsea and United job now he is ended up in a club where he won't win much and needs a re building big time.....

Keep on telling yourself that.

He'll keep on being very happy where he is with the job he happily took on.

 

[sunilvk7]

Jose is easily in top 3 managers of the world right now, he has done more special things than any other manager in that category as well I would argue. His success with Porto and Inter was special, easy to forget all the stuff he has won. One bad season with Chelsea doesn't make him fall out of that bracket considering he won the title season before.

I'm not a fan of him coming to United but some people are doing him a disservice and over-rating Pep. Pep is still largely yet to face a truly challenging job in my opinion, he has been poor in Europe with Bayern, winning titles domestically doesn't really say a lot.

No he is not. At one end you are saying Jose achieved all that and more and on the other hand you are saying Pep failed in Europe when they both have won 2 CL titles and Pep at least reach semi finals in every season.

What has Jose done that puts him ahead of others? We are not talking about the past. In last 5 years, he has won 2 league titles. Pep has won more, did more in CL. Simeone won league title with Atletico and was seconds away from winning CL. Blanc did well enough in CL with the new PSG team (Not that he is better), Klopp's achievements in Bundesliga and CL finals are higher than what Jose could do with the most expensive squad in the world with Madrid.

Before this season meltdown I said Jose is not in top 3 and I will stick with that. There are managers doing better in Europe and there is lot of football outside PL.

Keep on telling yourself that.

He'll keep on being very happy where he is with the job he happily took on.

Yeah happy with not having shot at winning league any time sooner before he packs his bags.