The Manchester United Thread

steveorobbo said:
Have 2 top class players for most positions. Baring the obvious positions they havent which will be addressed in the summer (CB, LB, DM)
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Outside of LB/GK, pretty hard to argue most of this tbf. Even the veteran players in Fernandinho and Silva are still WC for the most part.
 
wkdsoul said:
Outside of LB/GK, pretty hard to argue most of this tbf. Even the veteran players in Fernandinho and Silva are still WC for the most part.
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Honestly don’t think you can call Stones, Otamendi top class. Most City fans I speak to say the jury is still out on Jesus, Mendy. And most admit Walker can’t really be reliable enough in defence consistently. Even Fernandinho doesn’t convince at CB. Yes city have better players but to say they have 2 top class players in each position is it true imo
 
Theatre of Dreams83 said:
Honestly don’t think you can call Stones, Otamendi top class. Most City fans I speak to say the jury is still out on Jesus, Mendy. And most admit Walker can’t really be reliable enough in defence consistently. Even Fernandinho doesn’t convince at CB. Yes city have better players but to say they have 2 top class players in each position is it true imo
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Is there a more prolific back goal scorer anywhere else in the Prem? Started 10, scored 8. In all comps when starting hes P75, G58.

Otamendi is past top class, the rest are fine. We're not WC in every position. but a solid Top 6 player across the board for the most part.
 
I think it's been that long since Utd have had a quality squad, people have forgotten what actual top quality is.
 
A better way to phrase it is every position needs a reliable backup meaning there isn't a huge drop off in terms of quality between the starter and backup. City have this in abundance.

No top class player would be happy to be a backup so it really isn't possible to have top class backups.
 
Theatre of Dreams83 said:
? so not really 2 top class players in each position. Even Jesus can’t be called top class.
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If you don't call Jesus top class then what do you call Anthony "the second coming of Nani" Martial?

Really clutching at straws here. The majority of the squad they have two top options. Even the ones you wouldnt call top are better than most of what we have and most of our first 11. Sometimes you really need to take the blinkers off.
 
Theatre of Dreams83 said:
They don’t need to be proven the first 5 are more than enough in CM to be going forward as a club. The later 4 would be squad players given time to improve and develop. Which having watched them since 15/16 and the brief mins this season I see no reason for them not to continue on the same upward trajectory baring serious injuries. We no Pereira is very inconsistent but as possibly 6th choice transfers permitted obviously then again he’s shown enough to be just that a SQUAD player.
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Lets agree to disagree.
 
But before we start talking about backups, we should be focusing on actually fielding out a quality starting XI good enough to compete with the likes of city and Liverpool.

If you put this into perspective, with everyone fit, our starting still had question marks? Is Lindelof good enough to be a starter? He looks more like the back up than anything. There are also question marks over LB. Luke shaw hasn't been good enough since he broke his leg. It's unfortunate but that's what it is. Question marks over RW too: is Dan James good enough? I personally think at a top club, he's back up quality at best. I like the lad but if we are to get back to the very top, he's back up quality. The less said about our midfield, the better ?. The drop off in quality from Pogba is astounding and he's looking to move. The likes of Fred, McT would probably be backups at city/Liverpool. Pereria wouldn't even make their starting 18. Mata is past his best, so is Matic.



Again, the starting XI needs to be addressed first and foremost and I think the backups would sort themselves out as some of these starting players are really supposed to be backups
 
Legend Incredimaria said:
..... Again, the starting XI needs to be addressed first and foremost and I think the backups would sort themselves out.
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Precisely. That's why I said above it's been that long since Utd have had a real quality squad, people have forgotten what top quality is,

What's being talked about in here as starting material moving forward should be quality depth at best. Fred is a prime example. He may have improved. He may be better than other options around him currently at Utd. And you could easily foresee a scenario 3 or 4 years hence where he's still integral to Utd's starting XI. Where he wouldn't be elsewhere. That's the integral difference to the squad quality discussion.

But above and beyond any player talk, Anthony hit the nail on the head earlier when he said most signings right now are futile whilst the structure is what it is and still so scattergun.

Forget Solksjaer. Who's as big an issue by himself. (Still can't believe he said that about City the semi. But then maybe he's right and you do have a top squad to be respected? ..... I digress ..... ). I honestly don't think you'll come close to even thinking about challenging for the league again so long as the Glaziers own the club and Woodward has the power. It's quite conceivable you could be looking at another 26-year or so title drought. You're no question easily going to move into a decade between titles. And the further and further you get away and regress, that quickly becomes 15, then 20 years.

I was initially worried that Pochetino is still hanging out there. But I honestly don't think he'd make much of a difference the way the football club is currently run and all pulling in opposite directions.

Until the structure is changed, the harsh reality is you're looking at being a middling top 4 at best club going nowhere fast.
 
Scouseinthehouse said:
Precisely. That's why I said above it's been that long since Utd have had a real quality squad, people have forgotten what top quality is,

What's being talked about in here as starting material moving forward should be quality depth at best. Fred is a prime example. He may have improved. He may be better than other options around him currently at Utd. And you could easily foresee a scenario 3 or 4 years hence where he's still integral to Utd's starting XI. Where he wouldn't be elsewhere. That's the integral difference to the squad quality discussion.

But above and beyond any player talk, Anthony hit the nail on the head earlier when he said most signings right now are futile whilst the structure is what it is and still so scattergun.

Forget Solksjaer. Who's as big an issue by himself. (Still can't believe he said that about City the semi. But then maybe he's right and you do have a top squad to be respected? ..... I digress ..... ). I honestly don't think you'll come close to even thinking about challenging for the league again so long as the Glaziers own the club and Woodward has the power. It's quite conceivable you could be looking at another 26-year or so title drought. You're no question easily going to move into a decade between titles. And the further and further you get away and regress, that quickly becomes 15, then 20 years.

I was initially worried that Pochetino is still hanging out there. But I honestly don't think he'd make much of a difference the way the football club is currently run and all pulling in opposite directions.

Until the structure is changed, the harsh reality is you're looking at being a middling top 4 at best club going nowhere fast.
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So on the pitch, I don't believe the Glazers are that much of an issue. It's not like they don't provide the finances to invest in the team. Even after the Glazers' shady leverage buyout back in 05', we still won titles. The issue is a lack of a DOF to provide some sort of direction with regards to footballing decisions.


As of right now, we have an accountant calling the shots with regards to player and management recruitment. Imagine going from LVG to Jose Mourinho, whom are polar opposites in terms of footballing philosophies. That right there shows a lack of consistency that a seasoned DOF would provide.
 
Legend Incredimaria said:
So on the pitch, I don't believe the Glazers are that much of an issue. .....
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It all begets the other though doesn't it and it starts with them.

They are quite happy to just take their share out of the club whilst the money's rolling around and leave Woodward unopposed whilst he's bringing that money in. And there's no way he's ever going to cede power by his own volition. Every suggestion that's been floated, not least the internal appointment of a DOF, smacks of a 'yes man' answering to Woodward who'll still have his finger in the pie at the wrong end of the recruitment process.

It all starts with the owners who appear patently happy to keep the status quo and unambitiously plod along so long as Utd is a cash cow lining their pockets.
 
Legend Incredimaria said:
So on the pitch, I don't believe the Glazers are that much of an issue. It's not like they don't provide the finances to invest in the team. Even after the Glazers' shady leverage buyout back in 05', we still won titles. The issue is a lack of a DOF to provide some sort of direction with regards to footballing decisions.


As of right now, we have an accountant calling the shots with regards to player and management recruitment. Imagine going from LVG to Jose Mourinho, whom are polar opposites in terms of footballing philosophies. That right there shows a lack of consistency that a seasoned DOF would provide.
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I would say Ed Woodward is more to blame than Glazers. He has shares in united and a lot of them, he gets dividends. He is biggest paid CEO etc. Glazers fault is not stepping in with him and demand changes. Ed holds his place and I think is afraid giving roles away as this wouls show him weak.
 
Just wondering what the thoughts are on here between Maddison and Grealish in the summer?

Personally prefer Grealish.
 
They're pretty much equal, except for when it comes to price. Leicester's demands would exceed what they got for Maguire, whereas Grealish will probably be around £60m, perhaps less if Villa go down; so I'd go for Jack. Not sure we'll need either if the Fernandes transfer is actually happening though.
 
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