Gustavo was an alternative option, If we are for sure getting Fellaini then great, but I don't see why Moyes would wait this long.
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Gustavo was an alternative option, If we are for sure getting Fellaini then great, but I don't see why Moyes would wait this long.
The only targets we know are Fabregas and Fellaini. Doesn't mean we don't have other active targets. But we must bring in two midfielders.
Smalling is ****. He was **** against AIK, he's the one to blame for two goals tonight. He needs to find a grip and think more. He has pace, strength and good jumping, but positioning is terrible. Buttner is decent, but we missed Evra so much. Fabio is level behind Rafael, but still good option. Jones in midfield brings some steel and lot of energy, so that good. Ando? What the **** did Moyes do to Anderson? I'm stunned.
DarloGeorge96
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I turned to the Bayern game after United went 2-0 down. Who scored after that and what were the goals like?
epic terrorist
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Is this the chelsea thread in disguise?
Why? Check my posts in this thread for past 3 years. I always try to find negatives in our play, as well as positives. That's the one way to get forward.
epic terrorist
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It wasn't aimed at one individual it was aimed at reading back through the last few pages. The way people are reacting you would think the season is over and the title is already lost when not a meaningful ball has been kicked and still 20 odd days in the transfer window.
The comments are reminiscent of the Chelsea thread on the few times it implodes during the season not used to seeing it from united fans its quite hilarious
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iNickStuff
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Just like Luka and get on with it.
[h=1]United must lower sights as rivals raise bar[/h]
Moyes will need time if he is going to build the kind of aura that surrounded his predecessor, although the arrival of a midfield superstar or two would help his cause
RUNGROJ YONGRIT/EPA
[h=4]Share via[/h]
Oliver Kay Chief Football Correspondent
Published at 12:00AM, August 10 2013
“He was in awe of the place. I mean, it was massive. He would come up in training and say to us: ‘Big place, this, isn’t it? Big club, this.’ ”
Norman Whiteside’s recollections of Alex Ferguson’s early days at Manchester United — no knighthood back then, of course — came to mind this week upon reading David Moyes’s awestruck observations about his new existence at Old Trafford.
Ferguson himself has admitted to being daunted in those early days and how it took him “three or four years to understand fully the politics and requirements, the demands and the pressures” of managing such an enormous club.
That was the late 1980s, when even the biggest clubs still had small payrolls, narrow horizons and parochial outlooks.
Some might argue — perhaps even, at Goodison Park, with a sense of pride — that this is still the case at Everton, Moyes’s former club. United, though, are a different beast, a vast, corporate monster that had somehow been controlled in the Premier League by the extraordinary influence of one man.
Or perhaps that should be two men, since Ferguson’s was not the only high-profile departure this summer. There were no newspaper supplements dedicated to David Gill and few serious questions asked about the task facing Ed Woodward, who was promoted to replace him as chief executive. Ask key figures at rival clubs, though, and they talk of how the Gill-Ferguson axis was such a source of strength. It seems a statement of obvious, rather than a slur on the new men to suggest that the dismantling of that pivot leaves United weaker, at least in the short term, as Woodward and Moyes adjust to the responsibilities of their new roles.
The problem is that in football, at least in modern football, there is a preoccupation with the short term.
People do not wonder how good a United manager Moyes will be in four years’ time; they want to cast judgement in May, if indeed they are willing to wait beyond United’s testing first set of Barclays Premier League fixtures — Swansea City away, Chelsea at home, Liverpool away, Crystal Palace at home, Manchester City away — before deciding whether it was an absurd oversight or a stroke of genius to appoint the former Everton manager in preference to, say, José Mourinho.
This, regrettably, is the mindset of modern football, not just in the media, but on the terraces, in dressing rooms and, far more often than not, in boardrooms. United’s willingness to buck the trend in investing such long-term commitment in Moyes, giving him a six-year contract, is to be applauded, but they cannot simply assume that, with one Glaswegian manager following another, the glory years will continue without so much as a hiccup.
United won the Barclays Premier League title by 11 points last season. It was an excellent feat, a fitting end to Ferguson’s tenure, but it gives a false picture of the immediate challenges facing Moyes.
City were undermined by the corrosive tensions between Roberto Mancini and his players, but there is talk — convincing talk — of a new-found sense of unity and purpose under Manuel Pellegrini. Chelsea, reinvigorated by Mourinho’s return, look equipped for a first serious title challenge since their 2010 triumph.
Even had Ferguson stayed in charge, there seems no way that this season would have been as straightforward for United as they managed to make the previous campaign appear. Even without facing a no-win situation over the disenchanted Wayne Rooney, Moyes would be seeking succour in the transfer market.
United’s success over the past three seasons — champions in 2011 and 2013, runners-up to City by the smallest of margins in 2012 — always seemed more of a reflection of Ferguson’s powers than those of his squad. Weaknesses have been harder to conceal in the Champions League, where their midfield has often lacked the durability to stay in control of matches when the balance has threatened to shift away from them.
It is clear from the unsuccessful pursuit of Cesc Fàbregas and Thiago Alcântara that Moyes feels that United lack a certain type of midfielder, with a dynamism and ingenuity that goes beyond what Anderson or Tom Cleverley can offer. His interest in Marouane Fellaini reflects a belief that they lack aggression and a physical presence in that area. That double diagnosis seems right. The question — and it is one that it will fall primarily to Woodward to answer — is whether they end up with two new midfielders or one or none.
There was always a feeling with Fàbregas, never mind the dreamy flirtation with Cristiano Ronaldo, that United were being led down the garden path, that they were a fallback option in case the player did not get the guarantees he was craving in Spain.
Woodward and Moyes must move on to other targets, and if that means lowering their sights, they should consider that the bar, in terms of players who would improve United’s midfield, is set some way below world-class level.
Some feel that potential recruits are being put off by United now being managed by Moyes, rather than Ferguson. Nonsense. Real Madrid’s new wave of Galácticos in 2009 — Ronaldo, Kaká, Xabi Alonso, Karim Benzema — signed not because of who would be coaching them (Pellegrini, as it happens) but because the move satisfied their ambitions and brought great financial benefit.
With few exceptions, such as Thiago’s wish to play for Pep Guardiola at Bayern Munich, the identity of the coach barely registers in such considerations.
In recent years, the only established top-class talent United have bought has been from within English football (Dimitar Berbatov, Robin van Persie and, stretching the parameters slightly, Owen Hargreaves). Proven top talents such as Franck Ribéry, Benzema and Alexis Sánchez have eluded them, as did Ronaldinho a decade ago and countless ambitious top targets, including Alan Shearer and Marcelo Salas, through the 1990s.
Indeed, it is precisely because United have not signed a top-class midfielder in recent years that the need for reinforcements is so pressing.
They made light of such shortcomings last season — even if at times it felt like Michael Carrick was carrying the entire midfield — but they cannot expect the title race to be a procession in their honour this time.
With City and Chelsea getting their act together — Arsenal insist they belong in this conversation too — the challenge to United would have been stronger whether it was Ferguson, Moyes, Mourinho or Guardiola in the Old Trafford dugout. With Moyes, though, there will be the ready-made accusations that United are “too big” for him, that he cannot handle superstars. Yet the feeling persists that, with a superstar or two in midfield, or just a couple of plain old stars, he would be far more comfortable with the challenge ahead.
Moyes will need time if he is going to build the kind of aura that surrounded his predecessor, although the arrival of a midfield superstar or two would help his cause
RUNGROJ YONGRIT/EPA
[h=4]Share via[/h]
-
Moyes will need time if he is going to build the kind of aura that surrounded his predecessor, although the arrival of a midfield superstar or two would help his cause RUNGROJ YONGRIT/EPA
Oliver Kay Chief Football Correspondent
Published at 12:00AM, August 10 2013
“He was in awe of the place. I mean, it was massive. He would come up in training and say to us: ‘Big place, this, isn’t it? Big club, this.’ ”
Norman Whiteside’s recollections of Alex Ferguson’s early days at Manchester United — no knighthood back then, of course — came to mind this week upon reading David Moyes’s awestruck observations about his new existence at Old Trafford.
Ferguson himself has admitted to being daunted in those early days and how it took him “three or four years to understand fully the politics and requirements, the demands and the pressures” of managing such an enormous club.
That was the late 1980s, when even the biggest clubs still had small payrolls, narrow horizons and parochial outlooks.
Some might argue — perhaps even, at Goodison Park, with a sense of pride — that this is still the case at Everton, Moyes’s former club. United, though, are a different beast, a vast, corporate monster that had somehow been controlled in the Premier League by the extraordinary influence of one man.
Or perhaps that should be two men, since Ferguson’s was not the only high-profile departure this summer. There were no newspaper supplements dedicated to David Gill and few serious questions asked about the task facing Ed Woodward, who was promoted to replace him as chief executive. Ask key figures at rival clubs, though, and they talk of how the Gill-Ferguson axis was such a source of strength. It seems a statement of obvious, rather than a slur on the new men to suggest that the dismantling of that pivot leaves United weaker, at least in the short term, as Woodward and Moyes adjust to the responsibilities of their new roles.
The problem is that in football, at least in modern football, there is a preoccupation with the short term.
People do not wonder how good a United manager Moyes will be in four years’ time; they want to cast judgement in May, if indeed they are willing to wait beyond United’s testing first set of Barclays Premier League fixtures — Swansea City away, Chelsea at home, Liverpool away, Crystal Palace at home, Manchester City away — before deciding whether it was an absurd oversight or a stroke of genius to appoint the former Everton manager in preference to, say, José Mourinho.
This, regrettably, is the mindset of modern football, not just in the media, but on the terraces, in dressing rooms and, far more often than not, in boardrooms. United’s willingness to buck the trend in investing such long-term commitment in Moyes, giving him a six-year contract, is to be applauded, but they cannot simply assume that, with one Glaswegian manager following another, the glory years will continue without so much as a hiccup.
United won the Barclays Premier League title by 11 points last season. It was an excellent feat, a fitting end to Ferguson’s tenure, but it gives a false picture of the immediate challenges facing Moyes.
City were undermined by the corrosive tensions between Roberto Mancini and his players, but there is talk — convincing talk — of a new-found sense of unity and purpose under Manuel Pellegrini. Chelsea, reinvigorated by Mourinho’s return, look equipped for a first serious title challenge since their 2010 triumph.
Even had Ferguson stayed in charge, there seems no way that this season would have been as straightforward for United as they managed to make the previous campaign appear. Even without facing a no-win situation over the disenchanted Wayne Rooney, Moyes would be seeking succour in the transfer market.
United’s success over the past three seasons — champions in 2011 and 2013, runners-up to City by the smallest of margins in 2012 — always seemed more of a reflection of Ferguson’s powers than those of his squad. Weaknesses have been harder to conceal in the Champions League, where their midfield has often lacked the durability to stay in control of matches when the balance has threatened to shift away from them.
It is clear from the unsuccessful pursuit of Cesc Fàbregas and Thiago Alcântara that Moyes feels that United lack a certain type of midfielder, with a dynamism and ingenuity that goes beyond what Anderson or Tom Cleverley can offer. His interest in Marouane Fellaini reflects a belief that they lack aggression and a physical presence in that area. That double diagnosis seems right. The question — and it is one that it will fall primarily to Woodward to answer — is whether they end up with two new midfielders or one or none.
There was always a feeling with Fàbregas, never mind the dreamy flirtation with Cristiano Ronaldo, that United were being led down the garden path, that they were a fallback option in case the player did not get the guarantees he was craving in Spain.
Woodward and Moyes must move on to other targets, and if that means lowering their sights, they should consider that the bar, in terms of players who would improve United’s midfield, is set some way below world-class level.
Some feel that potential recruits are being put off by United now being managed by Moyes, rather than Ferguson. Nonsense. Real Madrid’s new wave of Galácticos in 2009 — Ronaldo, Kaká, Xabi Alonso, Karim Benzema — signed not because of who would be coaching them (Pellegrini, as it happens) but because the move satisfied their ambitions and brought great financial benefit.
With few exceptions, such as Thiago’s wish to play for Pep Guardiola at Bayern Munich, the identity of the coach barely registers in such considerations.
In recent years, the only established top-class talent United have bought has been from within English football (Dimitar Berbatov, Robin van Persie and, stretching the parameters slightly, Owen Hargreaves). Proven top talents such as Franck Ribéry, Benzema and Alexis Sánchez have eluded them, as did Ronaldinho a decade ago and countless ambitious top targets, including Alan Shearer and Marcelo Salas, through the 1990s.
Indeed, it is precisely because United have not signed a top-class midfielder in recent years that the need for reinforcements is so pressing.
They made light of such shortcomings last season — even if at times it felt like Michael Carrick was carrying the entire midfield — but they cannot expect the title race to be a procession in their honour this time.
With City and Chelsea getting their act together — Arsenal insist they belong in this conversation too — the challenge to United would have been stronger whether it was Ferguson, Moyes, Mourinho or Guardiola in the Old Trafford dugout. With Moyes, though, there will be the ready-made accusations that United are “too big” for him, that he cannot handle superstars. Yet the feeling persists that, with a superstar or two in midfield, or just a couple of plain old stars, he would be far more comfortable with the challenge ahead.
Most United fans get mistaken, the general just want a midfielder full stop. Obviously we're not just talking any old **** or harry but someone like Yohan Cabaye........ Fellaini....... we're really not asking for much here.
Fair shout but he overachieved at Everton a lot. In his time at Everton people would certainly say he was one of the best managers in the league, not the game perhaps, my mistake
I
iNickStuff
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Manchester United: De Gea; Evra, Vidic, Jones, Rafael; Giggs, Carrick, Cleverley, Zaha; Van Persie, Welbeck
Wigan Athletic: Carson; Boyce, Barnett, Perch, Crainey; Watson, McArthur, McCarthy, McClean, Maloney; Holt
Kagawa is on the bench, Hernández out with a suggested ankle injury, was not selected ahead of Mexico's friendlies either.
Wigan Athletic: Carson; Boyce, Barnett, Perch, Crainey; Watson, McArthur, McCarthy, McClean, Maloney; Holt
Kagawa is on the bench, Hernández out with a suggested ankle injury, was not selected ahead of Mexico's friendlies either.
I'd really of liked to of seen Januzaj with Carrick as a partnership to start this match. I can see Moyes really wants to get off to a good start and not take any gambles but he looks really smooth in possession and it could of been a greater reward than risk.