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Bayern München Tactic Creation(Help required!)

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Because of the match engine this year, most people(including me) have been struggling with finding a solid tactic to work for their team. I've tried an assortment of downloaded tactics and only about 5% of those I've downloaded have worked, but none of them work for the latest patch(atleast for me).

So, I decided that instead of just trying a bunch of random settings and formations until I found something that worked(like I did on FM12) that I'd try to replicate the tactics of a real-life team.

Now, most people would go for Barcelona or Real Madrid type tactics when doing something like this, but for me the most impressive team this season is Bayern Munich. They have had the best defensive record in the Bundesliga this season as well as the second highest possession per game in Europe(after Barcelona). With the help of you guys if this tactic becomes good I will probably release it on this site.

The aim of this thread is to create a tactic similar to Bayern's in real life that would work in FM for not only Bayern but for other teams as well. With the help of you guys if this tactic becomes good I will probably release it on this site.

This is what I've done so far, it's not much but since I'm not a tactical genius I don't know what to do with several settings to get the desired results. I've tried to see as much of Bayern Munich's games as possible but I only get the Bundesliga highlights and not the full games on T.V. The exact tactics of real life teams may not work in FM so first we'll try to get as close as possible to the real thing and make some tweaks until we find what works.



The formation I've used is a 4-2-3-1. Some people might argue that Bayern play a 4-3-3 with Martinez as a DM and Kroos and Schweini as CMs, but most of the time I've observed that Kroos is behind Mandzukic in the hole rather than alongside Bastian so I've played him at AMC. Some of the roles I've set so far might be weird and some I'm not sure myself, so I need help here as well as on the player instructions.

RB, LB : Full Back(support) : Lahm and Alaba - From what I've seen they usually sit back and defend but burst forward and overlap with the wingers when the chance arises. For this reason I will probably use the "Look for Overlap" shout.

CBs : Central Defender(defend): Dante and van Buyten - I don't think any changes here are required but I might try playing a stopper-cover combo later in-case the defense is not solid enough.(What do you suggest?)

DMR : Defensive Midfielder(defend): Javi Martinez - I was not sure whether to play him as an anchor man or a defensive midfielder because he stays back mostly but for now I think defensive midfielder on defend would be the best because I want him to close down on opposition players.(W)

CML : Box to Box Midfielder(support): Bastian Schweinsteiger - Schweinsteiger is a box-to-box midfielder naturally but with the talented attacking quartet ahead of him he usually stays back, just a little ahead of Martinez and recycles possession when attacking. Not sure whether to play him as just a central midfielder instead of box to box.(W)

AMC : Attacking Midfielder(support): Kroos - I've set him to this role because he usually is already in the hole and doesn't burst forward from central midfield. I chose Attacking Midfielder over Advanced Playmaker because the player instructions for Attacking Midfielder on support says that he will sometimes come and help the defense as well which is what he does in real life.(W)

AML, AMR : Advanced Playmaker(attack): Ribery and Muller/Robben - This probably the setting that will bring the most discussion. Most people would play Inside Forwards here. You'd never consider Robben to be a playmaker, because he never passes! He also doesn't track back to help his full back, which is why Heynckes has preferred Muller on the right flank. Ribery has improved his attitude and work rate and so he is first choice as usual. I've tried playing Advanced Playmaker(attack) on the wings before and I've found that they drop deep to pick up the ball (and if they are deep they will naturally help defending, which is what they do irl). Secondly, while their default wide play is to cut in, they will also occasionally put in crosses(again, like they do irl). (W)

ST: Advanced Forward(attack): Mandzukic - This role I think is perfect for what Mandzukic does in real life. He leads the line but also crafts out chances at times and drifts out wide to chase loose balls.

(W): What do you think? When I've put this at the end of a paragraph that means I would like some suggestions and your opinion of whether this role or position is right for the player's role irl.

Team Instructions: Very Fluid - While defending the entire team presses the opposition for the ball so I've gone for this. I might consider toning it down to Fluid, but not sure at this point. (W)

Mentality: Attacking - They play an attacking game, but because of their possession this season control could be the right one.(W)

Passing: Default - They play a short passing game usually but the front four are pretty direct.(W)

Creative Freedom: More Expressive (W)

Closing Down: Press More, Tackling: More Aggressive - One of the key elements of Bayern's play is their aggressive pressing. They don't let the opposition keep the ball and so that's what I'm trying to do here with these settings.

Marking: Zonal - It's what they use in real life.

Crossing, Roaming, Width, Tempo and Defensive Line set to default.(W)(I don't know what to set for Tempo and Width, but I think I should maybe pull down the line by a few clicks?)

Focused Passing - I want the ball to go to the wingers a lot but since they will cut in, I don't know whether to set passing to the middle or to the wings for the ball to be passed to them.(W)

Play Offside - Yes

Playmaker - AMC(Kroos) - I'm not sure whether to have a playmaker or not but for now I've set it to Kroos. Need your suggestions here. (W)

Target Man - None - I think I might need to set Mandzukic as the target man, but again, not sure. Supply would probably be mixed to him since he's good with his head as well as his feet.

Player Instruction changes(so far):

- Wingers set to swap positions with each other

- All longshots turned off(players take plain stupid long shots in FM)

- Wingers set to cross to centre(I might change it to target man if I end up using one)

- Full backs set to cross to far post.

- DM's passing set to first click of mixed(even though Martinez does mainly short passes, I felt that the passing was too short)

- BBM's passing made 2 clicks shorter.


As I said before, I'm not a tactical genius(FM13 is only my second FM game and I only started watching football a lot from the start of the 2011/12 season), so I'd appreciate any suggestions or opinions to improve this tactic. :) Also, English is not my first language so I apologize if I have made a few grammatical mistakes.
 
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Couple I alterations I could advise:
1: set Lahm and Alaba to WB automatic
2: Set passing style to short.
3: they don't tackle so hard and aggressive.
 
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Couple I alterations I could advise:
1: set Lahm and Alaba to WB automatic
2: Set passing style to short.
3: they don't tackle so hard and aggressive.
Second and third are good suggestions, I will set the tackling to default and passing to short, but if I set the fullbacks to WB-Auto, won't they become too attacking? Since the match strategy is attacking, they will become WB-attack, and they will leave holes in the defense on the counter. I might change to WB-support, I dunno
 
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The link he posted is different I think. Sorry I created a new thread, I only created my account here today so I didn't know there was already an existing one. The last post was 2 weeks ago and I only checked the first page so I didn't see it.

Anyway, first competitive game was the Super Cup vs Dortmund (I was stupidly assigned two friendlies before my players came back from holiday which I forgot to cancel.)

Won 4-1 with Robben and Kroos netting a brace. :D The goal we conceded was due to a mistake by Dante - he ran forward to head away the goal kick when he should have been running backwards. Lewandowski got the ball and was clear through on goal and needless to say he scored :/ But tbf Robben did score his second goal from our own half so its alright :p The tactic was no where near fully fluid so I'm guessing this is a good sign. Using version 1.2 of this tactic, but still there is work to be done with the buildup of play from the CM/DM to the flanks. Using a DM instead of a CM is helping the defense but it means that the RDM will have to do a long pass to the right wing(passing is set to flanks) which he sometimes misses, causing our possession % to go down.
 
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Interresting. Im on a quite similar projekt :) Bayern is playing inspired football, and is well worth replicating.

Im playing with Fulham and have tried different formations. What I find fits best is a straight 4-2-3-1. Roles are:

gk

wb(s) dc dc wb(s)

BWM (d) BBM (s)

If (a) am (s) if (s)

Af

I play balanced attacking, zonal, short, cautious, more roaming. I think it looks promising, though Fulham havn´t really go the quality to pull it of.

Looking forward to your findings.
 
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Quick update:

I´ve changed the if (a) to a w (a) and it works much better :)
 
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Interresting. Im on a quite similar projekt :) Bayern is playing inspired football, and is well worth replicating.

Im playing with Fulham and have tried different formations. What I find fits best is a straight 4-2-3-1. Roles are:

gk

wb(s) dc dc wb(s)

BWM (d) BBM (s)

If (a) am (s) if (s)

Af

I play balanced attacking, zonal, short, cautious, more roaming. I think it looks promising, though Fulham havn´t really go the quality to pull it of.

Looking forward to your findings.
Though Ruiz and Berbatov are quality it would probably be a bit hard with quality players not at your disposal(Bayern have someone like Robben on the bench in real life and that is a luxury Fulham cannot afford :p) And also, what is the reason you've used 1 IF on support and another on attack? :)

Hopefully I can get as close to Bayern in real life in terms of play and results. I will keep you updated on how my progress goes.
 
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Though Ruiz and Berbatov are quality it would probably be a bit hard with quality players not at your disposal(Bayern have someone like Robben on the bench in real life and that is a luxury Fulham cannot afford :p) And also, what is the reason you've used 1 IF on support and another on attack? :)

Hopefully I can get as close to Bayern in real life in terms of play and results. I will keep you updated on how my progress goes.
Yes, the squad need improvement! Have sold Berbatov to gain som money. Bought Dorrans, Granquist, Jelle Vossen, Cook and some young greek AMC. So its better now. But I´m very into the idea of working with the club culture. So trying to reshape the entire club and starting players is not that important. Its all about the future.

The idea behind one on support and one on attack is Ribery (support) starts deeper with the ball, dribles and passes. Some times he crosses in real life. that doesnt happen in my tactic, but I think it looks right. Müller (attack) runs very direct into the area and acts like a forward. I have found, that the winger (attack) looks more like the real thing, so I have changes the role.

Its actually working quite well now
 
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Could you try to change your IF(s) to Advanced Playmaker(a)? He will dribble and try through balls a lot but will also occasionally cross. It says in player instructions he will drop deeper to collect the ball(that's what you wanted.) I'm using it and it works really well for me. The wingers in my tactic so far are dominating, Robben is the star of every game along with my AMC, even though Arjen has **** work rate :p
 
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Played only a couple of small teams so far due to commitments in real life, but the tactic looks good now. Need to adjust crossing for full backs and wingers as they do not seem to go to any of my players in the box(wingers are crossing to centre and full backs to far post, I might put in Mandzukic as a TM and set crossing to him on mixed.) Defense seems pretty solid so far, but I've the only big team I've played is Dortmund, so I'll have to give it a few more games.
 
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I have studied a few of Bayern's games this season and this is how I think they set up:

GK - SK-Support
DR - WB-Support
DCR - CD-Cover
DCL - CD-Stopper
DL - WB-Support
DMCR - DM-Defend
DMCL - DM-Support
AMR - IF-Attack
AMC - AM-Support
AML - IF-Attack
FC - AF-Attack

Philosophy - Fluid
Strategy - Control

Passing - Shorter
CF - More Expressive
Closing Down - Press More
Roaming - More Roaming

Everything else on default.

The Keeper sweeps up behind the defence and is not afraid to step out with the ball at his feet. There is a definite split mentality between the CB's. The full backs get forward a lot based on the heat maps I have seen on whoscored.com

Usually one DM gets forward to support the attack (Schweinsteiger) and the other holds position (Gustavo/Martinez). Kroos roams around and helps out in defence as well as getting forward to provide/score. The to wide players come inside a lot and get beyond the striker quite a bit.

And the striker focuses on scoring goals but does move around a bit to create space/link up.



The average player positions from the recent game against Hoffenheim.

25 (Muller) and 7 (Ribery) come inside and get beyond the striker. 33 (Gomez) leads the line but also moves around. 11 (Shaqiri) gets beyond the striker at times but also stays back at times hence the roaming.

21 (Lahm) and 27 (Alaba) bomb forward often. There is a definite mentality split between the DC's 17 (Boateng) pushes up and 4 (Dante) hangs back. 8 (Martinez) holds position in front of the DC's and 31 (Schweinsteiger) gets forward in support of the attacks.

The keeper is not too advanced in this match because it is Starke and not Neuer.
 
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Bastian is a DLP, and Mario doesnt always stay high up (DLF/Complete forward support)

The rest is spot on.
 
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this is similar to my new tactic I have made for the year ahead, I just dropped the two CM's to DM's and changed the role of my TM to CF - Support

but that is pretty much what Bayern play like....

shouts like:

exploit flanks/play through defence can also be used..
 
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this is similar to my new tactic I have made for the year ahead, I just dropped the two CM's to DM's and changed the role of my TM to CF - Support

but that is pretty much what Bayern play like....

shouts like:

exploit flanks/play through defence can also be used..

Actually re: Bayern set up ( not yours) I would set the closing down and creative freedom to default. Bayern are an outstanding unit, who can quickly shift style, whether thats to aggressive pressing, or standing off and creating an impassable wall. They are also intelligent without being overly flamboyant as an overall side
 
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