Can't win away against big teams...

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AhmeddElSayedd

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I play with Arsenal and I cannot win against most big teams away from home regardless of what I do. I lost 4-1 to Chelsea, 5-2 to Man Utd and 3-0 to City and I tried to replay those matches with different tactics, still unable to win.

This is my original tactic: 4-2-3-1 2DM
Mentality: Control
Team Shape: Flexible
I have my fullbacks on support, an Anchorman and a Regista in the midfield alongside an AP(S), a W(S) and a RMD and in attack an advanced forward and sometimes a CP

My team instructions:
Retain Possession
Shorter Passing
Pass Into Space
Work Ball Into Box
Play Out of Defense
Push Higher Up (Drop deeper when Away)
Lower Tempo
Be More Expressive
Exploit The Flanks
Close Down More
Get Stuck In

Any tactical help would be appreciated, Home or Away but specifically away to at least have a decent record and not get torn apart away against big teams every time.
 
The role and duty setup is okay, though with an anchorman you could be more adventurous with at least one fullback.

Big question - Do you need all those TIs? How did you come to select the ones you have?
 
WJ said:
The role and duty setup is okay, though with an anchorman you could be more adventurous with at least one fullback.

Big question - Do you need all those TIs? How did you come to select the ones you have?
Click to expand...

Well I always want to play with a very specific mindset and since I wanted my players to play with a more possession-based style, I chose those and in another tactic when I tried to play attacking instead of control I chose More Direct Passing and Higher Tempo. Maybe I am wrong?
 
I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm trying to get you to think about your tactic. If you're playing a possession based style, why did you go for Control mentality? Everything you've selected can be automatically done with a lower mentality. The big thing (IMO) is to start fairly simple and then add TIs as you see you need them in your tactic. IMO, again, you've gone way overboard on the TIs and that's why you're struggling against these big teams when they're at home. I can explain what I think is happening, but I want you to try and envision how your tactic is supposed to work. :)

Try and explain why the choice of mentality, why you selected each TI and even how you want the tactic to function as a whole - things like how do you want to build up, who's going to be the main creators of goals, who'll be expected to score, how do you intend to defend etc.
 
At first, I wanted to create an attacking 4-2-3-1 with 2 CMS as a DLP (D) and a B2B as I wanted Ramsey to make runs from deep and score goals, as well as using the pace on the wings to create chances and Ozil as my main playmaker/chances creator. But after some disappointing results I opted to go with this one. I chose Control because I want the team to take control of the game, retain possesion, pass the ball around and look for an opening, so this allowed me to use the instructions Retain Possession, Shorter passing, play out of defense, Work Ball into Box and Lower Tempo as well as be more expressive to allow creative players like Ozil and Ramsey create chances. I want to defend carefully, not using offside trap because it is very risky and since I have Mertesacker as a defender, it could fail miserably, as well as I don't want strikers to skip past them easily, particularly from crosses, and score with ease. So I want them to be solid defensively but still be aggressive, and I play with an anchorman to help them (BTW sometimes I change my 2 DMS to 2 CMS DLP (D) and B2B to allow Kovacic and Wilshere to play in their natural positions. What do you thing of this?). I set the AP (Ozil) on support alongside the winger to balance the attack because I want the RMD to be one of my top scorers alongside my stirker so I set them both on attack.
Now where am I wrong and what else do you need to know? Also, if my first tactic is possible to create, any help would be appreciated.
 
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I still have no idea why you chose Control? It's an attacking mentality, but everything you say points to you actually wanting the opposite. Just lowering the mentality will do what you want.

You've selected Retain Possession, which lowers tempo and shortens passing. On top of that, you've selected Lower Tempo and Shorter Passing as well, which will make the tempo even lower and shortens the passing range even more. Play Out Of Defence also Shortens the passing for your defenders even more. I won't be surprised to see a bunch of hoofs upfield because your players are struggling to find passing options that close. You'll also be inviting the opposition onto you and the players may take too long on the ball (lower tempo x2) or have limited passing options because of the extremely short passing (x3!).

Let me also say this: You won't get careful defending on Control. By default it has a fairly high line and higher than normal closing down. It's the mentality just below Attacking!

Like I said, I don't think your role and duty selection is too bad. The mentality and TIs are baffling me a little though. Again, I'd suggest starting on a lower mentality (sounds like you want Counter) with limited TIs (or even none) and go from there. Only add TIs if you see it's needed in the tactic.
 
Okay then I need help with TIs so that I don't multiply what I want. Also, I still can't understand why I am being dominated that much away from home.
 
AhmeddElSayedd said:
Okay then I need help with TI so that I don't multiply what I want. Also, I still can't understand why I am being dominated that much away from home.
Click to expand...
I covered both these questions in the previous post.
 
Okay so I tried to minimize TIs as you said, changed the mentality. Then I played the game vs Man Utd at the Old Trafford with Counter mentality and TIs are:
Retain Possession
Drop Deeper
Close Down More
Exploit the Flanks (Bec. they don't play with wingers; Only fullbacks)
Work Ball Into Box

That's it, that's all I did. No OIs, nothing. It is the 41st minute and I am down 3-0....
What else shoud I do?
 
You're still using TIs without thinking. Rather remove them all, except maybe Work Ball Into Box. Then add IF YOU SEE YOU NEED IT.
 
Let me just add that Drop Deeper while also wanting to Press More is a recipe for disaster. By dropping even deeper than an already deep D-Line on counter, you're creating a lot of space. Pressing in that much space is going to create gaps all over the place.
 
Okay. So I replayed the game withe the Counter strategy, with only Work Ball Into Box turned on, and we concede in the 3rd minute from a set piece. I notice that my team are just gifting possession to them with long balls, so I set it to shorter passing and I noticed that our game improved a little then BAM! We concede 2 goals in less than 4 mins and we are struggling in every way in creating chances. I seriously don't know what I am doing wrong and I seriously want to improve.
 
The obvious thing would be to see WHY you were giving the ball away instead of just selecting shorter passes. Did the players have passing option on?

Try and see how the goals were scored against you.

Also, WHY were you struggling to create chances? Were there no counter opportunities? Were your playmakers marked out of the game? etc
 
WJ said:
The obvious thing would be to see WHY you were giving the ball away instead of just selecting shorter passes. Did the players have passing option on?

Try and see how the goals were scored against you.

Also, WHY were you struggling to create chances? Were there no counter opportunities? Were your playmakers marked out of the game? etc
Click to expand...
Simple. Every time the defender has the ball or with every chance against us, he just chooses to give the ball away to their defenders. The first goal was a free kick rebound, the second was after the corner was played, they regained possession and Di Maria buried it, and the third was a cross and Falcao easily headed it into the back of the net

My defenders couldn't get the ball easily from the opposition and when they do, they give it to them again. And yes my RMD was no where to be seen this game.

P.S: Do you advise watching the whole game or just extended or what?
 
What do you mean what else? Watch as much as you can to analyse what's going wrong.
 
WJ said:
What do you mean what else? Watch as much as you can to analyse what's going wrong.
Click to expand...
Oh, Something else I have noticed. My defenders are too narrow. They leave too much space for the fullbacks to drill their crosses.
 
So don't give them the time to do so. Does it really need to be said?
 
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