Recreation Tactic: Catenaccio with Libero
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I'll be making tactics with either a defensive sweeper, or a more supportive or attacking libero like Franz beckenbauer.
Try the more up to date attack minded one rather than the italy recreation, i'll post it up tonight for you.
ah, is that the 3-4-3? I was playing 3-4-3 in my last game at Dortmund, so I don't think I'll use that, thanks!
As for the other formation, had terrible results with it, probably to do with the awful players, so I'll have to try both these tactics on another game I think.
Thanks though!
As for the other formation, had terrible results with it, probably to do with the awful players, so I'll have to try both these tactics on another game I think.
Thanks though!
No problem mate, I'm going to have to update that other tactic cos I don't like it much, made it a while ago. Thanks for your feedback!
I must say I have been very impressed with some of your other recreation tactics and am looking forward to giving this one a go. I've been looking for a good, solid Italian style formation for a smaller team for a while and even tried having a go at building my own Zona Mista with limited success. I just can't get the Libero working properly so I'll be interested to see what you've done with yours. I'll probably be trying this out with Wolves to begin with and will let you know how I get on.
Keep up the good work mate.
Keep up the good work mate.
Sure, I'm posting up herrera's inter today, and i was predicted 19th in Serie A with sampdoria and came 6th, so hopefully it should be successful elsewhere
If not i'll make some tweaks! Thanks for the feedback mate.Internazionale of 1964-1967, the pinnacle of catenaccioCatenaccio predicated itself on always having a spare man in defense. It accomplished this by using man-marking; each Inter player knew who he was meant to be keeping tabs on in his half of the field. The spare man was the sweeper, for those Inter teams, Armando Picchi, cleaning up anyone who slipped their marker long enough to provide a threat.
View attachment 217032
The above is what everyone knows about catenaccio, what they think when they hear its name. But we’re renovating that entire Inter team, not just its defense. Many of the more pertinent details can be found below in the player selections themselves, but to give a sense of their overall offensive philosophy, we’ll use a quote from their coach and the system’s mastermind, Il Mago, Helenio Herrera: “In attack, all the players knew what I wanted: vertical football at great speed, with no more than three passes to get to the opponent’s box.”
They weren’t just launching balls forward with English vigor; they were picking out their passes and playing them long, something they could do with the time on the ball they were afforded in that era. In that way they’re not unlike the Ajax team discussed in this column’s last installment. The Golden Ajax squad followed close on the heels of Inter’s dominance and is credited with killing catenaccio by showing conclusively that, as Jonathan Wilson quotes it “massed defenses can be undone by massed attacks.” (Ajax also help eradicate that kind of long passing by introducing pressing to Western Europe, denying players even in deep regions time on the ball.)
View attachment 217026View attachment 217027View attachment 217028View attachment 217029View attachment 217030View attachment 217031
I should note that most of the goals conceded were at the start of the season when I was tweaking the tactic.
View attachment 217032
The above is what everyone knows about catenaccio, what they think when they hear its name. But we’re renovating that entire Inter team, not just its defense. Many of the more pertinent details can be found below in the player selections themselves, but to give a sense of their overall offensive philosophy, we’ll use a quote from their coach and the system’s mastermind, Il Mago, Helenio Herrera: “In attack, all the players knew what I wanted: vertical football at great speed, with no more than three passes to get to the opponent’s box.”
They weren’t just launching balls forward with English vigor; they were picking out their passes and playing them long, something they could do with the time on the ball they were afforded in that era. In that way they’re not unlike the Ajax team discussed in this column’s last installment. The Golden Ajax squad followed close on the heels of Inter’s dominance and is credited with killing catenaccio by showing conclusively that, as Jonathan Wilson quotes it “massed defenses can be undone by massed attacks.” (Ajax also help eradicate that kind of long passing by introducing pressing to Western Europe, denying players even in deep regions time on the ball.)
View attachment 217026View attachment 217027View attachment 217028View attachment 217029View attachment 217030View attachment 217031
I should note that most of the goals conceded were at the start of the season when I was tweaking the tactic.
I just started a new carrier with Perugia at c2. Any advices for the libero and which are the important stats? Also I have 2 amazing STs for c2 but neither of them is quick enough for a poacher. The one is a big Target Man and the other is either Trequartista or DLF. Any advice if I should tweak a bit the ST role and how?
I'd imagine a target man should work if you tell him to hold up the ball and wait for the rest of the play, and you could put your treq striker in the attacking mid role. I really hope it works for you mate.
It works very well. I found an even more amazing poacher who now I want to sell for 1mil (500k was the best offer) and he is scoring like crazy (top scorer in c2). I am currently in top 3 where in the top teams are in 1-2 points difference; and also reached the groups just before the semi-finals for the C cup.
But I tweaked your corners, set to counter and tackling is on easy. I do not know but there is no control strategy that has worked for me ever. And hard tackling with bad players results in lots of yellow and red cards, which was the reason I lost a lot of points and conceded a lot of goals. However I have the least goals conceded in the league and it is getting harder and harder to score against me.
Very good defensive strategy! Totally recommend it and I am w8ing for your new versions.
But I tweaked your corners, set to counter and tackling is on easy. I do not know but there is no control strategy that has worked for me ever. And hard tackling with bad players results in lots of yellow and red cards, which was the reason I lost a lot of points and conceded a lot of goals. However I have the least goals conceded in the league and it is getting harder and harder to score against me.
Very good defensive strategy! Totally recommend it and I am w8ing for your new versions.
Great to hear!! Could you upload the changes you made? I have a bit of trouble with corners. Will upload a couple of versions of my new style tactic which will be based on the Italian side of 82.
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It is the same like yours, just put on counter attack and easy tackling. One might put back the D-line a little deeper, but I kept it at your tick.
For the corners I use something close to this guide Football Manager 2012 set piece guide - score from corners, free-kicks and throw-ins » Football Manager Stories. But again I am tweaking the players according to their stats and I have a high player attacking the far post and 1 standing at the far post and I am defending only with the wing/full backs. The near post strategy did not work for me unfortunately.
For the corners I use something close to this guide Football Manager 2012 set piece guide - score from corners, free-kicks and throw-ins » Football Manager Stories. But again I am tweaking the players according to their stats and I have a high player attacking the far post and 1 standing at the far post and I am defending only with the wing/full backs. The near post strategy did not work for me unfortunately.
Cheers for the guide.
magnomal32
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link does not work you could re-upload? thank you very much
Joey Numbaz
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Is the file in the original post the updated tactic?
I've had great success with the Total Football tactic, looking to incorporate this one as a secondary tactic for when I'm trying to protect a lead.
I've had great success with the Total Football tactic, looking to incorporate this one as a secondary tactic for when I'm trying to protect a lead.
Hello Maxy,
any updates on the formation? Few days ago I became interested in catenaccio system, zona mista tried my hand at creating a tactic with various success and then found this thread.
I am wondering if you are still working on this formation or variations of it. Also, I have no idea how fresh is the formation linked in the OP.
Anyway, I had a look and I have few questions for you.
Why two central defenders are stoppers, as opposed to i.e. traditional defender with defend duty?
I imagine sweeper having much more free role, and yours is having no roaming and 1on1 set on. I'm having trouble making him 'work as intended', that is stay back and pick up any loose balls/cut the passes and NOT tight mark someone. Also, two defenders seem to place themselves a bit wider knowing there is sweeper behind them, it's driving me mad. : ) How would you comment on this, and how happy are you with your sweeper' settings?
May I suggest you think about including an 'inverted' version? I switched sides to all asymmetric positions in one save (as Tottenham, since they have brilliant Bale as Defensive Winger) to a pretty good success.
Well, certain positional freedom should be taken into the account. I also agree that setting Offensive Midfielder to Treqartista is somewhat good idea when you have very particular players to do the job. (in other save I had G. Rossi as treq in Villareal. Btw, Musacchio probably one of the better potential sweepers).
Did you test changing SW to LB with attacking duty? If so, share some comments. I did, but to very limited success. I cannot say that libero's roaming was hugely helpful offensively, it reminded me of ball playing defender, and it was an occasional headache defensively as he can be caught roaming nowhere to be found. Perhaps can be used with some Control/Short Passing approach, as I imagine he (att libero) would be an additional man to pass the ball to next to def midfielder. Alas, I didn't find him doing half as much as I'd imagine him to do.
Perhaps one day someone will come up with a tactic that utilizes libero in a very productive and satisfying way.
Do you use any shouts at all? I couldn't find a word about it in this thread. Perhaps they aren't that necessary since the whole tactic is very defined by the team settings anyway.
One last thing, it might be a good idea to remember about passing/tempo/mentality coordination. For example, when I play counter, I usually set D-line a bit deeper, and set passing to more direct and tempo to quick. When playing control, I like normal d-line, short passing and slow tempo. Think about it.
Overall I think you did a great job so far on this tactic as it works well defensively, and I do hope you'll continue to work on it and produce some variations.
any updates on the formation? Few days ago I became interested in catenaccio system, zona mista tried my hand at creating a tactic with various success and then found this thread.
I am wondering if you are still working on this formation or variations of it. Also, I have no idea how fresh is the formation linked in the OP.
Anyway, I had a look and I have few questions for you.
Why two central defenders are stoppers, as opposed to i.e. traditional defender with defend duty?
I imagine sweeper having much more free role, and yours is having no roaming and 1on1 set on. I'm having trouble making him 'work as intended', that is stay back and pick up any loose balls/cut the passes and NOT tight mark someone. Also, two defenders seem to place themselves a bit wider knowing there is sweeper behind them, it's driving me mad. : ) How would you comment on this, and how happy are you with your sweeper' settings?
May I suggest you think about including an 'inverted' version? I switched sides to all asymmetric positions in one save (as Tottenham, since they have brilliant Bale as Defensive Winger) to a pretty good success.
Well, certain positional freedom should be taken into the account. I also agree that setting Offensive Midfielder to Treqartista is somewhat good idea when you have very particular players to do the job. (in other save I had G. Rossi as treq in Villareal. Btw, Musacchio probably one of the better potential sweepers).
Did you test changing SW to LB with attacking duty? If so, share some comments. I did, but to very limited success. I cannot say that libero's roaming was hugely helpful offensively, it reminded me of ball playing defender, and it was an occasional headache defensively as he can be caught roaming nowhere to be found. Perhaps can be used with some Control/Short Passing approach, as I imagine he (att libero) would be an additional man to pass the ball to next to def midfielder. Alas, I didn't find him doing half as much as I'd imagine him to do.
Perhaps one day someone will come up with a tactic that utilizes libero in a very productive and satisfying way.
Do you use any shouts at all? I couldn't find a word about it in this thread. Perhaps they aren't that necessary since the whole tactic is very defined by the team settings anyway.
One last thing, it might be a good idea to remember about passing/tempo/mentality coordination. For example, when I play counter, I usually set D-line a bit deeper, and set passing to more direct and tempo to quick. When playing control, I like normal d-line, short passing and slow tempo. Think about it.
Overall I think you did a great job so far on this tactic as it works well defensively, and I do hope you'll continue to work on it and produce some variations.