The Liverpool Thread

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have a very tuff weeks playing city, utd, arsenal an swansea 9 or 10 points out of those games we will be laughing

Thing is, you depend very heavily on other clubs not picking up points. Liverpool are in easily the best form of the teams directly above them, but Chelsea and City aren't going to be caught and Arsenal are looking inexorable at the moment too. So that's three spots taken up, and then United are the wildcards in fourth. They can beat or lose to anyone, but their sheer firepower is enough to overcome their dysfunctionality at times. Then Southampton, who really needed to win today's game to stake a claim. It's very exciting, because Spurs are only a point back too.

I will remind you all you play us in the penultimate game, too. :D
 
Your run-in is no pushover, but it's doable. Only really big game in the final five is Chelsea away.

So you don't consider Southampton( 4th until today in the ranking) as a tough game??Tottenham lost points today against west ham and United against Swansea . So I think winning these ''small'' games is what gets you in the Big four!
 
So you don't consider Southampton( 4th until today in the ranking) as a tough game??Tottenham lost points today against west ham and United against Swansea . So I think winning these ''small'' games is what gets you in the Big four!

Well I might consider it a tough game if Liverpool actually played them in the final five, like I stated, but they don't. So that's literally entirely irrelevant.
 
Then that implies he'll do exactly the same, not get worse.

It also implies that if his performances change, it'll be for the worse, hence my statement. Of course that's my subjective opinion, and I might be proven wrong, but I'd be surprised.



I think you're rather overplaying the whole defensive cover aspect, particularly as Wanyama is a complete liability in defence quite a lot of the time, hence why they started playing Cork over him. Lovren managed to look like the best defender in the entire team, outshining even Fonte, who had an excellent season. Schneiderlin midfield cover did nothing for Hooiveld and Yoshida, they looked **** even with him.

£20 million isn't even that inflated for a talented young defender coming off a great year on a long contract with Premier League experience. If Gerrard is the problem, then it's hardly Lovren's fault for his own shortcomings. He wasn't a terrible signing at the time at all; he was a decent one. Of all the centre-backs brought in for less than his fee in the Prem during the summer, who can reasonably be said to be a better buy than him? Philippe Senderos? Brede Hangeland? Steven Caulker?Marcos Rojo, perhaps, but he's looked shaky at times. The only ones I can think of are Federico Fernandez and Florin Gardos, both of whom were huge punts that could have failed just as much as they could have succeeded.

I don't think I am. When buying players you have to look at the system they're playing in, and whether they'll fit the system you want them to play in. I don't think Lovren fits our bill, as his weaknesses were better hidden in Southampton than they are at Liverpool. If Gerrard is the problem - and I'm not saying he is, I'm just saying we play a completely different midfield than Southampton does - then it's Rodgers' fault for bringing Lovren in. As for your last question, I'd probably choose both Rojo and Caulker over Lovren. Bear in mind though, I haven't given up on Lovren. I want him to succeed, and I hope he does. I just don't think he'll be worth the money, and so far he obviously hasn't been.


Fine, I'm not debating whether Borini should've got a chance. I think one of Rodgers' biggest failings is that he essentially has a clique. If you're not part of it, you don't play. You only need to look at Lucas to see that. Lambert's a very fine player and he's good enough for Liverpool, just not the way he's been used.

Agreed, but I still don't see Lambert succeeding at Liverpool when we play the way we do. Of course, he was signed as a backup player, but I don't see the need for him as long as we have Borini. Count Sterling too and we already have 4 players for one striker position.


But that's a ridiculous, nonsensical argument. If you follow that to its logical extreme, for the money Palace spent on Dwight Gayle we could've acquired the next Messi for a quarter of that. Saying "we COULD'VE" got better players is 99.99999% always correct because unless you spent that £25 million LITERALLY PERFECTLY then you always could've got better players. The debate is whether they're worth what was spent on them, and most definitely in the case of Allen I'd say he is.

Well I disagree, I think Allen was (slightly) overpriced. He did well today (although he could've given away a penalty if Kevin Friend had seen what most others saw), but overall I don't think he justifies £15m. He's still fairly young though, on low wages, doesn't complain, and a good squad player, so I admit there's a case for the opposite opinion. I just don't share it.



Well yeah, that's what I said when I said that Liverpool's board idea works pretty well at the moment.

Well, isn't that the basis of this argument? Why change something that works?
 
Thing is, you depend very heavily on other clubs not picking up points. Liverpool are in easily the best form of the teams directly above them, but Chelsea and City aren't going to be caught and Arsenal are looking inexorable at the moment too. So that's three spots taken up, and then United are the wildcards in fourth. They can beat or lose to anyone, but their sheer firepower is enough to overcome their dysfunctionality at times. Then Southampton, who really needed to win today's game to stake a claim. It's very exciting, because Spurs are only a point back too.

I will remind you all you play us in the penultimate game, too. :D

utd have a very tuff few weeks coming up i can see them dropping a lot of points. agree about arsenal think they have 3rd in the bag. spurs just keep pulling points out of the bag they just wont go away.

hopefully ye will be safe by den and have nothing to play for.
 
Sorry, don't mean to invade this thread but why does everyone think arsenal have got 3rd in the bag?
 
Arsenal haven't got third in the bag. The league has been hard to call all season and that will be the case for the rest of it
 
Yeah...i don't understand all this, "Arsenal have got 3rd in the bag" non sense...3rd and 4th is still up for grabs...Only one loss/draw to any team withing 3rd-7th changes everything....
 
why was lallana booed so badly today?? former caption there since they were in league 1 and turned down offers to leave before i can understand lovren but not lallana
 
I don't think I am. When buying players you have to look at the system they're playing in, and whether they'll fit the system you want them to play in. I don't think Lovren fits our bill, as his weaknesses were better hidden in Southampton than they are at Liverpool. If Gerrard is the problem - and I'm not saying he is, I'm just saying we play a completely different midfield than Southampton does - then it's Rodgers' fault for bringing Lovren in. As for your last question, I'd probably choose both Rojo and Caulker over Lovren. Bear in mind though, I haven't given up on Lovren. I want him to succeed, and I hope he does. I just don't think he'll be worth the money, and so far he obviously hasn't been.

Systems don't really effect centre backs that much, especially not when Liverpool and Southampton play quite similar systems. Perhaps Rodgers wants his centre backs to be quite good on the ball, but Lovren's decent at that despite his other flaws. The other question is did Rodgers bring in Lovren? I'm not altogether convinced he did.

You'd choose Caulker over Lovren?! He's not even been the best defender in his own team filled with **** defenders. He's an okay player, but good lord Liverpool would be in all kinds of mess if he'd been given the minutes Lovren had.

Well I disagree, I think Allen was (slightly) overpriced. He did well today (although he could've given away a penalty if Kevin Friend had seen what most others saw), but overall I don't think he justifies £15m. He's still fairly young though, on low wages, doesn't complain, and a good squad player, so I admit there's a case for the opposite opinion. I just don't share it.

That's what £15 million gets you nowadays, when the player in question is young, British and a midfielder.

Well, isn't that the basis of this argument? Why change something that works?

The debate was whether it does work. I can see both sides of the argument really, and I think I fall rather in the middle of the Rodgers vs committee debate, much like you. It's an interesting topic though. You mentioned a DoF earlier which I found interesting, because I think that's inherently worse than a committee. A spread of people is almost always going to beat the opinion of a singular person (all other things being equal) unless that singular person is amazing. So short of Liverpool hiring one of the best talent evaluators in the world it's usually going to be a better idea to stick with the committee.

Sorry, don't mean to invade this thread but why does everyone think arsenal have got 3rd in the bag?

Not everyone does, but I do. They're in good form, they're grinding out wins when they shouldn't be (see the Palace game), their players are fit and firing, their attack is overwhelming and they've got a very easy run in. Their last 12 fixtures are:

Everton H
QPR A
W'Ham H - The first game they'd expect to drop points
Newcastle A
Liverpool H - The first game they could lose
Burnley A
Sunderland H
Chelsea H - Critical for both sides, but Arsenal at home
Hull A
Swansea H
Man Utd A
WBA H

That's a lot of winnable games, and they're already seven points clear of fourth.
 
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