The Liverpool Thread

[sunilvk7]

If u have time to read.

Klopp Given the Smallest Liverpool Squad Ever?*|*The Tomkins Times

Again that looks more like an excuse, for example he says he felt Liverpool will concede from corner or cross against Arsenal because they have some 3 CMs height advantage but none of the goals Arsenal scored are headers. They are all neatly worked goal and Giroud scoring from corner has nothing to do with height, he scored with his foot.

There are teams like West Ham, Stoke (usually), and some smaller teams who always have height advantage but no one uses that excuse. For example, in that same article it says City's average height is 180 CM and Liverpool's is 178 to 180. Never seen City using that as an excuse.

Also average height of Liverpool is 178-180 CM, and 12 out of 14 teams mentioned have average height from 180CM to 183 CM. That's just 3 CM.

That article looks just one more excuse for failing to organize defence in set pieces.

Lucas, Can, Skrtel, Lovern, Sakho all plays in the middle and all have aerial winning percentage of more than 50% to 80%.

Edit: One of the report from talk sport.
http://talksport.com/football/premi...height-smallest-tallest-2015-151111173784?p=6

Liverpool team are taller than Spurs, City, Arsenal, Everton.


One of the study was conducted in Aug 2015 and Liverpool were 8th above teams like ManUtd, ManCity, Chelsea, Spurs, Arsenal, Leicester.
http://talksport.com/football/premi...age-height-shortest-tallest-150826164225?p=12

 

[Scouseinthehouse]

Those stats are very misleading. Chance creation is very vague term. Liverpool players just shoot from ridiculous distances, that alone shoots up chance creation stats. For example, few games back Clyne tried 2 shots from very long distance, it was from clearance from corner, Clyne stayed back and he took a shot from there twice.

.....

Liverpool took 162 shots from outside the box, that's around 8 ***** per game.

Thanks for the interest in our stats.

I honestly don't know what the ratio would be from other teams. If I can be bothered to sit down and look at it all later I will but I've never been a big statistical guy. On a quick look over the last 5 league games we have around a 5 percent swing on all shots outside the box to inside from chances created. (52% outside<55>/ 47% inside <50>.).

So certainly recently it's not that disproportionate.

 

[sunilvk7]

Thanks for the interest in our stats.

I honestly don't know what the ratio would be from other teams. If I can be bothered to sit down and look at it all later I will but I've never been a big statistical guy. On a quick look over the last 5 league games we have around a 5 percent swing on all shots outside the box to inside from chances created. (52% outside<55>/ 47% inside <50>).

So certainly recently it's not that disproportionate.

Cheeky but there is nothing like our stats and your stats. All you need to do is select one more team in the drop down.

 

[Scouseinthehouse]

Cheeky but there is nothing like our stats and your stats. All you need to do is select one more team in the drop down.

Again, not got the time until I'm home to do an in-depth study. But over the last 5 league games, if you exclude the Swansea game which is a real disparity through which you had 16 shots inside the area and 3 outside, you're not that different to ourselves. Just a 6% swing between both clubs in Utd's favour shots inside and outside the box to chances created.

Including Swansea: 38 shots inside (62%)/ 23 outside. (38%.).
Excluding Swansea and taking the next game Norwich: 28 shots inside (53%)/ 25 outside. (53%).

United probably aren't a good comparison at all as you're well down on total shots and chances created regardless. And I don't know what the ratio would look like in comparison since Klopp took over without researching.

Again, certainly recently, it's not that disproportionate at all to Utd as you mentioned.

*Edit* FWIW, whenever I'm inclined to look at stats like these (which is very rarely. Much prefer the one I can trust on most things. The eye test. Stats can be manipulated often however you like), I tend to find this about the best and most commonly accepted place to go:http://www.fourfourtwo.com/statszone/results/8-2015#:TBx2g-_M45PUgA

 

[sunilvk7]

Again, not got the time until I'm home to do an in-depth study. But over the last 5 league games, if you exclude the Swansea game which is a real disparity through which you had 16 shots inside the area and 3 outside, you're not that different to ourselves. Just a 6% swing between both clubs in Utd's favour shots inside and outside the box to chances created.


Including Swansea: 38 shots inside (62%)/ 23 outside. (38%.).
Excluding Swansea and taking the next game Norwich: 28 shots inside (53%)/ 25 outside. (53%).


United probably aren't a good comparison at all as you're well down on total shots and chances created regardless. And I don't know what the ratio would look like in comparison since Klopp took over without researching.


Again, certainly recently, it's not that disproportionate at all to Utd as you mentioned.

You are talking about percentages, I'm taking about just numbers. I will post numbers after sometime.


All the numbers from Squwaka,
Vs United, total shots 19. 12 shots from outside the box. It also says 15 chances created which is laughable,
Vs Arsenal, total shots 22. 11 shots from outside the box.
Vs West Ham, total shots 23, 15 from outside the box. Chances created - 19 and that's even more laughable.
Vs Sunderland, total shots 17, 7 from outside the box.
Vs Leicester, total shots 26, 13 from outside the box.
Vs Watford, total shots 12, 5 from outside the box.
Vs WBA, total shots 28, 17 from outside the box.
Vs Newcastle, total shots 10, 5 from outside the box.
Vs Swansea, total shots 10, 2 from outside the box.
Vs City, total shots 14, 4 from outside the box.
Vs Palace, total shots 22, 7 from outside the box.
Vs Chelsea, total shots 16, 6 from outside the box,
Vs Shouthampton, total shots 15, 7 from outside the box.
Vs Spurs, total shots 12, 9 from outside the box.


Total shots: 246
Outside the box: 120

These stats itself shows how chance creation stat is very misleading. You didn't create 15 chances against United and not 19 for sure against West Ham.

 

[Scouseinthehouse]

Hey, if that's how they list 'chances created', that's how they list 'chances created.' Same goes for every team. It is what it is.

What 'worth' is in them or most stats for that matter is another issue again. Why I personally don't bother with stats much at all.

That said, going on 'how' they record these things, that's a nice swing inside to outside the box.

 

[Scouseinthehouse]

Flanagan in contention to be on the bench tomorrow. Holy heck that's a lot sooner than anyone hoped.

Excellent news after the last 19/20 months he's been through.

 

[sunilvk7]

Hey, if that's how they list 'chances created', that's how they list 'chances created.' Same goes for every team. It is what it is.
.

Yes, but when you have players like Coutinho who just shoots randomly then the stats are skewed. That's the point. So conversion rate is not the problem for Liverpool as the stats don't show the clear picture.

 

[Scouseinthehouse]

Yes, but when you have players like Coutinho who just shoots randomly then the stats are skewed. That's the point. So conversion rate is not the problem for Liverpool as the stats don't show the clear picture.

Right. So take Coutinho out of the equation and our in the box/ outside the box shots to chances created changes measurably.

But regardless, the overall point stands that had we had any semblance of a competent goalscorer playing and not injured this year, along with a competent goalkeeper, we'd be a lot better off points wise. Injuries and inferior players have masked a lot of the difference in play under Klopp than before. Which goes to the wider point as to why he's been given more of a pass as the signs are very bright for the future when a better calibre of player is out there in those areas to add to all the other good work that we've seen under him.

 

[Scouseinthehouse]

The Exeter pre-game presser. People won't like what he say's on Mingolet (Myself included but that is what it is. Still hoping they'll be a 'keeper addition in the summer to help my rationalise this. But we'll see.). He reiterates again that he has the first and final say over everything. (The 'committee' thing is getting tiresome. Rodgers has gone and we trust this guy.). Flanno and a similar team against Exeter to last time and why. And given the recent discussion, our goal creating/ lack of taking chances situation. Still no Sturridge not surprisingly and just where he's at. Which is a ways away still. Sigh.

[video=youtube;u8T976pEuJs]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u8T976pEuJs[/video]

 

[mersk]

Still hoping they'll be a 'keeper addition in the summer to help my rationalise this.

I fear that's wishful thinking. He even uses the word 'perfect' to describe him... Why don't these journalists pull up the numbers on personal mistakes leading to goals? Why don't they ask him how he feels about Liverpool fans complaining and opposition fans celebrating his renewal? Why don't they bring up his lack of control of the area? I thought they wanted headlines, that's how you get headlines.

We'll never win the league with Mignolet as first choice goalkeeper, I'm willing to bet a ******** on that. Feel free to bring up this quote in the future, I'll stand by it and even perform the procedure myself. With a rusty butter knife.

 

[Scouseinthehouse]

I fear that's wishful thinking. He even uses the word 'perfect' to describe him... Why don't these journalists pull up the numbers on personal mistakes leading to goals? Why don't they ask him how he feels about Liverpool fans complaining and opposition fans celebrating his renewal? Why don't they bring up his lack of control of the area? I thought they wanted headlines, that's how you get headlines.

We'll never win the league with Mignolet as first choice goalkeeper, I'm willing to bet a ******** on that. Feel free to bring up this quote in the future, I'll stand by it and even perform the procedure myself. With a rusty butter knife.

With everything you and most everyone else keeps saying.

I just need something to cling to to try rationalise this or else I'd of drunk myself into an early grave the last 24 hours.

There was two lads the bus tonight discussing it and one was vainly trying to suggest that maybe we're just 'protecting our interest' by making sure we get a decent fee the summer. And his mate was like 'What f-ing interest? Who the f would give us even what we paid for him if we put him on the open market?'

This just doesn't make a lick of sense whatever way you try reason it. And I've yet to talk to anyone that is not absolutely stunned and ****** by yesterdays ridiculous announcement.

 

[ImAddicted]

I fear that's wishful thinking. He even uses the word 'perfect' to describe him... Why don't these journalists pull up the numbers on personal mistakes leading to goals? Why don't they ask him how he feels about Liverpool fans complaining and opposition fans celebrating his renewal? Why don't they bring up his lack of control of the area? I thought they wanted headlines, that's how you get headlines.

We'll never win the league with Mignolet as first choice goalkeeper, I'm willing to bet a ******** on that. Feel free to bring up this quote in the future, I'll stand by it and even perform the procedure myself. With a rusty butter knife.

Video as well please!

 

[Scouseinthehouse]

Video as well please!

Yer sadistic perv yer! :O.

 

[mersk]

With everything you and most everyone else keeps saying.

I just need something to cling to to try rationalise this or else I'd of drunk myself into an early grave the last 24 hours.

There was two lads the bus tonight discussing it and one was vainly trying to suggest that maybe we're just 'protecting our interest' by making sure we get a decent fee the summer. And his mate was like 'What f-ing interest? Who the f would give us even what we paid for him if we put him on the open market?'

This just doesn't make a lick of sense whatever way you try reason it. And I've yet to talk to anyone that is not absolutely stunned and ****** by yesterdays ridiculous announcement.

I feel ya, and I've seen others rationalising in the same way. Tying him down to make sure we get a decent fee, or tying him down to make sure we have a better backup than Bogdan when we go for a new keeper in the summer. But that guy on the bus is right you know, no one is willing to offer what we paid for him, and even if we get a low offer from a lower table team they would never be able (willing) to match his wages. I'm not sure what they are, but I've seen the figure £60k p/w mentioned a lot - on his last contract. So to guesstimate, I'd throw the number £75k p/w out. Could be less, could be more, but no one is gonna be willing to match them anyway.

Also seen a lot of people suggest this wasn't Klopp's doing, that what Rodgers said about transfers is still valid. I honestly have no idea what to believe in regards to that, but it seems clear to me there's something wrong in the decision making on a board level when we refuse to strengthen our most vulnerable position. "Klopp has titles on his CV, he would never accept a contract like the one Rodgers described." I want to believe that, but that means it was in fact his decision to renew Mignolet's contract. Which results in a lose/lose situation: Either Klopp doesn't have the last word, which is retarded - or Klopp is responsible for this ****.

If I had to guess, I'd assume it is on him. Weidenfeller wasn't exactly a world class goalkeeper either, but he kept him on. And Klopp has said himself he prefers to develop what he has rather than go out and buy a new team. But no, it doesn't make sense when he's by far our weakest link. It could probably be an indicator of Klopp's lack of pragmatism.

Video as well please!

Sure, I'll wear a bunny costume too and do it in public just to up the ante.

 

[mersk]

Remember that time when we scored more goals than we conceded? Good times. FML

View attachment 1012782

 

[Scouseinthehouse]

Very interesting piece with one of the three amigos. Keep doing it your way Peter. We'll get there eventually.

Revealed: The secrets behind Jurgen Klopp's Liverpool - Telegraph

 

[mersk]

I just read an evaluation of the 25 players bought under Rodgers, put together by the founder of LFCSCSB (Liverpool Football Club Supporters' Club Scandinavian Branch) and editor of liverpool.no

I'm just gonna paste the list in and exclude the comments after each bracket:

Success
Philippe Coutinho, Daniel Sturridge, Nathaniel Clyne

Value for money
Kolo Touré, Emre Can, Joe Gomez, Danny Ings

Has contributed/can still be a success
Simon Mignolet, Mamadou Sakho, Dejan Lovren, Alberto Moreno, James Milner, Roberto Firmino, Christian Benteke

Disappointing
Joe Allen, Oussama Assaidi, Adam Lallana, Lazar Markovic, Divock Origi

Not good enough
Fabio Borini, Luis Alberto, Iago Aspas, Tiago Ilori, Rickie Lambert

Failure
Mario Balotelli


Personally I disagree with several here.

Sturridge is a success due to his relatively low fee at the time, his passport, and his talent. But in terms of contributing, he's missed more games than he's played.

I don't think Mignolet belongs in that bracket at all. Putting Lovren there is optimistic at best.

Origi's placement is harsh, and Markovic still hasn't gotten a fair chance I feel.

But the major point here is only 3 successes out of 25. That's not shocking, it's a disgrace.

 

[Scouseinthehouse]

I remember when Solksjaer was the President of the Norwegian branch of the Supporters Club for a few years when he was at United until they finally cottoned onto it and forced him to give it up.

Fun times. .

 

[dilakh2]

I just read an evaluation of the 25 players bought under Rodgers, put together by the founder of LFCSCSB (Liverpool Football Club Supporters' Club Scandinavian Branch) and editor of liverpool.no

I'm just gonna paste the list in and exclude the comments after each bracket:

Success
Philippe Coutinho, Daniel Sturridge, Nathaniel Clyne

Value for money
Kolo Touré, Emre Can, Joe Gomez, Danny Ings

Has contributed/can still be a success
Simon Mignolet, Mamadou Sakho, Dejan Lovren, Alberto Moreno, James Milner, Roberto Firmino, Christian Benteke

Disappointing
Joe Allen, Oussama Assaidi, Adam Lallana, Lazar Markovic, Divock Origi

Not good enough
Fabio Borini, Luis Alberto, Iago Aspas, Tiago Ilori, Rickie Lambert

Failure
Mario Balotelli

Personally I disagree with several here.

Sturridge is a success due to his relatively low fee at the time, his passport, and his talent. But in terms of contributing, he's missed more games than he's played.

I don't think Mignolet belongs in that bracket at all. Putting Lovren there is optimistic at best.

Origi's placement is harsh, and Markovic still hasn't gotten a fair chance I feel.

But the major point here is only 3 successes out of 25. That's not shocking, it's a disgrace.

Eeeeesh then to top it all of rodgers contradicts himself saying he had no control of transfers despite going on record a year earlier saying he had final say. Worst Manager we have had imo, atleast woy didnt lumber us with debt.