The Manchester United Thread

[Alc]

At the time there were reports from Giggs and other coaching staff saying he had been working hard in training. The issues about his attitude that UIP mentioned were reported after LVG had left. There not gonna bash a player to the press while there coaching him. For one reason or another it's not worked out for him here. He has the ability no doubt, must be lacking something elsewhere.

Who knows? I mean you heard similar things being hinted about De Bruyne when he was sold and he has become a £60m player and the best in the EPL this season imo.

Mourinho's judgement on players has been very questionable recently. He sold off Mata to a rival club for not being able to defend and bought Fabregas! He completely isolated Moses who has been so good this season. He never gave Chalobah a chance even though he has not looked out of place at all when played this season. He continously played Ivanovic even though it was clear to my nan that he is a major liability. He marginalized best LB in the world Filipe Luis for god knows what reason.

Biggest mistakes were of course selling Lukaku and De Bruyne who have both gone onto become £60m players. Lukaku one was understandable because of off-the-pitch issues but I am seriously questioning the reasoning behind selling De Bruyne.

And look at his purchases the past 2-3 windows. The likes of Ibrahimovic, Pogba, Mhiki, Begovic, Costa and Fabregas were already all established star players so its not like he has discovered any hidden gem. Jury's still out on Baily.

 

[zzeezzy]

Can't comment on Chelsea but I'm happy with Mourinho business at United so far.

 

[Theatre of dreams]

Who knows? I mean you heard similar things being hinted about De Bruyne when he was sold and he has become a £60m player and the best in the EPL this season imo.

Mourinho's judgement on players has been very questionable recently. He sold off Mata to a rival club for not being able to defend and bought Fabregas! He completely isolated Moses who has been so good this season. He never gave Chalobah a chance even though he has not looked out of place at all when played this season. He continously played Ivanovic even though it was clear to my nan that he is a major liability. He marginalized best LB in the world Filipe Luis for god knows what reason.

Biggest mistakes were of course selling Lukaku and De Bruyne who have both gone onto become £60m players. Lukaku one was understandable because of off-the-pitch issues but I am seriously questioning the reasoning behind selling De Bruyne.

And look at his purchases the past 2-3 windows. The likes of Ibrahimovic, Pogba, Mhiki, Begovic, Costa and Fabregas were already all established star players so its not like he has discovered any hidden gem. Jury's still out on Baily.

Tbh Lukaku hasn't exactly been great at Everton. Don't know what happened with De Bruyne. And Mata asked to leave according to him and Mourinho. And like Zzeezzy said very happy with our business under Mou and Bailly has been my happiest transfer tbh.

 

[Alc]

Can't comment on Chelsea but I'm happy with Mourinho business at United so far.

Not saying much considering you purchases Pogba, Mhiki and Zlatan who are players every manager in the world would take in an instant. Does not take a genius to figure out that they are world class players.

 

[zzeezzy]

Not saying much considering you purchases Pogba, Mhiki and Zlatan who are players every manager in the world would take in an instant. Does not take a genius to figure out that they are world class players.

Maybe so but what you don't realise is that without Mourinho we wouldn't of attracted Zlatan Pogba or Mkhi most probably. Plus Bailly looks exceptionally good, early days but he looks like he's going to be our best CB for years.

 

[Alc]

Tbh Lukaku hasn't exactly been great at Everton. Don't know what happened with De Bruyne. And Mata asked to leave according to him and Mourinho. And like Zzeezzy said very happy with our business under Mou and Bailly has been my happiest transfer tbh.

Mata was forced out. What do you expect if you are not even played? Lukaku's goal scoring record for a U-23 player is superb but that was at least understandable given how much he mouthed off in the press.

 

[Tyton]

Revisionism in this thread is too **** high. When I said in the summer United need to cut their losses on Memphis, bunch of people almost came down from severe cases of mangina madness and ranted about how Memphis is the future of the club and he was only poor due to mismanagement by LVG.

Fast forward 6 months, suddenly it turns out Memphis has massive attitude problems going on since the LVG reign.

Lol.

 

[Alc]

Maybe so but what you don't realise is that without Mourinho we wouldn't of attracted Zlatan Pogba or Mkhi most probably. Plus Bailly looks exceptionally good, early days but he looks like he's going to be our best CB for years.

Maybe Zlatan but the other two hardly. This is not 2010. Mourinho is not as big of a draw anymore as he once was. Those two players came because it was Manchester United. Additonally you were the only club who could afford world record fee for Pogba and he would have preffered to return in any case.

Either way thats not the point though. Jose's judgement of talent has been questionable. The fact that he bought Zlatan, Pogba and Mhiki does not change that considering all 3 are already established stars.

 

[zzeezzy]

Maybe Zlatan but the other two hardly. This is not 2010. Mourinho is not as big of a draw anymore as he once was. Those two players came because it was Manchester United. Additonally you were the only club who could afford world record fee for Pogba and he would have preffered to return in any case.

Either way thats not the point though. Jose's judgement of talent has been questionable. The fact that he bought Zlatan, Pogba and Mhiki does not change that considering all 3 are already established stars.

Every manager has questionable judgement though, I understand you probably don't like Mourinho after last season at Chelsea but without him your club wouldn't be much, that's just the reality.

That's not a dig in any way, I just think that Mourinho deserves more respect from some Chelsea fans who seem to want to blame him for this and that when in reality one bad season out of all the other seasons he has built the success in your club is a bit sad in my opinion.

 

[Theatre of dreams]

Reports saying we will be getting 24m for Schniederlin. Very good price that all things considered.

 

[Theatre of dreams]

Watched the Benfica game. Was pretty quite for them defensively. Semedo was good going forward and blocked a few crosses when Rio Ave did venture forward. He's proper quick and good dribbler. Linderlof won all his Ariel duels. And looked good with both feet and comfortable bringing the ball out from the back. Looked to be quick enough also. Thing that I noticed most was his constant communication with his partner, and looking around to see where the oppo were and he was in the right position. A Benfica fan who was at the game posted that he waved to the fans after the match after the rest went off. Also said his agent confirmed that he will likely leave in Jan if all parties are happy.

 

[ninjaskill]

Henrikh mkhitaryan won the best Armenian player for the 7th time and 6th in a row beating out ummm... Some other less talented Armenian footballers

 

[Theatre of dreams]

Henrikh mkhitaryan won the best Armenian player for the 7th time and 6th in a row beating out ummm... Some other less talented Armenian footballers

Back in training today apparently

Also scouts in attendance saying we had a rep at the Monaco vs Caen game for Bakayoko. Who was fantastic btw! Reminded me so much of Essien and scored the winning goal also.

 

[Alc]

Every manager has questionable judgement though, I understand you probably don't like Mourinho after last season at Chelsea but without him your club wouldn't be much, that's just the reality.

That's not a dig in any way, I just think that Mourinho deserves more respect from some Chelsea fans who seem to want to blame him for this and that when in reality one bad season out of all the other seasons he has built the success in your club is a bit sad in my opinion.

And now you have gone off on a completely different tangent on how I don't like MourinhO. That has absolutely nothing to do with the very legitimate argument that I have just made and whicb every Chelsea fan has made in some form or another regardless of whether they like Mourinho or not.

 

[Theatre of dreams]

WBA have bid 18m to try hijacking Schniederlin move to Everton.

 

[Theatre of dreams]

Mourinho also sold Schurrle.

So he is into lot of outside players, gave quick look at your homegrown list for this year. It would not be wise to sell too many of your HG players(Schneiderlin, Young?, Jones/Smalling) or you end up having less senior players just like Che and City had. Rooney and Carrick arent getting any younger and are out soon.I see Carrick maybe longer in United but Rooney with his wages not. There are players coming from youth but still you never know.

Sadly United is becoming similar to City and Chelsea? that only put foregen players on the pitch.

25 Squad players (*=Home grown)
Bailly, Eric Bertrand
Blind, Daley
*Carrick, Michael
Darmian, Matteo
De Gea Quintana, David
Depay, Memphis
El-Fitouri, Sadik
Fellaini-Bakkioui, Marouane
Herrera Aguera, Ander
Ibrahimovic, Zlatan
*Johnstone, Samuel Luke
*Jones, Philip Anthony
*Lingard, Jesse Ellis
Mata Garcia, Juan Manuel
Mkhitaryan, Henrikh
*Pogba, Paul Labile
Rojo, Faustino Marcos Alberto
Romero, Sergio German
*Rooney, Wayne Mark
*Schneiderlin, Morgan
Schweinsteiger, Bastian
*Smalling, Christopher
Valencia Mosquera, Luis Antonio
*Young, Ashley Simon

Tbh its football in all over look at Barca with Ter Stegen, Mascherano, Rafhina, Suarez, Rakitic, Messi, Umtiti etc

Bayern with Martinez, Bernat, Rafhina, Costa, Lewandowski, Robben, Ribbery, Vidal, Alonso.

Least with Germany and Spain the talent is there. There just ain't enough quality British players out there and the ones that are at clubs already. At the end of the day clubs will buy the best players to compete and stay at the top. It's sad but that's how it is now with the money involved and owners being less patient. I'm fairly confident we will always have a fair amount of Home Grown players and keep our record going having them in the squad.

 

[zzeezzy]

And now you have gone off on a completely different tangent on how I don't like MourinhO. That has absolutely nothing to do with the very legitimate argument that I have just made and whicb every Chelsea fan has made in some form or another regardless of whether they like Mourinho or not.

Not really seeing your legitimate argument if I'm honest. Mourinho has always been known to buy proven quality more often than not over developing players.

Yes at Chelsea he sold De Bruyne, it was a mistake but at the time he had issues with his work rate.

Mata is a different story, Mourinho didn't feel he fit under him at the time but since coming to United and under LVG especially he has developed his defensive side of the game a whole lot better. At Chelsea when he lost the ball you would often see him not even bother tracking back half the time. Now he always seems to does it and is much more tenacious in getting back and with his defensive positional discipline generally.

Moses has had half a good season being played as a wingback, I hardly see how Mourinho can be blamed for not getting the best out of him. He doesn't even use wingbacks in his system.

He likes Ivanovic because he's done so much for him at Chelsea, whether you like it or not when you have a player who's done so much for the club you can't just chop him at the first chance. Mourinho likes physical players and that shows with why Valencia is also his first choice RB here at United.

 

[Alc]

Not really seeing your legitimate argument if I'm honest. Mourinho has always been known to buy proven quality more often than not over developing players.

Yes at Chelsea he sold De Bruyne, it was a mistake but at the time he had issues with his work rate.

Mata is a different story, Mourinho didn't feel he fit under him at the time but since coming to United and under LVG especially he has developed his defensive side of the game a whole lot better. At Chelsea when he lost the ball you would often see him not even bother tracking back half the time. Now he always seems to does it and is much more tenacious in getting back and with his defensive positional discipline generally.

Moses has had half a good season being played as a wingback, I hardly see how Mourinho can be blamed for not getting the best out of him. He doesn't even use wingbacks in his system.

He likes Ivanovic because he's done so much for him at Chelsea, whether you like it or not when you have a player who's done so much for the club you can't just chop him at the first chance. Mourinho likes physical players and that shows with why Valencia is also his first choice RB here at United.

1. Which is why I said Mourinho's record in buying players has been very questionable RECENTLY. I fully agree that he has bought more quality players than duds over the course of his career but not in the last 2-3 years.

2. No he said that De Bruyne was not dedicated enough in training or to his game. Yet as soon as he leaves, he goes and wins a cup with a non-Bayern German team and is good enough for Pep to build his side around. Not to mention being the best player in EPL this season so far. Does not strike me as a guy not dedicated to his game.

3. This is a terrible argument. Mata never tracked back at Chelsea because under most managers he was never required to. When Mourinho demanded that of him, he did track back. Plus if he has improved so fast then why could he not have done the same under Mourinho? Why did Mourinho never give him that chance? Lets not forget that Mourinho went and bought Fabregas afterwards who has pretty much the same defensive deficincies as Mata.

4. The whole point was that he marginalized and isolated a talented player who could have proved useful especially when his third season at Chelsea went to ****. Conte did not use wing backs at Chelsea initially either but he still recognized that Moses was good enough to be kept around the squad and could prove useful in a new formation which Jose never did.

5. Again a terrible argument. When said player is responsible for so many of the teams defensive deficincies then its baffling why he was not dropped. As soon as Conte dropped him, our defense has improved remarkably.

What is your explanation for why he sold Filipe Luis and Andre Schurrle? What about not giving chances to Chalobah? What about buying someone like Eto over giving Lukaku game time?

Look he may have been justified in selling these players or maybe he was not. Point is that his transfer record at Chelsea has huge question marks hanging over it.

 

[Scouseinthehouse]

.....
2. No he said that De Bruyne was not dedicated enough in training or to his game. Yet as soon as he leaves, he goes and wins a cup with a non-Bayern German team and is good enough for Pep to build his side around. Not to mention being the best player in EPL this season so far. Does not strike me as a guy not dedicated to his game.....

You have De Bruyne as the POTY through 17 games? Phew. Think he's dropped quite a bit from last seasons standards personally this year. He's coming off a very quiet few months.

 

[zzeezzy]

Look he may have been justified in selling these players or maybe he was not. Point is that his transfer record at Chelsea has huge question marks hanging over it.

You can criticise every single thing he did if you want, but when all is said and done, no one will give a **** about half of these things you are bringing up.

Will fans look back and think 'Oh no Mourinho was harsh on X, Y or Z player' or 'most successful manager our club has ever seen'. It will be the latter.

Just like with SAF, he made very questionable decisions, but no one ultimately gives a **** because he is the most successful manager our club has ever seen.

Just be happy that Mourinho brought you all that silverware and that Conte has revitalised you this season.