The Manchester United Thread

[Alcaraz]

He isn't upgrade for sure and Rooney > Mata. Mata is not arguable best player in the PL. Rooney, Aguero and RVP were better 2 seasons back, Suarez, RVP were easily better last season.

Holding club to ransom, wages won't tell you who is better player, quality on the field shows and Rooney is better than Mata except last season when Rooney hardly played but still matched Mata's stats.

Just that whole UK media wet their pants when they see a Spaniard's first touch and hype them to no end.

Perhaps I went to far by calling him the best player in the EPL but anyone can see that over the past 2 seasons, he has been better than Rooney playing in a far worse team. Not to mention he is younger and doesn't act like a tool when things don't go his way

You completely misunderstood the point about the wages. Mata is a player of comparable talent who is on half of Rooney's wages. So by getting rid of Rooney and replacing him with Mata, you significantly reduce your wages and get a player of equal ability who is younger as well. And your point about Uk's media is hilarious, it really is

Its pretty easy to see who will come off better in the deal involving a Rooney-Mata swap. Manchester United will get a world-class player who is younger and commands half the wages of the player they let go. Chelsea will get a world-class player who is nearing the end of his prime and commands huge wages and can be a total muppet if things don't suit him

 

[Alcaraz]

Stats from Transfermarkt. Not the best way to judge players but they are attacking players so at least it gives something for a start.

Rooney 11/12
46 games - 35 goals - 10 assists


12/13
46 games - 25 goals and 18 assists (including Internationals)


13/14
27 games - 11 goals and 19 assists




Mata 11/12
60 games - 13 goals and 20 assists


12/13
75 games - 22 goals and 39 assists


13/14
18 games - 1 goals and 4 assists






Rooney : 119 games - 71 goals and 47 assists (1 goal or assist per game)


Mata: 153 games - 36 goals and 63 assists (.64 goal or assists per game)




Also Rooney played behind the striker and not as lead striker.

Did you account for the fact that Mata was playing in a MUCH worse team for a large part of those two seasons often having to carry the attack on his own. Did you account for the fact that he had to contend with different managers coming and going. Did you account for the fact that he had to play behind Torres for a large part of those two seasons? Did you account for the fact that he single-handedly carried us to a FA Cup and CL?

Stats don't tell the whole story as you mentioned

 

[Tyton]

Its pretty easy to see who will come off better in the deal involving a Rooney-Mata swap. Manchester United will get a world-class player who is younger and commands half the wages of the player they let go. Chelsea will get a world-class player who is nearing the end of his prime and commands huge wages and can be a total muppet if things don't suit him

Except United doesn't need another attacking midfielder and you desperately need a striker.

 

[sunilvk7]

Perhaps I went to far by calling him the best player in the EPL but anyone can see that over the past 2 seasons, he has been better than Rooney playing in a far worse team. Not to mention he is younger and doesn't act like a tool when things don't go his way

You completely misunderstood the point about the wages. Mata is a player of comparable talent who is on half of Rooney's wages. So by getting rid of Rooney and replacing him with Mata, you significantly reduce your wages and get a player of equal ability who is younger as well. And your point about Uk's media is hilarious, it really is

Its pretty easy to see who will come off better in the deal involving a Rooney-Mata swap. Manchester United will get a world-class player who is younger and commands half the wages of the player they let go. Chelsea will get a world-class player who is nearing the end of his prime and commands huge wages and can be a total muppet if things don't suit him

That's nonsense. What ever off the field activities are with his agent, he is amazing on the field. When things don't go well there isn't a better player than Rooney to give more than 100% to help the team.

If his off field and transfer requests cloud your judgement about him as a player then I can't help. Jose is not playing Mata for his poor work rate, on the other hand we have Rooney who tracks back till our own box and I lost number of times he covered for Evra in the lB position.

Rooney impact on our club in the last 3 years is there for all to see and I posted stats to compare them. Both play deeper and no one matches Rooney's numbers playing in that position.

Being 28 year old means coming end of his peak? Hilarious man, really it is.

 

[Alcaraz]

Except United doesn't need another attacking midfielder and you desperately need a striker.

There are other options around. Rooney would be a perfect fit for sure but not at the expense of significantly strengthening United for the next 5-6 seasons by giving them Mata

 

[Alcaraz]

That's nonsense. What ever off the field activities are with his agent, he is amazing on the field. When things don't go well there isn't a better player than Rooney to give more than 100% to help the team.

If his off field and transfer requests cloud your judgement about him as a player then I can't help. Jose is not playing Mata for his poor work rate, on the other hand we have Rooney who tracks back till our own box and I lost number of times he covered for Evra in the lB position.

Rooney impact on our club in the last 3 years is there for all to see and I posted stats to compare them. Both play deeper and no one matches Rooney's numbers playing in that position.

Being 28 year old means coming end of his peak? Hilarious man, really it is.

He will be 29 in the summer which is when any deal will talk place. You are being hilarious if you think this will happen in January when we just sold De Bruyne and are challenging on all 3 fronts. So even if it his agent, fact is that he is still held your club to random and came out laughing all the way to bank. And he has done it TWICE. Frankly that doesn't bother me too much ... I am just trying to show you that in any deal which involved a Mata-Rooney swap, United will come out better for more reasons than one

I love Rooney. I love his work-rate and energy and i never said anytning against it. I think we would be 10 points clear if we got him in the summer but I would rather not let Mata go to United if that is the only way I could get him

 

[Alcaraz]

That's nonsense. What ever off the field activities are with his agent, he is amazing on the field. When things don't go well there isn't a better player than Rooney to give more than 100% to help the team.

If his off field and transfer requests cloud your judgement about him as a player then I can't help. Jose is not playing Mata for his poor work rate, on the other hand we have Rooney who tracks back till our own box and I lost number of times he covered for Evra in the lB position.

Rooney impact on our club in the last 3 years is there for all to see and I posted stats to compare them. Both play deeper and no one matches Rooney's numbers playing in that position.

Being 28 year old means coming end of his peak? Hilarious man, really it is.

And when I said that things don't go his way ... I meant off the field. Not on the field. No one is more committed than Rooney on the field ... That's pretty clear to see

 

[sunilvk7]

Did you account for the fact that Mata was playing in a MUCH worse team for a large part of those two seasons often having to carry the attack on his own. Did you account for the fact that he had to contend with different managers coming and going. Did you account for the fact that he had to play behind Torres for a large part of those two seasons? Did you account for the fact that he single-handedly carried us to a FA Cup and CL?

Stats don't tell the whole story as you mentioned

Didn't know playing with Oscar, Hazard, Ramirez, Lampard meant playing in worse team.

Singlehandedly carried you to FA cup and CL? Ok. whatever. I thought it was Chelsea's defense that won the CL.

 

[sunilvk7]

He will be 29 in the summer which is when any deal will talk place. You are being hilarious if you think this will happen in January when we just sold De Bruyne and are challenging on all 3 fronts. So even if it his agent, fact is that he is still held your club to random and came out laughing all the way to bank. And he has done it TWICE. Frankly that doesn't bother me too much ... I am just trying to show you that in any deal which involved a Mata-Rooney swap, United will come out better for more reasons than one

I love Rooney. I love his work-rate and energy and i never said anytning against it. I think we would be 10 points clear if we got him in the summer but I would rather not let Mata go to United if that is the only way I could get him

I would be gutted if we let Rooney anywhere near Chelsea/Arsenal/City or any team in the league even if that mean us signing Mata. Rooney > Mata and no one carries this ManUtd better than Rooney. He is a leader.

 

[Alcaraz]

Didn't know playing with Oscar, Hazard, Ramirez, Lampard meant playing in worse team.

Singlehandedly carried you to FA cup and CL? Ok. whatever. I thought it was Chelsea's defense that won the CL.

Nice ... He wasn't playing with Oscar or Hazard in his first season. In fact, he was playing with Malouda and Kalou. #worldclass

Not to mention he never played with a proper striker up front for the last 2 seasons. Drogba for all his CL heroics was as good as Torres otherwise. Our midfield was horribly horribly unbalanced as well. The Chelsea team was probably the worst team we ever had in the Roman era. How you can say anything otherwise is beyond me

Defense was a large part of the reason we won the CL but Mata carried our attack throughout. Man of the match in the FA Cup final. Provided the assist in the CL finals

 

[Alcaraz]

I would be gutted if we let Rooney anywhere near Chelsea/Arsenal/City or any team in the league even if that mean us signing Mata. Rooney > Mata and no one carries this ManUtd better than Rooney. He is a leader.

Fair enough if that's your opinion

 

[sunilvk7]

Nice ... He wasn't playing with Oscar or Hazard in his first season. In fact, he was playing with Malouda and Kalou. #worldclass

Not to mention he never played with a proper striker up front for the last 2 seasons. Drogba for all his CL heroics was as good as Torres otherwise. Our midfield was horribly horribly unbalanced as well. The Chelsea team was probably the worst team we ever had in the Roman era. How you can say anything otherwise is beyond me

Defense was a large part of the reason we won the CL but Mata carried our attack throughout. Man of the match in the FA Cup final. Provided the assist in the CL finals

And Rooney played with the midfield of?
Wingers like Valencia and Young?

It's not like Rooney played with world class players, it's just that he lifts everyone around him.

 

[sunilvk7]

Yeah well Young's a whole new level of joke. This season he hasn't even been that bad, but he hasn't been anything above that.

We played some odd football last year. When we had Bolasie and Zaha on the pitch and playing one up front we occasionally played some beautiful dribbling based football, but our most effective football was pretty much just Zaha or Bolasie running into the area, doing a stepover and then getting chopped down by a 34 year old centre back and Murray scoring the penalty. Zaha and Murray were definitely our two talismans in the playoffs though. When Murray went down, Zaha stepped up, and his performance in the final was as good a single performance as I've seen for a long while.

He always was a bad loser, but almost all top-level pro sportspeople are. They detest it, and that's what motivates them. Maybe Moyes is too, and Zaha beat him in a game of tiddlywinks. That's why he isn't ever played. I'm a genius, someone pay me for this revelation.



Not as medieval as what was going on in Zaha's bedroom.

yeah Young is decent and I don't mind him as a squad player. He is actually very good off the ball, makes some excellent runs too. Shame rest of his game has regressed so badly.

I have no doubt whatsoever that Zaha would have played a lot more under SAF. SAF loves wingers like Zaha who can come up with moment of magic. Shame for Zaha really as he signed for one manager and end up playing for other.

 

[Alcaraz]

And Rooney played with the midfield of?
Wingers like Valencia and Young?

It's not like Rooney played with world class players, it's just that he lifts everyone around him.

Valencia was actually one of the best wingers in the world a couple of seasons ago. Young was pretty good when he first came ... Now he is *****. You are forgetting RVP for one season. Paul 'best midfielder ever' Scholes, Carrick etc. How anyone can argue that Rooney was playing in a worse team than Mata for the past 2 seasons is beyond me. If Rooney lifts everyone around him, Mata carries them

 

[sunilvk7]

Valencia was actually one of the best wingers in the world a couple of seasons ago. Young was pretty good when he first came ... Now he is *****. You are forgetting RVP for one season. Paul 'best midfielder ever' Scholes, Carrick etc. How anyone can argue that Rooney was playing in a worse team than Mata for the past 2 seasons is beyond me. If Rooney lifts everyone around him, Mata carries them

I never said Rooney played in worse team, just that it was not significantly better.

Re your Paul 'best ever' scholes, you are ******* stupid and you keep on doing that. Once everyone calls you out you start crying that Mod is unfair or whatever ****.

Anyways to address your point, Scholes was retired and was back in Jan. He played half season and played only 16 games last season. Carrick is not a creator, he is deep midfielder.

Young was never good. He had a purple patch and nothing more. He was injured a lot too.

Valencia was beast in the second half of 2011-12 season, injured in the first half and **** from last season. One of the bst in the world? Why not if it is helping you win the Internet argument. So he was not playing with very creative players. Rooney carried ManUtd and he scored and created goals. Stats show how much Rooney was involved in scoring and creating more than Mata.

IIRC Rooney and RVP didn't even start 50% of the games together because of injuries.

Anyways Chelsea were ****, Mata was the best player in the league .Just jog on man, it's tiresome with "he carried us to FA cup and CL" when it was Drogba who was absolutely beast in KOs.

 

[Vanjagl]

Hmm, Mata is left footed, right? Maybe Moyes fancy him as Evra's successor?

 

[Tyton]

Stats show how much Rooney was involved in scoring and creating more than Mata.

Then again, Rooney plays in front of actual striker.

 

[sunilvk7]

Then again, Rooney plays in front of actual striker.

And he doesn't play infront of actual midfielders or creative players but scores more even though he plays deeper.

 

[sunilvk7]

Woooooaaaahhhh.. L'Equipe reporting that ManUtd wanted to sign Cavani but Blanc Vetoed it. Might go for him again in the summer. Apparently Cavani is not impressed with the French league. Well what was he expecting when he signed..


Inbefore someone says other teams will sign him and Cavani is out of Manutd's league.

Best case scenario would be sell Rooney to PSG if he won't sign new contract and try to get Cavani. Would be amazing.

 

[Sherkey]

Best case scenario would be sell Rooney to PSG if he won't sign new contract and try to get Cavani. Would be amazing.

I seem to recall Rooney giving a statement earlier in the summer stating that he prefers to stay in England. So I'm guessing a swap deal for Cavani would be rather tough;;