[UPDATE with Tactic!] Marcelo Bielsa's philosophy

It could be very rigid, because these are actually the Bielsa's instructions and the players are following it. There should be less creative freedom I think and not so much roaming.
However I dislike how you do not copy his 2 man and 3 man defense systems. You are pretty close though according to me, and the results are impressive. Good Job.
 
insanity said:
It could be very rigid, because these are actually the Bielsa's instructions and the players are following it. There should be less creative freedom I think and not so much roaming.
However I dislike how you do not copy his 2 man and 3 man defense systems. You are pretty close though according to me, and the results are impressive. Good Job.
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Thank you for your feedback. I will take in consideration what you said for future match.
I don't really understand what you mean with "his 2 man and 3 man defense systems".
I will try to recreate his Chili tactic now. It will take a long long time because i want to continue my game with Bilbao. And it's going to be hard so don't expect great tactic with great result immediatly. Waiting for another feedback on the tactic.
 
FootballPassion said:
Thank you for your feedback. I will take in consideration what you said for future match.
I don't really understand what you mean with "his 2 man and 3 man defense systems".
I will try to recreate his Chili tactic now. It will take a long long time because i want to continue my game with Bilbao. And it's going to be hard so don't expect great tactic with great result immediatly. Waiting for another feedback on the tactic.
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I believe he means how U havent made the defense like Bielsa has it, meaning 2 man defender system vs lone striker and 3 man defense vs 2 strikers, all according to the enemy ur facing. I havent taken a look at this tactic and therefore I dont know how ur setting up ur defense.
 
Oh. Alright. I don't do this because without this the tactic is doing well and I don't know how to do this.
 
FootballPassion said:
There is a limit to closing down. I'm not sure that if you watch Bilbao play, you'll see Ituraspe closing down a CB. The tactic was set to very fluid but then i change to very rigid for some good results: - Less goal conceded.
- The closing down was more like I saw it. Each player has is own player to closing down.
With the very fluid philosophy player move too up on the pitch for the marking or closing down. It causes too much spaces at the back and then goal for your opponent.
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So what you're basically saying is that you have now made 'a good tactic' not Beilsa's tactic.....I'm not having a go, was just really looking forward to giving it a go lol! I'm impressed with it, just disagree with one element :)
 
ohembrough747 said:
So what you're basically saying is that you have now made 'a good tactic' not Beilsa's tactic.....I'm not having a go, was just really looking forward to giving it a go lol! I'm impressed with it, just disagree with one element :)
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I've create a "Good Bielsa's tactic". Which element do you disagree with ?
 
ohembrough747 said:
Looks pretty good, well done. Only have one criticism. To me, the most impressive element of the Bielsa Philosophy is that the players move with so much freedom. There is no "i'm a CM so i won't close down the opposing CB".....surely you have to set the tactic to very fluid, rather than very rigid????
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That's not true really. The fact that Bielsa's teams play attacking, high energy football, doesn't mean that there isn't structure or organisation there. Eg. if you watched the matches against ManU, there was very strict man marking in place. Bielsa's principle of having that spare man at the back allows his team to man mark, especially the midfield. Same happened in the Barcelona match a few days ago, in which Bielsa altered his shape quite drastically to match the numbers.
 
Fair enough, if i'm the only one that thinks they play with more fluidity maybe i'm wrong, didn 't mean to start an argument, just my opinion lol!
 
for me a little of everything for example bielsa with chile was a very disciplined in their positions fixed some players moving as was the case of alexis but was very upright and very destabilizing to bilbao I think it is so because the bilbao tries to defend the ball, with enough possession but with the vertigo that characterizes the insane, for me one of the most important players demarcos their athletic uncheck it again in a secret weapon on offense I'm like box to box, llorente is the target man but has a lot of movability for me would be a complete front and munian still do not know how to exploit it in this team is the player that changes pace, different player, I accomplished a lot in attack adeltando organizer making it a gang hit and return it to the main organizer but we have more suggestions bielsa of chile or this crazy bielsa of the comprta please try to create a good tactic
 
I wouldn't agree anymore with the spare man at the back. This season he has always used that 4-3-3, regardless of the amount of striker opponent has.
 
and you know how to do the most important philosophy of bielsa pressure is high in all areas of the field. how to make 2 to 1 in favor to retrieve the ball? anyone know?
 
FootballPassion said:
So, what will does it ?
Just need some explanation. [ I'm the author of the thread "Marcelo Bielsa's philosophy" ]
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Simply because it's very difficult with this ME to replicate that type of philosophy, furthermore the very rigid philosophy in your setup is completely against the philosophy and the high mentality of the 3 attacking players means they are completely isolated in defensive organization setup while in RL all the team comes back to defend except Llorente. I'm not criticising your work, just reporting about what I've seen in action.Keep up.
 
So, what do you suggest ?
Because Imo ''Fluid'' or ''very fluid'' philosophy, combined with high pressing brakes the team shape completely, and thus negates the whole man marking principle at the start.
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I'm actually working on different version of the tactic. One with 3 CB and one with 2. ( Against two and one striker )
And I try but it's quite impossible, to recreate Bielsa's tactic against Sporting Portugal few days ago. It's quite impossible because some player "cut inside" and then "hug the touchline" but I try. And in that game against Sporting, Muniain play as a CM. So, you'll see the results in a few days.
Link to ZonalMarking article: Athletic Bilbao’s movement v Sporting | Zonal Marking
( Don't know if that last tactic interest anybody except me )
 
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Keep it up Football Passion

Will be looking forward to your tactic hope its on the latest patch

Thanks

P.S. when will it be released
 
Found a decent little article that might help you mate, i'm using it atm as well as I try to implement Bielsa's style in to my Athletic save (a lot harder than it seems, trust me!)

Any ways, here's the link, includes how he lined up against Sporting other night, which has helped me some what I must say! :)

Marcelo Bielsa – Method in the Madness | chalkontheboots
 
connort787 said:
Keep it up Football Passion
Will be looking forward to your tactic hope its on the latest patch
Thanks
P.S. when will it be released
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Thanks for feedback. If you want you can test the tactic in the first post. If you have the players, you'll have good results. ;)
Of course all the tactic are and will be for the latest patch. No release date for the moment. The tactic isn't that good for the moment.

Fubz said:
Found a decent little article that might help you mate, i'm using it atm as well as I try to implement Bielsa's style in to my Athletic save (a lot harder than it seems, trust me!)
Any ways, here's the link, includes how he lined up against Sporting other night, which has helped me some what I must say! :)
Marcelo Bielsa – Method in the Madness | chalkontheboots
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I know it's hard mate. Keep it up too.
And thanks you for the link. I will read that.
 
@footballpassion, one football principle that majority of people forget about:man marking, be it with only a back four, 2 CB's or whole team, means YOU ARE GOING TO GO OUT OF YOU DEFENSIVE OR TEAM SHAPE. Just think about it; if you are a CB and following a striker on a man-marking system, even if it's only you man-marking and the striker go and hug the touchline, how do you expect to maintain the shape of your defense if you are not there?
One thing you can try and see how it goes (I've done it quite successfully) is to give your defenders a tight man-marking but with closing down on (0)zero -the reason being, if they are man-marking tight they don't need to go out of their position to close down and avoids the defense to split up while closing down too far. Hope it helps.
 
Zagallo said:
@footballpassion, one football principle that majority of people forget about:man marking, be it with only a back four, 2 CB's or whole team, means YOU ARE GOING TO GO OUT OF YOU DEFENSIVE OR TEAM SHAPE. Just think about it; if you are a CB and following a striker on a man-marking system, even if it's only you man-marking and the striker go and hug the touchline, how do you expect to maintain the shape of your defense if you are not there?
One thing you can try and see how it goes (I've done it quite successfully) is to give your defenders a tight man-marking but with closing down on (0)zero -the reason being, if they are man-marking tight they don't need to go out of their position to close down and avoids the defense to split up while closing down too far. Hope it helps.
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You're right.
For what you said about closing down on 0, I think it can be good but not for a Bielsa's tactic! Closing down is very important and high in his tactic. However, it's only what I'm thinking.
 
Anybody close to releasing a tatic yet as i want to get started on a save with Athletic.

Get back soon

Thanks
 
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