All of a sudden? Go use the search option and check the threads during the WC 2010 too.
Yeah everyone is saying Carrick is what England need just because Mike said so. :lol:
All of a sudden? Go use the search option and check the threads during the WC 2010 too.
Yeah everyone is saying Carrick is what England need just because Mike said so. :lol:
Now you're just being mean! cheers for yesterday though, it was awesome.
Bramble's a decent finisher. Look at the amount of own goals he has scored in his career.
I refuse to let it be believed I listen to Mike.
That's due to years and years of managerial incompetence and this belief in "English grit and determination" which seems to get the national team precisely nowhere. I'm pleased Carrick gets a game, but lets be fair, Lampard and Gerrard arn't going to be playing in the next WC. It'd be nice to actually get some players who are long term midfield prospects and get them to play and change the usual "boot it" philosophy when it's a tough game.
Jack Fulham
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I read an article the other day about England's cm's and there really isn't many options at the moment in the prem after Lampard and Gerrard. Yeah you can make a case for Carrick but he is also in his 30's. Wilshere is far too injury prone and I suppose Cleverly is an option. Huddlestone doesn't even start for Spurs. Then you have Rodwell, Britton, Cattermole, Jenas, Noble, Sidwell and Livermore. Are they good enough? Only two of them consistently start for there clubs. I'm sure I've missed people like Parker but he's going into deep 30's and being phased out by AVB. Roy's got 2 years to get his team right as I think we will qualify. I honestly think we weren't too bad the other night and should of really won the game but as pointed out already, reputation goes a long way with England.
I agree with Lampard not being at the next WC but I will bet my house that Gerrard will be. He will be 34 and has just been made captain, I will also bet that Terry and maybe even Cole will be there too.
Cole I wouldn't mind but Terry.... will he even be able to run by the time the next world cup comes.
All again depends how Roy wants to play, deep line then there is no one better than Terry around. He still has a massive influence in my opinion, when he is out Chelsea miss him highly.
[h=1]Tom Cleverley fits Dutch way of playing, says Roberto Martínez[/h]• Manchester United midfielder praised for technical skills
• Ability to switch positions noted by Wigan manager
Tom Cleverley played in the advanced No10 berth for England’s World Cup qualifier against Ukraine. Photograph: Ben Queenborough/BPI/Corbis
Roberto Martínez believes Tom Cleverley's ability to switch between positions is reminiscent of the "total footballer" model developed by Ajax and Holland during the 1970s.
The Manchester United midfielder has been used in a holding role by Sir Alex Ferguson this season, while Roy Hodgson played him in the advanced No10 berth for England's World Cup qualifiers against Moldova and Ukraine during the past week.
This prompted Hodgson to compare Cleverley to Cesc Fábregas, who fills the position for Barcelona and Spain. Yet Martínez took Cleverley on loan to Wigan Athletic two seasons ago and used him in a wider midfield role. The manager believes his talent would allow him to slot into the Dutch model.
"He can play in many positions and he is happy to be in one-v-one situations offensively and defensively, that's where he's got real variation," Martínez said. "Sometimes it can be a negative to be able to play in a number of positions. Some players are a jack of all trades but not special in any of them. Tom is special in what he does, while understanding other roles within the team just as well. But if you were to ask him what is his best position, I would say central midfield. And I think Manchester United always saw him as that – even while he was here."
Martínez is also impressed by how Cleverley has responded to last season's injury-disrupted campaign. "His level of performance and maturity has been incredible since his injury," he said. "And to be able to represent England and Manchester United in such a central area is an impressive achievement.
"I have said it before, when he was with us, that his tactical ability is not normal for a player of his age in this country. He is someone who could easily fit into the Dutch or Spanish way of playing quite easily, such is his technical ability and awareness."
• Ability to switch positions noted by Wigan manager
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- Jamie Jackson
- guardian.co.uk, Thursday 13 September 2012 23.00 BST
Tom Cleverley played in the advanced No10 berth for England’s World Cup qualifier against Ukraine. Photograph: Ben Queenborough/BPI/Corbis
Roberto Martínez believes Tom Cleverley's ability to switch between positions is reminiscent of the "total footballer" model developed by Ajax and Holland during the 1970s.
The Manchester United midfielder has been used in a holding role by Sir Alex Ferguson this season, while Roy Hodgson played him in the advanced No10 berth for England's World Cup qualifiers against Moldova and Ukraine during the past week.
This prompted Hodgson to compare Cleverley to Cesc Fábregas, who fills the position for Barcelona and Spain. Yet Martínez took Cleverley on loan to Wigan Athletic two seasons ago and used him in a wider midfield role. The manager believes his talent would allow him to slot into the Dutch model.
"He can play in many positions and he is happy to be in one-v-one situations offensively and defensively, that's where he's got real variation," Martínez said. "Sometimes it can be a negative to be able to play in a number of positions. Some players are a jack of all trades but not special in any of them. Tom is special in what he does, while understanding other roles within the team just as well. But if you were to ask him what is his best position, I would say central midfield. And I think Manchester United always saw him as that – even while he was here."
Martínez is also impressed by how Cleverley has responded to last season's injury-disrupted campaign. "His level of performance and maturity has been incredible since his injury," he said. "And to be able to represent England and Manchester United in such a central area is an impressive achievement.
"I have said it before, when he was with us, that his tactical ability is not normal for a player of his age in this country. He is someone who could easily fit into the Dutch or Spanish way of playing quite easily, such is his technical ability and awareness."
Tom Cleverley fits Dutch way of playing, says Roberto Martínez
• Manchester United midfielder praised for technical skills
• Ability to switch positions noted by Wigan manager
- Share0
- Jamie Jackson
- guardian.co.uk, Thursday 13 September 2012 23.00 BST
Tom Cleverley played in the advanced No10 berth for England’s World Cup qualifier against Ukraine. Photograph: Ben Queenborough/BPI/Corbis
Roberto Martínez believes Tom Cleverley's ability to switch between positions is reminiscent of the "total footballer" model developed by Ajax and Holland during the 1970s.
The Manchester United midfielder has been used in a holding role by Sir Alex Ferguson this season, while Roy Hodgson played him in the advanced No10 berth for England's World Cup qualifiers against Moldova and Ukraine during the past week.
This prompted Hodgson to compare Cleverley to Cesc Fábregas, who fills the position for Barcelona and Spain. Yet Martínez took Cleverley on loan to Wigan Athletic two seasons ago and used him in a wider midfield role. The manager believes his talent would allow him to slot into the Dutch model.
"He can play in many positions and he is happy to be in one-v-one situations offensively and defensively, that's where he's got real variation," Martínez said. "Sometimes it can be a negative to be able to play in a number of positions. Some players are a jack of all trades but not special in any of them. Tom is special in what he does, while understanding other roles within the team just as well. But if you were to ask him what is his best position, I would say central midfield. And I think Manchester United always saw him as that – even while he was here."
Martínez is also impressed by how Cleverley has responded to last season's injury-disrupted campaign. "His level of performance and maturity has been incredible since his injury," he said. "And to be able to represent England and Manchester United in such a central area is an impressive achievement.
"I have said it before, when he was with us, that his tactical ability is not normal for a player of his age in this country. He is someone who could easily fit into the Dutch or Spanish way of playing quite easily, such is his technical ability and awareness."
I agree with Martinez here, I think Cleverley can be something special playing the CM type role he does for United but no way on earth is he a "advanced no.10".
The thing I would consider doing if I was Hodgson and have a *must play Gerrard" attitude is play Gerrard in the no,10 position and drop Cleverley to the CM role like he does for United. Gerrard's passing is sloppy sometimes and you can't afford that at this level playing there in a 4-2-3-1 especially.
Dont get me wrong.. I think Carrcik is a wonderfully talented player who merits inclusion in the team however the mania around him is getting a bit silly now
It seems that whenever I come on the Thread after England perform poorly all I see is Carrick. Carrick should play or lets start a 'Play Carrcik' petition I mean seriously...
People are making it sound as if playing Carrcik would solve all our problems and enure we win all our games. Yet when we were winning games under Hodgson in Euro 2012 or beating Moldova 5-0 no one remembering Carrick at all yet raving about Gerrard's ability to transition to a deeper role or Glen Johnson's superb performances at RB
There are other players in the squad as well. The problem in my opinion is no Carrick's exclusion but Lampard-Gerrard's inclusion
Exactly my point... when we are losing games everyone remembers Carrick and endorses his inclusion in the squad. When we are winning nobody mentions him, gives me a bit of a feeling that fans have a ready-made excuse to justify England's poor performances by pointing to Carrick's exclusion
Personally I feel that 1-1 draw wtih Ukraine was just a bad day at the office. We beat them 3-1 in their country without Carrick and we can sure as **** do it without him again. Also point to note that we were missng out talisman in Rooney
Yes but the point is Carrick should be in the team if we are playing 4-2-3-1, he has been consistently good there for United and without disrespecting Gerrard and Lampard, is much more competent in the role, the amount of times I have seen Gerrard give the ball away playing this CM role for Liverpool and England is further indication as to why he should definitely not be playing in that position, why not switch him and Cleverley so Gerrard plays the no.10 role?
did you read what I just wrote? I said that Carrick deserves to be in the team.
So when we win a game we should keep being mad about the exclusion of a player who fits better? Bit of a moody outlook. It shouldn't stop us being critical of poor selections and poor performances. And it's not when we're losing games and using Carrick as an excuse, we've complained when he's excluded from squads and when he's not selected pre-match.
We've gone through Lampard/Gerrard for years and achieved nothing worth shouting about, excuse us if we're reaching the end of our tether with it and getting frustrated with constantly gimping ourselves in the name of reputation. We've watched Scholes, a superior player to both, shunted out wide and forced into retirement to fit them in. We're doing our **** best to force Carrick into retirement. So yes, I will complain when I'm forced to watch my national team give the ball away every 2nd pass to a Gerrard hollywood ball, and with Lampard going AWOL until we win a penalty, while a proven tactically able and passer is pushed aside.
When he is playing, you dont need to talk about him, because he is playing. Pretty simple. Forget the "talisman" in Rooney, he still would have struggled, as there was no midfield platform to work on. I assume you watched the game, and would therefore have realised that Gerrard was constantly in the wrong place to pick up the ball, and effective stopped playing after about 65 minutes. Lampard was better but not by much. Should have scored more (Cleverley finishing like a donkey) but we were bypassing the two deep players, because they were often in the wrong place, that is an inherent flaw, the two midfielders should be touching the ball more than any other players on the pitch.
There is no mania about Carrick. And lol about beating Moldova 5-0. The midfield was just as bad then, only Moldova were far too poor to actually do anything about it. And the only people raving about Gerrard were certain sections of Liverpool fans.
You want to play 4-2-3-1, Carrick should be playing. Or Thudd when fit, or Wilshere. Just not Lampard and Gerrard. Carrick gets mentioned because he is the best in form example of the kind of player needed. And if people cant see that, its no wonder England struggle so much.
You say his exclusion is no problem. Name me better fit and and on form English deep lying centre mid.