Pep`s Old School 4-3-3 Barcelona style

Aug 31, 2009
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I don`t care about swansea statistics. I don`t care if they have the best possesion in the EPL, i don`t care they sacked Laudrup, i don`t care what team they got and how they play, i don`t care if they recruit players from another galaxy and so on.

I`ve said it from the start : This is the closest to what Guardiola played at barca. I made it for barcelona. Works for barcelona. You get great possesion. You deny the opposition from playing by getting the ball back in upper third/mid.

It`s not trully a 4-3-3, it`s actually a 3-4-3 when attacking that shifts into a 4-5-1 when defending.

And then a guy comes and asks :

Why can`t i use this with Swansea ? which actually translates into "why am i not able to fly'?
Um, no. What you said at the start was that this tactic was brilliant and awesome and didn't need testing because it was perfect and that you were doing everyone a favour by posting it and you wanted people to thank you for posting it. THAT's what you said.

And I can't use it with Swansea because it doesn't work.

Try being more polite and engaging and friendly in your posts and people may take you a little more seriously. Pro tip there. Son.
 

Tartuffe

Member
Jan 16, 2014
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This is a good tactics with full team of really good players
With not so good players, you'll loose ball too quick and get hammered in counter attack, even if you manage to keep the ball, it will be difficult for you to have CCC if you haven't really good players.

I never succeed at making a tactic good enough to get 4+ place with southampton (maybe 10-20 attempt), but managed to create a tactic with Barcelonna which get me 29 wins / 9 draw in Ligua + Champions league in the first attempt...

I'm not saying your tactic isn't good what i'm saying is, give norwich to guardiola and he wont play like he played with barca or bayern... simply because he doesnt have the players to play that style...
 
Mar 25, 2013
310
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This is a good tactics with full team of really good players
With not so good players, you'll loose ball too quick and get hammered in counter attack, even if you manage to keep the ball, it will be difficult for you to have CCC if you haven't really good players.

I never succeed at making a tactic good enough to get 4+ place with southampton (maybe 10-20 attempt), but managed to create a tactic with Barcelonna which get me 29 wins / 9 draw in Ligua + Champions league in the first attempt...

I'm not saying your tactic isn't good what i'm saying is, give norwich to guardiola and he wont play like he played with barca or bayern... simply because he doesnt have the players to play that style...
With "not so good players" : you won`t be able to pass into space, through balls, everything will basically be intercepted => deadly counters.
you won`t be able to anticipate the forwards, meaning your defender will be caught out of position, meaning high chance to receive a goal.
wingers/IF are set to dribble. If they lack skills/speed, they`ll be pretty much useless.
And so and so on.

I`ve said it countless times that you should thinktank your tactic way before you press the button to be the manager of the team. Your playstyle should fit the players, bringing up their best stats/skills. You should not plug and play any tactic and expect to just win everything.

With this team and Barcelona, i have 30 wins in a row.

Continuing throughout the season now :D

Is there a screenshot of the tactic set up with TI ?
View attachment 509403
 

miguelalves

Member
Feb 7, 2013
672
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Congratulations, it seems you have awesome results and the concepts are on to the tactic. A few aspects though:

a) I would change your fluidity due to the 3 specialist roles you have, to fluid or balanced. This way your CWB and WB would still focus on their duty and your plamakers would focus more on connecting the defence and the attack

b) I would also remove roam from position from the playmakers because it might open gaps that the opponent will explore. If you really want to replicate Barcelona's Guardiola then you should take into account that the players didn't have freedom of movement without the ball and that every player was focused on it's own role. This said by Fabregas when asked to compare it's role in the Spain national squad and in Barcelona. So, once more, less fluidity is required.

c) Tempo is a bit tricky, in terms of FM it means how quickly the ball is moved around. If set to low or very low, the players will hold more the ball leading to being tackled and loss of possession. So, considering this, it's the opposite of what Barcelona did: the players would move the ball patiently but constantly without holding it into their feet (exception made to the IF's due to the overlapping WBs)

One doubt that I have is how do you make your players to drop deep when ever they aren't able to regain possession ? Do you use some specific man-marking ? I'm asking because of two aspects: a) people tend to forget that the style Guardiola implemented was both attacking and defensive and this is very hard or impossible to replicate in FM; b) Barcelona would start from a 433, but sometimes turned it into a 343 with the DM dropping between the CDs (easy in FM by using the HB), but when the team wasn't able to regain possession very high on the pitch, the 433 then would turn into a 4141, with the IF's dropping deeper and only Messi, as a Treq. staying higher on the pitch.
 

Tartuffe

Member
Jan 16, 2014
62
0
6
33
With "not so good players" : you won`t be able to pass into space, through balls, everything will basically be intercepted => deadly counters.
you won`t be able to anticipate the forwards, meaning your defender will be caught out of position, meaning high chance to receive a goal.
wingers/IF are set to dribble. If they lack skills/speed, they`ll be pretty much useless.
And so and so on.

I`ve said it countless times that you should thinktank your tactic way before you press the button to be the manager of the team. Your playstyle should fit the players, bringing up their best stats/skills. You should not plug and play any tactic and expect to just win everything.

With this team and Barcelona, i have 30 wins in a row.

Continuing throughout the season now :D
Yes we agree 100% but some of us just looks screenshots and feedback of users
So i let mine just to say, if you have big team ==> great tactic, if you are middle team ==> bad tactic
 
Mar 25, 2013
310
0
0
Congratulations, it seems you have awesome results and the concepts are on to the tactic. A few aspects though:

a) I would change your fluidity due to the 3 specialist roles you have, to fluid or balanced. This way your CWB and WB would still focus on their duty and your plamakers would focus more on connecting the defence and the attack

b) I would also remove roam from position from the playmakers because it might open gaps that the opponent will explore. If you really want to replicate Barcelona's Guardiola then you should take into account that the players didn't have freedom of movement without the ball and that every player was focused on it's own role. This said by Fabregas when asked to compare it's role in the Spain national squad and in Barcelona. So, once more, less fluidity is required.

c) Tempo is a bit tricky, in terms of FM it means how quickly the ball is moved around. If set to low or very low, the players will hold more the ball leading to being tackled and loss of possession. So, considering this, it's the opposite of what Barcelona did: the players would move the ball patiently but constantly without holding it into their feet (exception made to the IF's due to the overlapping WBs)

One doubt that I have is how do you make your players to drop deep when ever they aren't able to regain possession ? Do you use some specific man-marking ? I'm asking because of two aspects: a) people tend to forget that the style Guardiola implemented was both attacking and defensive and this is very hard or impossible to replicate in FM; b) Barcelona would start from a 433, but sometimes turned it into a 343 with the DM dropping between the CDs (easy in FM by using the HB), but when the team wasn't able to regain possession very high on the pitch, the 433 then would turn into a 4141, with the IF's dropping deeper and only Messi, as a Treq. staying higher on the pitch.
a) if in possesion, the wing backs will push forward directly to support the middle/if, creating triangles. Busquets drops then inbetween the back duo to provide cover. If the ball is lost, the central defs usually maintain the line, with busquets pressing to get an interception assisted by xavi, if fail another central def will come to close the angle. this is exactly what barcelona played. the wb/cwb automatically move backwards, the mid line moves defensive aswell so we basically have just messi in the opposite field.

b) no need to. Remember the times villa played as IF ? Iniesta, usually a central playmaker, would then roam out of position to assist on that left wing. There were times i could swear he was a winger, not a playmaker :) His place being taken by either busquets or the left inside forward. so when iniesta drifts out there is always a player where he used to be. :D

c) It doesn`t. You don`t lose possesion. There were games where Messi pushd on either wing, being all alone in the opposite field. He would then pass the ball backwards to Ap/DLP who would then do 2-3 passes till the ball goes back in attack. So basically it allows players time to position themselves up the pitch. The wing backs go like raging pitbulls pushing, draggind defenders out of position with IF moving center backwards.

Think i will upload a game to see the movement of the team. As far as i`m concerned, it`s perfect.

When out of possesion, the players do push forward to deny the play from the opponents. How ? close down more/easy tacke/man mark. All my upper field has these instructions, except the defenders. Why ? because they will go out to try to regain posession and leave an open space back from where they left. Its the same as dive into tackles. If the player dives, no matter he gets the ball or not, the team has -1 players on the pitch for a few seconds, which can be decisive. The goals i get are long passes from the back line over my mid/def that luckily get to a player. This translates for me in training my central defs to have more speed. That`s it. As for winning possesion, take a look at the screenshots, how do you imagine teams cannot get a single shot on/off the goal ?
 

miguelalves

Member
Feb 7, 2013
672
0
0
a) if in possesion, the wing backs will push forward directly to support the middle/if, creating triangles. Busquets drops then inbetween the back duo to provide cover. If the ball is lost, the central defs usually maintain the line, with busquets pressing to get an interception assisted by xavi, if fail another central def will come to close the angle. this is exactly what barcelona played. the wb/cwb automatically move backwards, the mid line moves defensive aswell so we basically have just messi in the opposite field.

b) no need to. Remember the times villa played as IF ? Iniesta, usually a central playmaker, would then roam out of position to assist on that left wing. There were times i could swear he was a winger, not a playmaker :) His place being taken by either busquets or the left inside forward. so when iniesta drifts out there is always a player where he used to be. :D

c) It doesn`t. You don`t lose possesion. There were games where Messi pushd on either wing, being all alone in the opposite field. He would then pass the ball backwards to Ap/DLP who would then do 2-3 passes till the ball goes back in attack. So basically it allows players time to position themselves up the pitch. The wing backs go like raging pitbulls pushing, draggind defenders out of position with IF moving center backwards.

Think i will upload a game to see the movement of the team. As far as i`m concerned, it`s perfect.

When out of possesion, the players do push forward to deny the play from the opponents. How ? close down more/easy tacke/man mark. All my upper field has these instructions, except the defenders. Why ? because they will go out to try to regain posession and leave an open space back from where they left. Its the same as dive into tackles. If the player dives, no matter he gets the ball or not, the team has -1 players on the pitch for a few seconds, which can be decisive. The goals i get are long passes from the back line over my mid/def that luckily get to a player. This translates for me in training my central defs to have more speed. That`s it. As for winning possesion, take a look at the screenshots, how do you imagine teams cannot get a single shot on/off the goal ?
All of this it's always the problem about Pep's Barcelona because there were a few different versions :D Nevertheless, I think Fabregas words are important.

As for the example of Iniesta that would be "run wide with the ball", it's what Fabregas spoke of, giving freedom of movement with the ball... not without the ball (roam from position) :)
 
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Mar 25, 2013
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Just came back home to resume my season.

First Match : Sevilla.
View attachment 415704

Slammed.

Movement at sevilla : On the ball.

Dos santos will pass to Cuenca, who will triangle with messi and go wide, receive wide after which he will pass back to the roaming AP (Sergi roberto) who will get a shot.
 
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