Was Wenger **** last ( or last 8 seasons) year when you lost points to mediocre teams? Because that's what you're saying when giving the statement Moyes is awful manager. Wenger had all money he wanted, just he didn't want to spend. Yes, Wenger isn't world class. Trophies shows that. He's not in the league with Ancelotti, Lippi, Guardiola, Mourinho and many others. He's very good manager, but he's not the manager who's management alone would bring trophies. And you have no idea about Uniteds debt, it's down to Glazers, not SAF.
The Arsenal Thread
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Was Wenger **** last ( or last 8 seasons) year when you lost points to mediocre teams? Because that's what you're saying when giving the statement Moyes is awful manager. Wenger had all money he wanted, just he didn't want to spend. Yes, Wenger isn't world class. Trophies shows that. He's not in the league with Ancelotti, Lippi, Guardiola, Mourinho and many others. He's very good manager, but he's not the manager who's management alone would bring trophies. And you have no idea about Uniteds debt, it's down to Glazers, not SAF.
success is measured in what you achieve, in football, they only way to be a success, as a manager, is to win throphies, it is that simple. if wenger wasn't well known, he would have got the sack long ago, arsenal just have underachieved constantly (except for this season, they actually look like a decent team) He is just lazy compared to his managerial peers.
The level of misunderstanding in the last few posts is ridiculous.
Please look at the amount spent on the team, and the players sold. Arsenal had a plan to get through the stadium rebuilding process, and have managed it whilst maintaining CL football. Wenger should be praised for that.
Lastly, if you want to spout half baked "facts", and decide that Wenger is lazy and Arsenal hang on to him because they like lazy underachieving managers, then I'd question how well you thought your post through.
The real 'statement' this year was made by Wenger, he needs to follow than up in January. Lets see how the team reacts before the transfer window opens in January.
Please look at the amount spent on the team, and the players sold. Arsenal had a plan to get through the stadium rebuilding process, and have managed it whilst maintaining CL football. Wenger should be praised for that.
Lastly, if you want to spout half baked "facts", and decide that Wenger is lazy and Arsenal hang on to him because they like lazy underachieving managers, then I'd question how well you thought your post through.
The real 'statement' this year was made by Wenger, he needs to follow than up in January. Lets see how the team reacts before the transfer window opens in January.
You do realise that is completely and utterly wrong about the debt right?
City never created talent they just buy it and that's just not good long-term. I didn't say they don't deserve their win but every single player from their squad is bought by a rich investor. Arsenal develop players, Mertesacker was never this good before joining
our club
our club
We need a centre-forward to provide at least depth. Giroud is on form but Bendtner will never be sufficing Backup.
Arsenal signed Mertesacker and made him better player same way City signed Silva, Aguero, Kompany, Zabaleta and made them better players.
Newcastledownunder
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The reason that Manchester United probably can't win the league is that they cannot slip up. Even slightly. If they won all of their remaining fixtures they'd get 91 points, however it's clear that they're not going to do that. So, being slightly generous and not just averaging points per game so far, if they lost 3 more games this season and drew 3 more games this season, they would get 76 points. That wouldn't be enough to win the league, and it looks like they're going to lose more than just that many games. Same with draws. ****, they lose one more game, and they would struggle to get into the Champions League. People who say Man U will win the league are kidding themselves, frankly.
Haha what. Mertesacker was already an 80+ cap international by the time Arsenal bought him. He hasn't got any better or any worse, he's as good as he ever was, which is to say very good.
The whole "they don't build talent they buy it and thus it won't work long term" is sound until you realise that Arsenal have won nothing in nearly a decade and in the same time period Chelsea - another club who did what City are doing now - have won three league titles, quite a few domestic cups and both the CL and Europa League. Even if City's approach doesn't work long term, there's no evidence to suggest that Arsenal's way is any more effective.
vlad-the-impaling-gunner
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Hahaha.
Perhaps Scotty98TR has no idea about United's debt, but it seems you don't have an inkling about Arsenal's. He didn't have 'all the money he wanted', mainly due to the stadium debt, and he's handling the club magnificently throughout his reign. He's invested in a brilliant youth academy; made some really shrewd signings and won a fair few trophies (although admittedly not in recent years)! And no, trophies aren't the only way to measure managerial ability, although they are a way of measuring it. And please don't mention Guardiola. Yes, he seems to be a top manager, but look at the teams he's managed, and for how long? He hasn't yet shown the consistency of Fergie or Wenger, so shouldn't be considered 'world class' in my opinion. And also, Mourinho may achieve trophies, but he left Inter with a side which was 'past it', so he hasn't really yet shown his long-term vision/planning either. Wenger has done brilliant to get Arsenal into the Top 4 every year, considering the amounts he's spent.
True. But the difference is that Arsenal have improved most of the players they've signed a lot more than City have improved the likes of Silva and Ag?ero, not to mention the fact that Arsenal spent a lot less on them. Just look at the flops for example - Arshavin cost Arsenal ?15 million; Robinho cost City ?32 million (and he actually didn't do as well as Arshavin when he played, either). That's the difference between a team which buys established players (e.g. Silva and Ag?ero) and a team which invests in youth/astute signings (e.g. Flamini and Ramsey)!
I'm aware of Arsenal finances, don't you worry. Wenger did have the money, he showed that with Arshavin, Podolski and Cazorla's signing. Brilliant youth academy? Jack Wilshere is one player our of their 'brilliant youth academy'. Who are other players? Yes, Wenger has excellent record with signing young players and making them good. Sure, trophies aren't the only thing that measure someone, but it's probably 90% of it. Wenger, currently, is probably the best manager if you seek security. But if you seek trophies, there are better managers. He won 10 ( or 11, I don't remember) since he joined Arsenal 17? years ago. That's not world class record if 7 of those 10 trophies are cups. Guardiola is superior manager to Wenger. In probably every way, form and shape. How could anyone argue differently is strange. He's done great job stabilizing Arsenal in last 10 years in top4, just like Moyes did with Everton, bringing them to stability and around 6/7th place. So is Moyes 'world class' because he didn't have as much money to spend as Wenger had?
Year before we signed Arshavin Wenger's transfer profit was almost 20m. So quite easily covers the Arshavin fee. He also sold Hleb the summer before Arshavin transfer which would have also covered the fee. Podolski little bit over 10m and Cazorla the same. Quite easily covered by out going transfers that summer along with Giroud...
Ashley Cole. Also youth academy isn't only about players that come through all the way. We have plenty players who've joined in their teens like Gibbs.
I'd argue that IF there weren't any sugar daddy clubs in Premier League he'd have won more by now. Before that he had great record with us and when taking into account the spending he has overachieved.
Yes some managers might be tactically better than him, but who was the one who revolutionized english game when he came here? Wenger.
Wenger is WC manager.
Quasit has pretty much said what I've wanting to say, bar a few things. Although 'Arshavin, Podolski (not sure why you've used Podolski as an example, since he only cost ?10.7 million and the likes of Oxlade-Chamberlain cost more) and Cazorla' cost quite a bit, their fees are fairly insignificant in modern football, especially considering the demand for them/their reputations when Wenger signed them. Arshavin was chased by both Bar?a and Spurs before his signing; Podolski was a proven German international who had potential and Cazorla had a great reputation in Spain for his consistency throughout the seasons before his arrival at Arsenal. When you compare the aforementioned fees to, say, the signing of Phil Jones (~?18 million), Jordan Henderson (~?20 million) or Robinho (~?32 million), they seem insignificant. And despite making a profit almost every season (in transfers alone, not to mention the financial gains for the Champions League), he's managed to average almost a trophy a season, when only teams who are spending five times the amount they spend struggle to. And on the topic of Guardiola, he's not clearly a superior manager to Wenger - he's been at the helm of two of the world's best clubs with two of their best teams' ever, and has spent a fair amount of money at both to achieve his success. Yes, his trophy count is brilliant, but he's yet to prove himself over a long period of time, which is a mark of a truly world-class manager. And Moyes isn't 'world-class' because, despite being as brilliant as Wenger in transfers, he's not managed to win any trophies - even though Wenger's transfer budget and Moyes's transfer budgets haven't been to dissimilar.
Scotty98TR
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Moyes actually has a pretty awful record when it comes to transfers. The majority of his 'big-money' (As in around ?10m and above) have flopped, and have been moved on at a loss.
Superior as in , lucky enough to take over two best teams of last 10 years? Because otherwise, Guardiola is hardly proven at all. You know who else won major trophies with that Barca team? Rijkaard. Look up where he is now. No, seriously, look up where he is now. He's literally training kids in some god forsaken place. That's the class of manager that was needed to win Champions League when Barca was at its best.
I do agree with pretty much everything, but if you want to be WC manager, you need trophies.
I don't even know what to say to this, sorry. This is bordering with statement Messi can't be best player in the world cuz he only played in Barca who was best team in the world.