The Liverpool Thread

[LFCMarshall]

Agreed. You people thinking Liverpool are better off without Gerrard seriously need to look at yourselves. I wouldn't have anyone other than him in my midfield. Those long balls he plays are just fantastic. He sometimes gives possession away, but that's a part of playing football. If you don't take risks, you don't make chances, you don't score goals, and thus, you never win the league title.

Can't wait till January, we desperately need to strengthen our squad. Been looking at the fixture list and after Spurs it's quite easy (not really easy) I reckon we had Southampton, Stoke and Sunderland somewhere in there. We'll need to exploit Southampton's defensive weaknesses and make them pay. It's a crowded fixture list, but if we are in the top half (top 8 preferably) come January, it's a good season ahead (assuming there isn't another transfer window embarrassment)

Get behind the team

We had possibly the hardest set of fixtres at the start of the season, so we have a decent run coming up.. although they will by no means be easy

however, positives to take and like you said if we are close to 6-8th come January who knows.. Not expecting January to suddenly makes us loads better in the short term but will help

 

[Aannddyy]

Lucas sits in front of the back four, Joe Allen and Sahin then push up in support of Suarez and the two wide men. I'd much rather have a team that relies on patient build up than Gerrard who constantly tries awful "hollywood" passes and loses possession in the middle of the pitch. It really is frustrating to watch, especially since Gerrard doesn't have the ability or intelligence to adapt either.

You do have a team that relies on patient build up play.. The same team that have drawn 7 of their 13 league games. Gerrard has been off form due to his injury problems but he's getting better with each game and it won't be long before he is back to his old self. If you want us to keep drawing then playing Allen - Lucas - Sahin is a perfect plan but we need a player like Gerrard if we're going to have any hope of something more than having 60% possession.

 

[Mike.]

You do have a team that relies on patient build up play.. The same team that have drawn 7 of their 13 league games. Gerrard has been off form due to his injury problems but he's getting better with each game and it won't be long before he is back to his old self. If you want us to keep drawing then playing Allen - Lucas - Sahin is a perfect plan but we need a player like Gerrard if we're going to have any hope of something more than having 60% possession.

The issue isn't chance creation but chance conversion. A Sahin/Allen/Lucas midfield keeps better possession and create chances without the unforced errors from Gerrard. What Liverpool needs is a set of wide finishers to convert them. Since Gerrard isnt a major converter any more, his importance has considerably dimmed.

Rodgers had exactly the same issues last season at Swansea

 

[zzeezzy]

The issue isn't chance creation but chance conversion. A Sahin/Allen/Lucas midfield keeps better possession and create chances without the unforced errors from Gerrard. What Liverpool needs is a set of wide finishers to convert them. Since Gerrard isnt a major converter any more, his importance has considerably dimmed.

Rodgers had exactly the same issues last season at Swansea

Is it me but has Sahin been really under-whelming so far in every aspect. Doesn't look the player that set Bundesliga alight at Dortmund. But having said that the poor lad was sitting on a bench for a year at Real Madrid.

 

[Mike.]

Is it me but has Sahin been really under-whelming so far in every aspect. Doesn't look the player that set Bundesliga alight at Dortmund. But having said that the poor lad was sitting on a bench for a year at Real Madrid.

They have him playing very differently to Dortmund, he should be the one having the freedom to play the raking passes

 

[LFCMarshall]

Is it me but has Sahin been really under-whelming so far in every aspect. Doesn't look the player that set Bundesliga alight at Dortmund. But having said that the poor lad was sitting on a bench for a year at Real Madrid.

He has missed alot of football, but so far he has looked too lightweight for the league... although its still early days for him

 

[Mike.]

He has missed alot of football, but so far he has looked too lightweight for the league... although its still early days for him

He's a DLP, and you've basically got him filling in for Lucas...

 

[redterror39]

Allen sits deep not only to cover for Lucas' role (Sahin does this as well mind) but also to make up for Gerrard's defensive incapabilities. No point going on about chance creation when we need clinical wide forwards. Hopefully Borini and Lucas come back soon, as it gives us more strength in midfield and attack. Gerrard should come off the bench when we need that a dynamic style of play, but imo he shouldn't start when we get the midfield sorted out again.

 

[LFCMarshall]

I just can't believe a player that has carried our team for years is suddenly not good enough to start

foolish.

 

[redterror39]

Gerrard kinda doesn't fit in with system the Brendan wants, for every 4 great passes me makes he loses possession far more times in crucial areas of the pitch. He also doesn't make the simple passes at the right moment sometimes and is far too direct at other times when a patient passing movement would be needed. He wouldn't start not because he is not good enough, but because his qualities aren't really beneficial to the team any more. Still, he's a valuable asset and would be needed if we needed inject some life and spirit into the game, but I soon expect Shelvey to grow into this role soon

 

[GodCubed]

I just can't believe a player that has carried our team for years is suddenly not good enough to start

foolish.

Why? The reason why the likes of Giggs and Scholes have managed old age so well is that Ferguson doesn't overplay them. The secret to prolonging a footballer's career is care and management of resources as they age.

That said, Gerrard is still good enough to start, he just shouldn't do it every week. If I were Rodgers, I'd play him behind Suarez, but what do I know...

 

[Fabio Borini]

I agree to a certain extent that Gerrard was squandering possession due to his direct "Hollywood Ball" style of play, but I have noticed that as the matches have gone by, Gerrard is starting to blend in, and now tries lesser "Hollywood Balls" than earlier and focuses on retaining possession. Our last few PL matches haven't seen us play with as much space due to the quality of our opponents.

And as I see Shelvey mentioned, I've got to say he looks like a long-term Gerrard (would be a miracle if he becomes anything like him) He's got a good shot, his style is rather direct but as he's young he can adapt to Rodgers' style. Better yet, he's strong, has a presence, has a good header in him. Now if only he could somehow play those magical passes

 

[GodCubed]

I agree to a certain extent that Gerrard was squandering possession due to his direct "Hollywood Ball" style of play, but I have noticed that as the matches have gone by, Gerrard is starting to blend in, and now tries lesser "Hollywood Balls" than earlier and focuses on retaining possession. Our last few PL matches haven't seen us play with as much space due to the quality of our opponents.

Agreed, actually. Gerrard's matured. He's still not a natural deep player, but he forces the play a lot less than before and is more patient in possession.

And as I see Shelvey mentioned, I've got to say he looks like a long-term Gerrard (would be a miracle if he becomes anything like him) He's got a good shot, his style is rather direct but as he's young he can adapt to Rodgers' style. Better yet, he's strong, has a presence, has a good header in him. Now if only he could somehow play those magical passes

I've been impressed by Shelvey too. He's not Gerrard though; if anything, he's more of a Lampard, breaking from deep and is more of a direct goal threat than a provider.

 

[TJD07]

I've been impressed by Shelvey too. He's not Gerrard though; if anything, he's more of a Lampard, breaking from deep and is more of a direct goal threat than a provider.

I was just thinking this when I read what Borini said, he plays a lot like how Lampard does. Pops up from deep, drives into the area and provides a real goal threat because he has a very decent shot on him. He's getting very good at the quick short passes too again much like Lampard.

I hate how people try to compare Lampard and Gerrard, they're two completely different players if you watch them.

 

[redterror39]

Forgive me if it seems as if I am underestimating Gerrard, I'm not. I just don't think he has the necessary qualities of a deep playing centre-mid. However he would probably be great behind Suarez with two centre-mids playig deeper to cover the defence and carry the ball forward.

 

[GodCubed]

Forgive me if it seems as if I am underestimating Gerrard, I'm not. I just don't think he has the necessary qualities of a deep playing centre-mid. However he would probably be great behind Suarez with two centre-mids playig deeper to cover the defence and carry the ball forward.

Aye, you and everyone else.

 

[LFCMarshall]

Why? The reason why the likes of Giggs and Scholes have managed old age so well is that Ferguson doesn't overplay them. The secret to prolonging a footballer's career is care and management of resources as they age.

That said, Gerrard is still good enough to start, he just shouldn't do it every week. If I were Rodgers, I'd play him behind Suarez, but what do I know...

Simply because all the things he is getting slated for.. ' giving the ball away' 'being too adventurous' with our passes

i honestly think without Gerrard it would be so Possession orientated that it would simply be more a keep ball session rather than trying to penetrate the defence of an opposition

Besides the stats dont back up what people are saying.. him and Suarez are our most creative players most games they play.. and Gerrard last 3/4 games has always achieved a high percentage of passes completed

so im just sceptical writing him off just yet, when we have no sufficient back up to come in his place, however he needs to play further up the pitch..

Forgive me if it seems as if I am underestimating Gerrard, I'm not. I just don't think he has the necessary qualities of a deep playing centre-mid. However he would probably be great behind Suarez with two centre-mids playig deeper to cover the defence and carry the ball forward.

This however, i agree with.. Which is why i'd prefer a 3 of:

Lucas - the Ball winner
Sahin/ Allen - Deep lying playmaker
Gerrard - Attacking midfielder

Hendo can be useful when we simply need a work rate in their, and the likes of shelvey are definitely one for the future

 

[Mike.]

Simply because all the things he is getting slated for.. ' giving the ball away' 'being too adventurous' with our passes

i honestly think without Gerrard it would be so Possession orientated that it would simply be more a keep ball session rather than trying to penetrate the defence of an opposition

Besides the stats dont back up what people are saying.. him and Suarez are our most creative players most games they play.. and Gerrard last 3/4 games has always achieved a high percentage of passes completed

so im just sceptical writing him off just yet, when we have no sufficient back up to come in his place, however he needs to play further up the pitch..



This however, i agree with.. Which is why i'd prefer a 3 of:

Lucas - the Ball winner
Sahin/ Allen - Deep lying playmaker
Gerrard - Attacking midfielder

Hendo can be useful when we simply need a work rate in their, and the likes of shelvey are definitely one for the future

Again creation isnt the issue for Liverpool, leaking goals and not finishing their many chances are the issues. Lucas in for Gerrard would allow Sahin to play his natural game of picking players out with raking passes, while being tighter in defence. The lack of directness is actually up front not in midfield. Gerrard really isnt indispensable, especially in a 4-3-3

 

[redterror39]

Agreed Mike, can I ask what is your opinion on Borini? I thought he was pretty good before his injury, yes he was wasteful but I put that down to a lack of confidence rather than pure finishing ability. Plus, his movement in the box is really intelligent, almost as good as Suarez. It's a shame that he lacks that yard of pace to beat his man though.

 

[GodCubed]

The lack of directness is actually up front not in midfield.

I believe that's what they're saying. Taking Gerrard out would mean that there is a lack of directness both in midfield and attack.

And to be fair, Gerrard does top Liverpool's key pass statistics. Allen, by comparison, has only made 11 to Gerrard's 36.