The Manchester United Thread

Given the prevalence of ignorance, it’s a pertinent discussion that needs talking about.
But you are not also accepting that different culture and people exist. I posted in quote text from person who was a teacher about race, ethnicity and politics who tries to explain this difference. I shall post another one then...

Nowhere I am telling who or how should be offended, please dont put words in my mouth. I understand the issue from Spanish lad view and community. But the BIG thing is that Spanish and Latin America culture and language nuances are different. Cavani understood that in EU this is not acceptable, even if it is from his cultural view. He got his warning PUBLICLY and was talked about this. This should be enough, not go on banning him from games where he makes his living.

If you are saying it unacceptable, derogatory term then it should be eradicated from every language and banned from names...

And now i am ignorant...

In Spanish, negro (feminine negra) is most commonly used for the color black, but it can also be used to describe people with dark-colored skin. In Spain, Mexico, and almost all of Latin America, negro (lower-cased, as ethnonyms are generally not capitalized in Romance languages) means just 'black colour' and it doesn't refer by itself to any ethnic or race unless further context is provided. As in English, this Spanish word is often used figuratively and negatively, to mean 'irregular' or 'undesirable', as in mercado negro ('black market'). However, in Spanish-speaking countries where there are fewer people of West African slave origin, such as Argentina and Uruguay, negro and negra are commonly used to refer to partners, close friends[22] or people in general, independent of skin color. In Venezuela the word negro is similarly used, despite its large West African slave-descended population percentage.

In certain parts of Latin America, the usage of negro to directly address black people can be colloquial. It is important to understand that this is not similar to the use of the word ***** in English in urban hip hop subculture in the United States, given that "negro" is not a racist term. For example, one might say to a friend, "Negro ¿Cómo andas? (literally 'Hey, black-one, how are you doing?'). In such a case, the diminutive negrito can also be used, as a term of endearment meaning 'pal'/'buddy'/'friend'. Negrito has thus also come to be used to refer to a person of any ethnicity or color, and also can have a sentimental or romantic connotation similar to 'sweetheart' or 'dear' in English. In other Spanish-speaking South American countries, the word negro can also be employed in a roughly equivalent term-of-endearment form, though it is not usually considered to be as widespread as in Argentina or Uruguay (except perhaps in a limited regional or social context). It is consequently occasionally encountered, due to the influence of *****, in Chicano English in the United States.


 
Interesting that you took that personally when I generalised on whites trying to tell blacks what’s offensive and what’s not and how they should feel.

You can put up as many examples of people claiming it’s a non-offensive ‘endearing’ term as much as you want mate. If you dig hard enough you can find any number of people to back any argument.

But if you can’t see how inherently offensive that is in ANY culture to anyone black (not that a white person should be any less appalled), then I’m completely at a loss here? And anyone citing it (said examples) as claiming it is acceptable is as big a part of the problem as anyone using it. Oh, and for the record, there’s inherent similarities between the Spanish and Latin cultures. ****, most of F South America is Spanish! And anyone within that culture throwing that term around needs to have a long hard look at themselves and how offensive they are being to many in their own culture. It’s wilful ignorance.

I mistakingly, without looking it into as deeply as I should have from a black/ Latino perspective, ‘excused’ Suarez down to a different cultural context and it being acceptable to him. I was wrong. A racial slur is a racial slur however the narrative is spun.

You’re trying to defend the indefensible and the saddest thing of all is that there is even a discussion to that end.
 
Scouse, racism and discrimination is only deemed to be abuse by the context it is used and by the individual it is used against. It is no different to someone taking offence at your 'nickname' here because it can be seen as insulting to the people of Liverpool and the way you have used the term to describe where you come from. What is one man's insult is another man's banter and there is no black and white solution just different shades of grey.
 
#MUAcademy U23s: #MUFC v Southampton

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Woolston; Bejger, Fish, Mengi (c), Fernandez; Helm, McCann, Puigmal, Pellistri; Shoretire, Elanga. Subs: Carney, Devine, Neville, Stanley, Hoogewerf.

Currently 1-0 to Utd. Elanga with a great goal. Took the freekick but it hit the wall but as it came back to him he hit it first time on the half volley straight into the bottom corner. Great strike! It’s been the more dangerous. Pellistri best player on the park by a mile. His dribbling is sensational and he’s deceptively quick over 10/15 yards.
 
Okay we get it...it was Racist...Cavani clearly hates black people

You being crassly flip aside mate, I would say it’s just base ignorance from him. I don’t consider him racist per se at all. Which is compounded both by his association and close friendship to Suarez. And Utd being a victim of that disgrace and their astounding, wilful ignorance in neither informing him that’s a complete no no. Or condoning it this week. Seemingly they’ve learnt nottin the past 7-years from the L’pool FC at the times shambolic mistakes.

The football clubs silence speaks VOLUMES.

As does the amount of excusing, whether innocently or not, continually going on here that’s really disappointing to see.

But I’ll leave the subject at this point as a lot patently ‘don’t get it’ and this is heading down the wrong road over the wrong argument it never should be heading down. People will only open their eyes to what they want to see and what makes them comfortable to reason with one of their own.

I get that ignorance only too well as many L’pool fans unbelievably still cling to the same to excuse the other Uruguayan rat.
 
Finished 3-1 for the u23s. Moving us up to 4th in the league. Pellistri got our 2nd after some excellent ball winning after Saints kick off for the second half. Then does like a weird turn beating 2 men afterwards he slips the ball through to Pellistri who drives towards goal then gives the keeper the eyes and puts it into the near corner. 3rd goal was from a counter which led to Puigmal drilling a shot low at the keeper who saves but then he gets it on the rebound to slot it away.

Star performers Shola Shortire (AM) youngest player on the pitch. Alvaro Fernandez (LFB) new signing from Madrid. Arnau Puigmal (CM). And MOTM Fercundo Pellistri (RW/LW)
 
You being crassly flip aside mate, I would say it’s just base ignorance from him. I don’t consider him racist per se at all. Which is compounded both by his association and close friendship to Suarez. And Utd being a victim of that disgrace and their astounding, wilful ignorance in neither informing him that’s a complete no no. Or condoning it this week. Seemingly they’ve learnt nottin the past 7-years from the L’pool FC at the times shambolic mistakes.

The football clubs silence speaks VOLUMES.

As does the amount of excusing, whether innocently or not, continually going on here that’s really disappointing to see.

But I’ll leave the subject at this point as a lot patently ‘don’t get it’ and this is heading down the wrong road over the wrong argument it never should be heading down. People will only open their eyes to what they want to see and what makes them comfortable to reason with one of their own.

I get that ignorance only too well as many L’pool fans unbelievably still cling to the same to excuse the other Uruguayan rat.

I can agree the word itself is racist and looking back, Cavani could've avoided it. What does irk me a bit is people drawing comparisons with the Suarez incident.

I won't bring up the actual incident since that's beem brought several times already. Being silent on the issue is probably better than running a campaign for Cavani or giving away tshirts. The club have been strategic with the silence given the potential length of the ban for a more ignorant post than a racist one.
 
Scouse, racism and discrimination is only deemed to be abuse by the context it is used and by the individual it is used against. It is no different to someone taking offence at your 'nickname' here because it can be seen as insulting to the people of Liverpool and the way you have used the term to describe where you come from. What is one man's insult is another man's banter and there is no black and white solution just different shades of grey.
Yep, racism is a form of discrimination. If I called my fat friend, well fat, he won't mind he'll just call me ugly or some **** and it's friendly banter. If I called random person on the street fat I'm probably insulting him.
Cavani was wrong for using Twitter to have a conversation like that with his friend. Obviously there's nothing malicious in his tweet but since we live in this day and age of SJW and people arguing just to argue ( which is nothing different than calling someone a witch 200 years ago because you didn't like the smell coming from their house) he should have known better.

You being crassly flip aside mate, I would say it’s just base ignorance from him. I don’t consider him racist per se at all. Which is compounded both by his association and close friendship to Suarez. And Utd being a victim of that disgrace and their astounding, wilful ignorance in neither informing him that’s a complete no no. Or condoning it this week. Seemingly they’ve learnt nottin the past 7-years from the L’pool FC at the times shambolic mistakes.

The football clubs silence speaks VOLUMES.

As does the amount of excusing, whether innocently or not, continually going on here that’s really disappointing to see.

But I’ll leave the subject at this point as a lot patently ‘don’t get it’ and this is heading down the wrong road over the wrong argument it never should be heading down. People will only open their eyes to what they want to see and what makes them comfortable to reason with one of their own.

I get that ignorance only too well as many L’pool fans unbelievably still cling to the same to excuse the other Uruguayan rat.

The only way to solve discrimination issue is to embrace it. To make it nothing(maybe the wrong choice of word). If you can't insult someone by saying derogatory things, then you'll stop because there's no effect. It's a ******* shame to have to use such terms just for you to feel better/attempt to belong somewhere.
It's like prohibition in USA. People will always find the way.
And it all starts with our kids, how we teach them, how we educate them. Prejudice is a thing, even from small age. I remember my aunt telling my niece that she has to be good and eat her veggies otherwise gypsies will come and they will steal her. She's really not a racist and she's one of the most beautiful people I know but my niece already had in her had the word "gypsy" and "stealing" and there's a good chance that she'll associate it with eachother. There's a cool story from Neil DeGrasse:

 
Yep, racism is a form of discrimination.......

He patently didn’t have a clue what point he was trying to make with such a ridiculous and unfounded comparison.

Good post which has been one the most understanding responses yet.
 
He patently didn’t have a clue what point he was trying to make with such a ridiculous and unfounded comparison.

Good post which has been one the most understanding responses yet.
You really don't have to use such tone. It's extremely condescending and uncalled for.
Do you really think racism and discrimination are not linked with eachother?
 
Do you really think racism and discrimination are not linked with eachother?

I think something got lost there and you literally took what I quoted from you.

I only quoted the start of your post to run off your post. I acknowledged it was a really good post mate so naturally I agree with most all you posted. Racism is discrimination period and ANY form of discrimination is totally unacceptable in whatever ‘context.’ Jokingly or not.

For anyone to remotely suggest Scouse is remotely derogatory/ offensive, let alone make the comparison to a term that’s overtly racist to many people of colour, deserved that response. It was a ridiculous comparison to try emphasis a ridiculous point.
 
United U18 line up v Liverpool


Vitek. Hughes. Bennett. Hardley. Pye. Hansen. Svidersky. Wellens. McNeil. Emeran. Hugill

Subs
Jurado. Mee. Iqbal. Garnacho. Savage

Quite a light and attacking midfield with Hansen playing deeper and McNeill set to play as a 10.

It’s 2-0 up at HT. Pool been better on the ball. But we have been clinical with our chances. Charlie Wellens with the first and Charlie McNeil with the second. Noam Emeren with both assists.
 
That’s one of the maddest, against the overall picture of the half, half-time score lines I’ve seen in a long time.

Almost complete L’pool domination, woodwork struck, great goalie saves, chances galore, and nottin to show for it.

But fair play to Utd 18’s. Albeit against the run of play, two clinical counters. Which is the only stat that ever matters so fair play to them. Can’t argue with that.

Very enjoyable, if frustrating watch. More goals in this one second half.
 
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I think something got lost there and you literally took what I quoted from you.

I only quoted the start of your post to run off your post. I acknowledged it was a really good post mate so naturally I agree with most all you posted. Racism is discrimination period and ANY form of discrimination is totally unacceptable in whatever ‘context.’ Jokingly or not.

For anyone to remotely suggest Scouse is remotely derogatory/ offensive, let alone make the comparison to a term that’s overtly racist to many people of colour, deserved that response. It was a ridiculous comparison to try emphasis a ridiculous point.
I misunderstood something then, need to keep working on my English.
Also, not all types of discrimination are the same. Racial and sexual discrimination are among the worst, if not the worst.
 
Belter game of 18’s football this between not only the two top sides at this level currently in England, but two of the best across Europe.

Quality watch.
 
I misunderstood something then, need to keep working on my English. .....

No worries. ?

I’m certainly guilty of not always appreciating that English isn’t always someone’s first language. And written English is one of the hardest languages to do/ read and understand.

What often leads to a lot of unnecessary misunderstandings that quickly develop into arguments on-line/ SM.
 
Frustrating final outcome as L’pool didn’t deserve to lose on the overall play. But that was an outstandingly boss watch between two excellently coached, top quality 18 teams that could have gone either way. As L’pool and Utd more often than not are at this age group.

Congrats to Utd. Can’t argue with clinical breakaways like that.

Two 4-3’s in 2 seasons split between both sides at this level. Fantastic game.

Belter start to the football watching weekend.
 
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