The Manchester United Thread

Legend Incredible said:
So if I read this correctly, they want a slightly higher fee from us yet agreed to something lower from west ham?

Also I feel this is West Ham’s way of telling us to pay off AWB so he can get shipped
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Exactly mate. Like how/ why. It’s ****** annoying! Why can’t we get the same deal as WH we’re gonna get.

Everyone thinks we are a soft touch and a joke in the market. Gonna take a long time for the new lot to shake 10/11 years of incompetence in the market.
 
Theatre of Dreams83 said:
Exactly mate. Like how/ why. It’s ****** annoying! Why can’t we get the same deal as WH we’re gonna get.

Everyone thinks we are a soft touch and a joke in the market. Gonna take a long time for the new lot to shake 10/11 years of incompetence in the market.
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I said it a while back that to shake off this “United tax” reputation, it’ll take a few years of missing out on a lot of transfer targets. Today, teams know they can hold firm on the valuation of a player all window and, if they’re a top target of ours, we’ll eventually cave in. I’m curious to see what happens this month to confirm if we’ve truly changed.
 
Legend Incredible said:
I said it a while back that to shake off this “United tax” reputation, it’ll take a few years of missing out on a lot of transfer targets. Today, teams know they can hold firm on the valuation of a player all window and, if they’re a top target of ours, we’ll eventually cave in. I’m curious to see what happens this month to confirm if we’ve truly changed.
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Yeah I don’t mind us walking away. As long as we don’t stump up at the end of the window. If clubs decide to lower the price then I won’t mind us going back. Shows we won’t be pushed around anymore
 
Theatre of Dreams83 said:
I must be missing something with all this weaker squad waffle 🤷🏻‍♂️
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How is it not right here, right now?

Best defender gone and replaced with an 18-year-old. (Still can’t believe Utd would be starting the season with him if not for injury.). Younger, far leas experienced version .of Martial for the back-up striker roles. Greenwood and van de Baek, albeit they rarely played, off the wage bill. And Sancho who nobody wants back in the squad. A squad that was utter S last year and finished 8th. And Utd are about to start the season, sans the new forward, with the EXACT same group of failures from last year.

Now, theres just over 3 weeks or so of the window to go so that could all change. But I’m utterly perplexed mate how, right here, right now, you don’t think an already poor, weak squad isn’t weaker by mere definition of numbers and lost experienced quality? Or how this has remotely been a good window to date for a manger hanging by a thread? 🤷🏼‍♂️
 
I agree Varane going has made us weaker at the back but let’s be honest he’s only fit half a season. But Yoro is a very good/potential top class CB and good signing. And we will likely be signing another.

Don’t know why Martial is getting any Mention he played 13 appearances mostly as a sub couldn’t be relied on at all Greenwood never featured so no loss there. And has been replaced By Zirkzee. We also have the Young lad from Arsenal who will be coming in as 3rd/ 4th choice STR with huge potential. So for me we are stronger in that department already.

DVB again not really played any football for 2 seasons so no loss. Been replaced by Collyer who looks like he’s gonna be intergrated this season like Mainoo last. Mount now fully fit who missed last season back automatically makes us stronger in Midfield. Likely another CM coming in.

On the wings even with just Sancho back and Amad fully fit that’s an upgrade to what we had last season.

Yeah I’m in no way saying it’s been a great window and tbh who was expecting one. Let’s be honest anyone with a bit of common sense/brain knew it was gonna be a rough one. With all the changes at board level down. Shifting players on who are on silly contracts and wages. Trying to shift the stain left on us by the current transfer regime that has seen us become known as a joke in this department for over 10 yrs.

All in all so far I think it’s been fairly good/decent across the board at all levels for there first summer and it will hopefully get better before the close of the window.
 
I’m still expecting Linderlof, AWB, Hannibal, Pellistri to 100% be sold this summer. There all out of contract next summer with no extension options to be triggered.

McTominey is also in his last year but the club has the + 1 yr option. So if he’s not sold this summer they will likely trigger it during the season and then sell him for whatever they can next summer. Same goes for Maguire.

Diallo is in his last year but has the + 1 year option. Anyway reports are he’s already in talks for a new 5yr deal.

Then we have Eriksen, Evans who will likely be let go on a free. Tom Heaton after this season is moving into a full time coaching role at the club so we will need a new GK in the squad next summer.

Hopefully by come start of next season we should have all the dross cleared one way or another.
 
TOD is possibly looking at things with rose coloured specs but to be honest I don't think things are as bad as certain people and the media are making it out to be. The 'failure' in the transfer market has not been the result of the current staff more a result of the total mismanagement of Glazer appointees. Bayern, Everton and the like have all tried to take the 'P' with their demands, whilst the players the club are trying to shift are being greedy (another result of Glazer appointees). Standing firm with regards to what the club is willing to pay and or demand is no different to any others. The club has players in the youth set up who given the chance will prove to save the club in the long term. Ok they may not be the standard of the Busby Babes or the Class of 92 but they were exceptional groups by any ones standards. It's going to be a tough season and would have been even if they did get the players targeted. However, getting the dross out on the non playing side was always a bigger priority I feel. I still feel that Ratcliffe was lead more by his heart than his head when making the minority purchase but at least he has started to sort out the mess. One transfer market was never going to be enough, it took 30 years last time to get things back on track after Busby left (it also took Liverpool the same length of time between League wins whilst City are only where they are due to a massive input of oil money) it hopefully won't take as long this time.
 
Theatre of Dreams83 said:
I agree Varane going has made us weaker at the back but let’s be honest he’s only fit half a season. But Yoro is a very good/potential top class CB and good signing. And we will likely be signing another.

Don’t know why Martial is getting any Mention he played 13 appearances mostly as a sub couldn’t be relied on at all Greenwood never featured so no loss there. And has been replaced By Zirkzee. We also have the Young lad from Arsenal who will be coming in as 3rd/ 4th choice STR with huge potential. So for me we are stronger in that department already.

DVB again not really played any football for 2 seasons so no loss. Been replaced by Collyer who looks like he’s gonna be intergrated this season like Mainoo last. Mount now fully fit who missed last season back automatically makes us stronger in Midfield. Likely another CM coming in.

On the wings even with just Sancho back and Amad fully fit that’s an upgrade to what we had last season.

Yeah I’m in no way saying it’s been a great window and tbh who was expecting one. Let’s be honest anyone with a bit of common sense/brain knew it was gonna be a rough one. With all the changes at board level down. Shifting players on who are on silly contracts and wages. Trying to shift the stain left on us by the current transfer regime that has seen us become known as a joke in this department for over 10 yrs.

All in all so far I think it’s been fairly good/decent across the board at all levels for there first summer and it will hopefully get better before the close of the window.
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This is why. Scars this deep are hard to heal.
 
Scouseinthehouse said:
How is it not right here, right now?

Best defender gone and replaced with an 18-year-old. (Still can’t believe Utd would be starting the season with him if not for injury.). Younger, far leas experienced version .of Martial for the back-up striker roles. Greenwood and van de Baek, albeit they rarely played, off the wage bill. And Sancho who nobody wants back in the squad. A squad that was utter S last year and finished 8th. And Utd are about to start the season, sans the new forward, with the EXACT same group of failures from last year.

Now, theres just over 3 weeks or so of the window to go so that could all change. But I’m utterly perplexed mate how, right here, right now, you don’t think an already poor, weak squad isn’t weaker by mere definition of numbers and lost experienced quality? Or how this has remotely been a good window to date for a manger hanging by a thread? 🤷🏼‍♂️
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While TOD doesn’t look at things with a bit too much optimism (I admire him for this), you got the complete 180 and paint this all doom and gloom picture: yes, the team finished 8th and we’d likely play Fulham with virtually the same 11 as last season but you fail to understand that one big reason why we finished 8th is one word “injuries”. If we had a much better injury record, we would’ve finished higher than 8th, that I can guarantee. If you pointed a gun at me and asked me to pick between an injury free season and more signings, I’d pick an injury free season everyday of the week. We won’t win the league sure but we’d do way, way better than 8th.

That said, of all the outgoing, I’d argue only Varane leaving makes us weaker. Even at that, Varane is rarely fit so what’s the point exactly? He spends more time in the physio room than the actual pitch so that just always leaves us playing with Maguire anyways. Availability is the best quality.

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You’re looking at this like it’s black and white without considering all the grey area
 
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Early team new for Comm Shield is we are without Malacia, Yoro, Hojlund. Everyone else fit. City are without Ederson and Rodri and late fitness test to De Bruyne.
 
Legend Incredible said:
While TOD doesn’t look at things with a bit too much optimism (I admire him for this), you got the complete 180 and paint this all doom and gloom picture: yes, the team finished 8th and we’d likely play Fulham with virtually the same 11 as last season but you fail to understand that one big reason why we finished 8th is one word “injuries”. If we had a much better injury record, we would’ve finished higher than 8th, that I can guarantee. If you pointed a gun at me and asked me to pick between an injury free season and more signings, I’d pick an injury free season everyday of the week. We won’t win the league sure but we’d do way, way better than 8th.

That said, of all the outgoing, I’d argue only Varane leaving makes us weaker. Even at that, Varane is rarely fit so what’s the point exactly? He spends more time in the physio room than the actual pitch so that just always leaves us playing with Maguire anyways. Availability is the best quality.

Edit:
You’re looking at this like it’s black and white without considering all the grey area
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But it's not just Varane for an inexperienced, developing kid is it?

Martial, whatever anyone thinks of him, is ay more experienced and PL proven than a player replacing him backing-up Hjolund who has no PL and exceptionally little European/ International experience. And then there's more of the same gone, and with nothing replacing them. That's just simple maths and reality.

There's no debate the squad is weaker than it was last season right now.

I won't get into the injury situation as it just exposed how P poor in quality and coaching the squad, which is virtually the same, is. The single worst and poorly coached Utd squad anyone can remember since probably early Ferguson, pre PL league. As people madly want to keep brining L'pool into things, contrast the injury situations there to not only key players, but their back-up's, for massive chunks of the season. And the title challenge they put together until 3 games from the end of the year. When you're going into the season with the same injury prone, inconsistent players, I don't get where you think the likes of Shaw will suddenly stay fit and you'll bounce up the league?

At best you could say you are in exactly the same situation as this time last summer. At best.
 
How can replacing Martial who never plays with Zirkzee who was young Serie A player of the year and in the Serie A team of the year make us weaker. Your maths isn’t adding up we probably have more numbers available for the start of the season than we did last.

We lost Varane, Williams, Kambwala, DVB, Greenwood, Martial. 3 of those only who were in the squad last season

We have replaced / returning/ Promoted Yoro, Amass, Hannibal, Pellistri, Sancho, Zirkzee, Odi, Collyer.

You could add to that Mount, Malacia, Martinez, Shaw who missed All or 90% of the season.
 
Scouseinthehouse said:
But it's not just Varane for an inexperienced, developing kid is it?

Martial, whatever anyone thinks of him, is ay more experienced and PL proven than a player replacing him backing-up Hjolund who has no PL and exceptionally little European/ International experience. And then there's more of the same gone, and with nothing replacing them. That's just simple maths and reality.

There's no debate the squad is weaker than it was last season right now.

I won't get into the injury situation as it just exposed how P poor in quality and coaching the squad, which is virtually the same, is. The single worst and poorly coached Utd squad anyone can remember since probably early Ferguson, pre PL league. As people madly want to keep brining L'pool into things, contrast the injury situations there to not only key players, but their back-up's, for massive chunks of the season. And the title challenge they put together until 3 games from the end of the year. When you're going into the season with the same injury prone, inconsistent players, I don't get where you think the likes of Shaw will suddenly stay fit and you'll bounce up the league?

At best you could say you are in exactly the same situation as this time last summer. At best.
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Your absentees weren’t out for long btw. There’s a chart put together somewhere with total games missed due to injuries categorized by each team and we’re up there with Newcastle. Mainoo was out for half the season, Martinez was out for virtually the entire season, Shaw? Well that’s self explanatory. Malacia was nowhere to be found. Varane? Also self explanatory. Maguire missed about 3-4 months, Mount missed virtually 3/4 of a season, Diallo missed half the season, Hojlund missed cumulatively half the season. Evans was injured for chucks of the season. Lindelof was missing for virtually the entire 2nd half of the season. Martial, the “PL experience” backup you’re raving about only started about how many games? 4? 5?. He’s not even fit enough to be a dependable backup

There was even a 2 week stretch where we had no fit CH and had to play Casemiro and McTominay. We also had no recognized left back for most of the season and had to play either Amrabaat or AWB (or loan signing got injured after 2 apps). Our game at Anfield against you lot? We gave an academy his starting debut and played a half fit Evans ffs. The fa cup QFs against you lot? Bruno played at CH at some point ffs

You cannot tell me your injury situation was anything close. Only clubs that can are Chelsea (they do have a bloated squad anyways) and Nenwcastle.
 
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Legend Incredible said:
Your absentees weren’t out for long btw. There’s a chart put together somewhere with total games missed due to injuries categorized by each team and we’re up there with Newcastle. Mainoo was out for half the season, Martinez was out for virtually the entire season, Shaw? Well that’s self explanatory. Malacia was nowhere to be found. Varane? Also self explanatory. Maguire missed about 3-4 months, Mount missed virtually 3/4 of a season, Diallo missed half the season, Hojlund missed cumulatively half the season. Evans was injured for chucks of the season. Lindelof was missing for virtually the entire 2nd half of the season. Martial, the “PL experience” backup you’re raving about only started about how many games? 4? 5?. He’s not even fit enough to be a dependable backup

There was even a 2 week stretch where we had no fit CH and had to play Casemiro and McTominay. We also had no recognized left back for most of the season and had to play either Amrabaat or AWB (or loan signing got injured after 2 apps). Our game at Anfield against you lot? We gave an academy his starting debut and played a half fit Evans ffs. The fa cup QFs against you lot? Bruno played at CH at some point ffs

You cannot tell me your injury situation was anything close. Only clubs that can are Chelsea (they do have a bloated squad anyways) and Nenwcastle.
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Aye? Let's recount just off the top of my head .....

We never had a fully fit squad to pick from for one game last season. Right from opening day there was someone missing.

Your 2nd best CH, who was pplaying to as high a standard as anyone in the league once more and who totally changed the dynamic of our play with his ability to carry the ball into the opposition half, goes down to an ACL and is lost for the season at the start of December. Not just injured, but ligament wiped out.

His backup Konate is then in and out with niggly injuries all year.

The LB dislocating his shoulder on International duty in one of the first breaks and is out for months.
And the Greek International backup breaking his collarbone, the very next game, when his manager falls on top of him.

Trent hyper extending his knee and being out for months ..... Kicking a football!
His backup going down to a contact injury.

Losing your goalkeeper, the best in the World, for months on end to a hammy. Your goalkeeper. Getting a bad HAMSTRING injury. Your GOALIE!

Mo and Jota, who were carrying you spark and goals wise- Mo pulling his hammy on International duty at the AFCON. Jota getting a horrible knee injury putting him out months.

Luis Diaz, altough not injured per se, having his head wrecked, at a time when he was flying early doors, by his Dad being kidnapped in the jungle!

Thiago managing one sub appearance all F year long.

We ended up playing, and beating, a full strength Chelsea side in the LC Final with 8 academy players, 4 or 5 of which were teenagers, playing through the 120 minutes. Not through choice. But through necessity. Oh, and we lost Gravenberch again for a lengthy spell through that game too.

I could go on and on. And I haven't even started with the blatant VAR disgraces that decided the league last year. But tell me again we didn't lose key players, and in many cases, their back-ups, for lengthy spells last season.

GTF out of here with **** mate.
 
Scouseinthehouse said:
Aye? Let's recount just off the top of my head .....

We never had a fully fit squad to pick from for one game last season. Right from opening day there was someone missing.

Your 2nd best CH, who was pplaying to as high a standard as anyone in the league once more and who totally changed the dynamic of our play with his ability to carry the ball into the opposition half, goes down to an ACL and is lost for the season at the start of December. Not just injured, but ligament wiped out.

His backup Konate is then in and out with niggly injuries all year.

The LB dislocating his shoulder on International duty in one of the first breaks and is out for months.
And the Greek International backup breaking his collarbone, the very next game, when his manager falls on top of him.

Trent hyper extending his knee and being out for months ..... Kicking a football!
His backup going down to a contact injury.

Losing your goalkeeper, the best in the World, for months on end to a hammy. Your goalkeeper. Getting a bad HAMSTRING injury. Your GOALIE!

Mo and Jota, who were carrying you spark and goals wise- Mo pulling his hammy on International duty at the AFCON. Jota getting a horrible knee injury putting him out months.

Luis Diaz, altough not injured per se, having his head wrecked, at a time when he was flying early doors, by his Dad being kidnapped in the jungle!

Thiago managing one sub appearance all F year long.

We ended up playing, and beating, a full strength Chelsea side in the LC Final with 8 academy players, 4 or 5 of which were teenagers, playing through the 120 minutes. Not through choice. But through necessity. Oh, and we lost Gravenberch again for a lengthy spell through that game too.

I could go on and on. And I haven't even started with the blatant VAR disgraces that decided the league last year. But tell me again we didn't lose key players, and in many cases, their back-ups, for lengthy spells last season.

GTF out of here with **** mate.
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Fair enough, I understated the severity but comparatively, you were never in a situation where you’d play Quansah and Endo as your CHs with Bradley playing at LB. 🤷🏽‍♂️

Also

We never had a fully fit squad to pick from for one game last season. Right from opening day there was someone missing.

That makes 90% of the teams in the league. I’ll up the ante and say we never fielded our strongest 11 in the entirety of last season.
 
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