Liverpool players back me, claims Hodgson

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Didn't have you down as being so negative about us Dunc. I didn't say he was a top 6 player but he could do a good job for most premiership teams. I just said it was silly that you said you would never have Lucas at Newcastle.

We are good enough to get in the top 6. Along with Spurs, Arsenal, City, Chelsea and United. Just need players to gel better and get back to full fitness and into form and we will be fine. Plus having a negative manager at the moment doesn't help.

Meh, I am don't dislike Liverpool, just when most your mates seem to be Liverpool fans and all they can talk about is how it is a disgrace that they aren't in the CL is getting tiring.

Granted, Lucas may be better than I think he is, as I only see a handful of Liverpool games, aka games on sky and CL/europa games, I am yet to see anything in those games to change my opinion of him. Maybe one day soon he will play a game shown on sky to his full potential and my opinion of him will improve, much like it did slightly improve with the game in the europa league earlier in the season where he hit a 20 yard screamer.

I think that with the continuation in inflated spending by 'top' clubs over the past few years has left pool behind a bit, but with the new FFF rules coming in, then it should make it a bit more of a level playing field. Liverpool need a sound investment in the areas of the pitch they are lacking, and definitely need a second striker to partner/back up Torres, especially when he goes through a low patch, like he is now.
 
It’s Getting Ugly: Hodgson’s Way

It’s getting ugly. Well, technically it’s been getting ugly for a while. But the Wolves debacle was the nadir of a trying season.

I hate it when people say that a performance “was the worst for 10, 20, even 40 years”. You can’t line them all up and compare at the same time. But really, that quite possibly was the worst home performance for 10, 20, maybe even 40 years. Even in the dark, dark days of Souness, I’m sure I recall us at least trying to pass the ball, even if the players (Dicks, Stewart, Molby, Barnes et al) were generally too tubby to chase after it.

It has to rank up there, not least because, in all my time watching the Reds, I’ve never seen a game at Anfield where players were so scared to take possession in their own half of the pitch; it’s been shook out of Brazilian, Spanish, Portuguese, Argentine and Dutch internationals, as well as two or three of the more technically gifted England stars.

Pass? No – get rid. But not just anywhere: into the floodlights. Into the heavens. And into their half. Wallop!

Hodge.jpg


From a total of just two long punts in last season’s fixture, Pepe Reina sent an incredible upward of 35 long-range missiles into the Wolves half the other night. So much for Spanish tiki-taka. The players were too scared to take a risk and play football, so the ball kept going back to him, and with coming short to receive the ball now a no-no, it had to go long. It was pathetic. I honestly think the following graphic in itself could constitute a sackable offence.

Reina-comarpison-vs-Wolves-last-year.jpg


At times, Glen Johnson was just kicking to touch like a rugby player; imagine Arsene Wenger managing a team doing that. Gerrard, back in his favourite central midfield position, was everywhere and nowhere at the same time. Hmmm…

Although Hodgson doesn’t have many traditional wingers to chose from, he still opted to leave out Maxi – a cultured, possession-savvy Argentine with three vital goals of late – in favour of playing a defensive midfielder on the wing. Hardly inspiring stuff, given the opposition had the worst away record in all four divisions and were bottom of the table. Hodgson spoke of not disrespecting teams by thinking Liverpool should be beating them; setting his side out to at least try would be nice.

I noted several months ago that there was an obsession with calling a team with two holding midfielders ‘negative’ (naughty Rafa) and two strikers as ‘positive’ (brave Roy; see Andy Gray before Manchester City drubbed the Reds 3-0, saying that Liverpool fans will be pleased to see this approach, rather than the one taken at the venue by Benítez, who, though Gray neglected to mention it, had gained four points from the previous two visits to the Eastlands. Er, yes, Andy, we were chuffed to bits to be stuffed 3-0).

But under Benítez – whether Gerrard was in the hole or in midfield – against teams such as Wolves, Liverpool would have two incredibly attack-minded full-backs; not the horribly average Konchesky, and not the quasi-winger Johnson hanging back for fear of a telling off from the sidelines.

If fit, there’d be Agger at centre-back, bringing the ball into midfield to change the dynamic. Kuyt, Gerrard and Torres would all feature – with the captain often in central midfield against the fodder – and basically eight of the ten outfield players had licence to get forward, around the pivot of a holding midfield and one stopper at the back. The only teams to beat Liverpool at Anfield under Benítez in the Premier League were Chelsea, Arsenal, Aston Villa and Manchester United; not the likes of Blackpool and Wolves. [Edit: Liverpool also lost to Birmingham, in November 2004. Just looking at the side that was available to Benítez makes you wonder how the **** Liverpool won the Champions League that season.]

But Hodgson couldn’t even gamble with both Maxi and Kuyt on the wings; he had to play a holding midfielder on one side, and switch Kuyt to his unfavoured side. (I know Meireles isn’t ‘just’ a holding midfielder, but then nor is Lucas, and nor was Alonso, but they had the same label.) And it’s not like Maxi and Kuyt can’t defend, either.

Even with Meireles at right-midfield – a fine passer, but not someone who’s going to play like a winger – there was still no scope for Johnson to get forward. Instead of three forward-thinking defenders (Johnson, Agger and Insua), it was just Johnson, albeit now apparently scared of crossing the halfway line.

The obsession with Gerrard in central midfield and two big strikers is Liverpool as if managed by Andy Gray. No wonder he never criticises Hodgson. We’ve gone from a manager who averaged 75 points a season and racked up four Champions League quarter-finals or better, to one who’s on course for … 46 points.

“He didn’t beat you, boss” was a line Houllier claimed a player had texted him after Rafa was sacked. Well, Hodgson – whose coaching methods were shared by the Emile Heskey-loving likes of Houllier and Sven Goran Eriksson – has already lost at home to two Premier League teams who were worse than any to win at Anfield between 2004 and 2010; and even though a second-tier team did get the better of Benítez in a domestic cup, this season a 4th-tier team triumphed on the hallowed soil. Progress, eh?

Add to that a negative goal difference, a horrific away record and the worst turn-of-year position for Liverpool since the Reds were last relegated over 50 years ago, and you can conclude that in terms of unenviable achievements, Hodgson has also beaten Benítez. By a country mile.

Style

Liverpool have a group of players who are mostly used to playing between the lines; not in straight lines. While the Reds were no Barcelona in recent years, at least they’d take the game to teams at Anfield, and at least players weren’t in regimented formations like a fusball table. In the end, as well as just one forward-thinking defender (Johnson), there were only two forward-thinking midfielders, with Lucas and Meireles unlikely to pop up in the box. Two up front? Well, what good is that if the rest of the team is so negatively constructed?

If you leave out one of your in-form attacking players (Maxi) to play a holding midfielder on the wing, and it doesn’t work, you deserve all the criticism you get. If it had been a case of the tactics working but luck against Liverpool, I could have accepted that. I can handle defeat. But the tactics were shocking, and it contributed to an awful display.

At times I find myself feeling sorry for Hodgson. Then he opens his mouth. Or then I watch us play. From a distance, it may seem like he’s been harshly treated. But the team’s lack of ideas and his lack of understanding about the Liverpool way are ‘crimes’ against our club. It’s also not the Liverpool way to publicly harangue managers, but if he doesn’t respect our traditions, then the Kop will struggle to do likewise.

No-one expected Hiddink or Mourinho to pitch up at Anfield this summer. But Pellegrini – fresh from a club-record 96 points at Real Madrid, and, as also seen with his lovely Villarreal side, a purveyor of the kind of pass-and-move football Reds have grown up on – was passed up because the club (key executives and key players) wanted to go English. Quite why, aside from parochialism and xenophobia, is beyond me.

Ah, but Hodgson was a ‘continental’, too, after such a nomadic career. Except he exported a basic, solid English 1970s approach to Scandinavia at a time when English football was strong in Europe, and he took advantage of an out-of-date fascination with the sweeper system in that part of the world. But once back in England – especially at a big club in the new Millennium – he was in effect now importing ice to the eskimos. And not even good ice at that. Meanwhile, the big clubs had moved on.

Playing like an English team from the 1970s is what plenty of struggling and fair-to-middling teams tend to do in the Premier League; although to their great credit, the likes of Wolves, Bolton, Wigan, West Brom and Blackpool are all playing a far more progressive game than that; and indeed, in the 1970s and ‘80s, Liverpool themselves were playing a continental passing game, not some basic homespun tripe. The Kop would have hated Hodgson’s tactics then, so why accept them now, when the best teams all respect a possession-based game?

If Coyle, Holloway, Di Matteo and Martinez can get humble collections of footballers playing positive, expansive football, then there’s no excuse for Hodgson failing with the current crop at Liverpool. No matter that he didn’t sign them all (though he did sign five of the first team squad and release Aquilani); it took Owen Coyle next to no time to turn Megson’s Hodgsonesque Bolton into something more Shanklyesque. By contrast, Hodgson has a squad full of stars that went to the World Cup, many of them integral to major nations, and has them chasing long balls and shadows.

Hodgson talks of a love of getting he ball quickly to the front men and midfielders then joining; in other words, pretty much the Wimbledon approach. What about passing the ball accurately into the front men having worked the ball upfield? Whatever he did at Fulham, including getting the ball up to Bobby Zamora and winning the LMA award, means nothing at Liverpool. The approach needs to be very different to a mid-table outfit. But Hodgson’s whole career has been a ‘one size fits all’ approach. It fit Fulham brilliantly. Bravo. It fits us like Fatty Arbuckle squeezing into Cheryl Cole’s bikini.

Even if he has a target-men more suited to bringing the ball down (get rid of Torres, buy Carlon Cole), being so direct will never be accepted by the Kop. This is Liverpool; this is Anfield. We don’t live in the past, and don’t expect trophies every season, but certain qualities are part of the club’s DNA.

Pass and move is one of those qualities. There are different ways to do it, but style has it been so lacking. Right now, it’s like going to a Michelin-starred restaurant, only to be served a Big Mac and charged £100 for the privilege. In Torres, Hodgson has a white truffle; the manager, it seems, would rather make use of a pickled gherkin and a ketchup sachet.

This is not to absolve Torres from blame for his sulking on the pitch, but Jesus Christ, if I’d been brought up in Spain and won every major international honour with my country, and was asked to risk blindness by staring into the floodlights to locate a snow-covered ball descending out of the haze, I’d be in a strop.

Again, I noted back in the summer that Benítez’s high-pressing style got the best out of the Liverpool no.9. In his previous two injury-ravaged seasons he was still getting a goal almost every game, even if just coming back from a six-week layoff; now we’re lucky if we get a goal a month.

If Benítez had to go, so be it. I’ve accepted that; that can’t be changed, even though we have clearly traded down.

But the longer the media continue to blame solely him for Liverpool’s woes (even though he left a team that finished with more points and more wins than the one he inherited in 2004, and had something like 15 World Cup participants), then the greater the outcry from knowledgeable fans who, whether they liked Rafa or not, know that Hodgson – with his kowtowing to ‘Sir Alex’, his disregard of the fans, his timid, gutless, artless football – is not the answer to our greatest question. No-one forces Hodgson to get so many men behind the ball, whether winning or losing. No-one forces Hodgson to have the defence sit so deep and hit the ball so long.

Mock us if you want – “they all laugh at us”, as the song says – but we know our football, and we know our club. Patrick Barclay, Paul Hayward and their cohorts may know Roy Hodgson and Fulham Football Club better than us, but we know our standards. And if such people told us that 7th place with 63 points fell below the accepted standards – sack Rafa! (they did) – then this is so far below it’s almost off the scale. Frankly, it’s an insult.

No wonder things began to get ugly on the Kop.

- Paul Tomkins
 
its a tough 1 to call to who would take over.
i agree the team lacks depth but to blame rafa on everything in the team is rubbish he spent 4.5 on poulsen who makes rafas signing lucas look superb.
and dont get me started on konchesky!!
i dont live in a dream world where i say we should be winning the title as i know we aint good enough but we should be top 6. biggest thing that got me v wolves was rafa got stick when we played kuyt on right so roy the great coach and football brain he is puts him on the left??????
did we not have cole,babel sit on bench??
 
I think that Liverpool supporters had little too high expectations in the begining. They were expecting this season a top 4 finish.
But when you look at the quality of PL teams you can see that there are about 6 teams that are stronger now.
NESV explained in the begining their plans:
"To build the team so they can compete with chelsea, manu, tottenham, city, arsenal in a couple of years". I remember reading it and all liverpool fans though it was too long time. And i understand them.
I think the owners are taking it much slower than what the fans are. This might be a reason that Hodgson is not getting sacked...(if he is not).....what do you people think about it?

Anyways, it's clear that Liverpool is underperforming and should sack Hodgson :S
 
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I think that Liverpool supporters had little too high expectations in the begining. They were expecting this season a top 4 finish.
But when you look at the quality of PL teams you can see that there are about 6 teams that are stronger now.
NESV explained in the begining their plans:
"To build the team so they can compete with chelsea, manu, tottenham, city, arsenal in a couple of years". I remember reading it and all liverpool fans though it was too long time. And i understand them.
I think the owners are taking it much slower than what the fans are. This might be a reason that Hodgson is not getting sacked...(if he is not).....what do you people think about it?

I don't think the fans expected a top 4 finish, I don't think they expected to be playing such horrid, negative football, playing hoofball to Torres who clearly doesn't want the ball like that, and buying a classy CM only to fail to utilise him on the wings.
 
I think that Liverpool supporters had little too high expectations in the begining. They were expecting this season a top 4 finish.
But when you look at the quality of PL teams you can see that there are about 6 teams that are stronger now.
NESV explained in the begining their plans:
"To build the team so they can compete with chelsea, manu, tottenham, city, arsenal in a couple of years". I remember reading it and all liverpool fans though it was too long time. And i understand them.
I think the owners are taking it much slower than what the fans are. This might be a reason that Hodgson is not getting sacked...(if he is not).....what do you people think about it?

Anyways, it's clear that Liverpool is underperforming and should sack Hodgson :S

I don't think expecting to beat Wolves and Blackpool at home is too high expectations ;)
 
I don't think expecting to beat Wolves and Blackpool at home is too high expectations ;)

No, it isn't. But i mean they were not only expecting it. They were actually expecting top 4 :) Atleast most of them. But it's clear that even if the target is mid-table, u gotta win those matches.
 
No, it isn't. But i mean they were not only expecting it. They were actually expecting top 4 :) Atleast most of them. But it's clear that even if the target is mid-table, u gotta win those matches.

Were we? Stop presuming things and find the facts, the majority wanted top 7 finish which is a correct target.
 
to be honest i have heard very few liverpool fans who wanted top 4, they wanted a good finish and good football
 
Didn't have you down as being so negative about us Dunc. I didn't say he was a top 6 player but he could do a good job for most premiership teams. I just said it was silly that you said you would never have Lucas at Newcastle.

We are good enough to get in the top 6. Along with Spurs, Arsenal, City, Chelsea and United. Just need players to gel better and get back to full fitness and into form and we will be fine. Plus having a negative manager at the moment doesn't help.

No you're not!
With the difficulty of the premier league this season and every team dropping points liverpool with their players would never have a top four finish.
torres is in bad form and doesn't score and you rely on him and gerard, look at man utd and rooney, he is arguably their best player, he hasn't scored in open play for how long,but they still win games,
He demolished blackburn but didn't score and people still criticise him.

Liverpool have a great history and were a great team, not anymore,and yes half the players would be backup players in top teams,
They are not allround molded players, they lack the stamina to play week in week out,
at the end of the day make as many excuses as you like but it comes down to a lack of quality in the squad, a lack of quality in the managerial position and a lack of hard work and luck.

If you disagree then ask yourself this, don't all those things i mentioned need to be in effect to do well in the premier league?
 
i agree 100% with that.
our coaching staff also needs shake up as we lack in that department i hate to say it but AF at man utd is a fantastic coach who has a knack of getting whatever squad to get results.
what gets me is whoever takes over at lfc seems to worry bout losing so much and i cant remember the last coach who would go attacking. we sit back and hope to break well maybe evan the mighty liverpool should learn from ian holloway and blackpool in that if u attack teams u may gain more losing that way and also gain points with goals? when we played and beat a poor poor west ham we attacked them leading 3-0 at ht whathappen 2nd half??? we sat back and went defensive?
its happend for years under rafa aswell just get a coach who belives in attacking and make at least make us a team to possibly be feared because at the moment who cant beat us??
 
No you're not!
With the difficulty of the premier league this season and every team dropping points liverpool with their players would never have a top four finish.
torres is in bad form and doesn't score and you rely on him and gerard, look at man utd and rooney, he is arguably their best player, he hasn't scored in open play for how long,but they still win games,
He demolished blackburn but didn't score and people still criticise him.

Liverpool have a great history and were a great team, not anymore,and yes half the players would be backup players in top teams,
They are not allround molded players, they lack the stamina to play week in week out,
at the end of the day make as many excuses as you like but it comes down to a lack of quality in the squad, a lack of quality in the managerial position and a lack of hard work and luck.

If you disagree then ask yourself this, don't all those things i mentioned need to be in effect to do well in the premier league?

Our current players mojorily do not care, they have no enthusiasm, determination or pride to play for Liverpool

On a brighter note Martin Broughton's getting a knighthood :wub:

The stats make grim reading for Liverpool FC manager Roy Hodgson, who last night tasted defeat for the ninth time in 29 games as Anfield boss - plunging the Reds to a 57-year low.

Wolves' win leaves Liverpool on just 22 points going into the New Year, their lowest tally at this stage of the season since 1953/54 when Don Welsh’s side was relegated.


And Kopites will remember Liverpool's Carling Cup clash against League Two outfit Northampton back in September for all the wrong reasons, with Hodgson's side crashing out on penalties in what many considered to be the most embarrassing home performance since Worcester City in 1959.

While last night's loss also came at Anfield, Hodgson's away record with Liverpool so far is perhaps more of a cause for concern.

The Reds have been beaten six times and have managed only one win on the road in the league this season, scoring just six goals.

Hodgson has never won more than five away games in charge of a Premier League team in a single season; Rafael Benitez won only five away games in 2009/10 and it was not deemed good enough to keep him at LFC.

Benitez won 13 away games with the Reds in the 2008/09 campaign - the same amount Hodgson has won in his Premier League managerial career to date.

Roy Hodgson's Premier League away record in full:

1997/98 at Blackburn Rovers - 5 away wins - finished 6th
1998/99 at Blackburn Rovers - 0 away wins - sacked when 20th
2007/08 at Fulham - 3 away wins - finished 17th
2008/09 at Fulham - 3 away wins - finished 7th
2009/10 at Fulham - 1 away win - finished 12th
2010/11 at Liverpool - 1 away win so far - currently 12th

---------- Post added at 05:52 AM ---------- Previous post was at 05:19 AM ----------

Liverpool owners have reached breaking point with under-fire manager Roy Hodgson. Only a victory against Bolton at Anfield on Saturday is likely to save him following the shambolic defeat by Wolves which led to fans calling for him to be sacked.

With Hodgson seemingly on the brink after just six months, the club have even been forced to deny claims he has already left.

If the patience of owners Fenway Sports Group runs out, Kop hero Kenny Dalglish is a ready-made candidate for a caretaker role with a view to assuming a senior boardroom position once a permanent replacement has been found.
Liverpool striker Fernando Torres can't disguise his disappointment

Down in the dumps: Torres can't disguise his disappointment during Wednesday night's defeat

Damien Comolli, the club’s director of football strategy, is responsible for identifying the next Anfield boss and the search has taken on fresh urgency after the appalling display in the 1-0 defeat at home on Wednesday against a team who were then bottom of the Barclays Premier League.

The American owners are populists and their eagerness to make the right impression with fans following their takeover in October puts Hodgson on borrowed time, although his good relationship with Comolli is working for him at the moment.
Roy Hodgson cuts a solemn figure as he watches Liverpool lose against Wolves - with little backing from the Kop for their beleaguered manager

Walking alone: Hodgson cuts a solemn figure as he watches Liverpool lose against Wolves - with little backing from the Kop for their beleaguered manager

Is Hodgson's time up at Liverpool after defeat to lowly Wolves? Roy Hodgson was berated by the Liverpool fans during their shocking 1-0 home defeat to struggling Wolves on Wednesday night. A section of Kop called for Kenny Dalglish to replace him at the helm. Does Hodgson need to go? And is King Kenny really the answer to the Anfield crisis?
Roy Hodgson
TELL US WHAT YOU THINK

With Liverpool only three points above the relegation zone and having suffered eight defeats in the league already, tomorrow’s game against Bolton has taken on huge significance and a loss will leave the club little room for manoeuvre.

However, Hodgson’s precarious position will not affect Liverpool’s intentions for the January transfer window as Comolli is in charge of recruitment now that chief scout Eduardo Macia has left. Comolli will be backed to sign as many as four players.

A £1.5million deal for Rennes winger Sylvain Marveaux is in place and Comolli will have a pivotal role to play in shaping Liverpool’s long-term future.

Although Dalglish may be given a temporary role in charge he and the other fans’ favourite, Rafa Benitez, are not under consideration to take over on a permanent basis.

Hodgson faces an enormous challenge to raise his badly deflated players for the Bolton game, which starts a defining run of five matches in 15 days.

Liverpool face a trip to Blackburn followed by an FA Cup third-round tie against Manchester United before league games against Blackpool and Everton.
Tough times: Hodgson drives away from training ground on Thursday... but it isn't for the final time

Tough times: Hodgson drives away from training ground on Thursday... but it isn't for the final time

This is actually a pretty good source.
He is adamant the players are still with him but Hodgson is unlikely to find any sympathy from the terraces tomorrow.

The 63-year-old said: ‘I have been lucky. The support I have had has been from the players and within the club. I haven’t had a lot of support from the fans ever since I came here. The fans have not been happy with what they have seen in the whole of 2010.’
 
to be honest i have heard very few liverpool fans who wanted top 4, they wanted a good finish and good football

Exactly, well, for the time being. We don't have a champions league standard side atm. With owners who have long term plans I do feel that we will be back to our title challenging selves in around 4 years, and depending how this summer goes maybe a top 4 side next year, but if not, the year after is a must. First things first though, a manager who knows how to adapt.
 
Exactly, well, for the time being. We don't have a champions league standard side atm. With owners who have long term plans I do feel that we will be back to our title challenging selves in around 4 years, and depending how this summer goes maybe a top 4 side next year, but if not, the year after is a must. First things first though, a manager who knows how to adapt.

So you think you'll overthrow Tottenham and Manchester City as top four challengers in a single year?
 
I disagree there mate. Meireles, Cole, Maxi and Agger are all top 6 players.
I disagree further.

From the first 11/subs, Keep: Reina, Gerrard, Torres, Meireles, Agger, Aurelio, Johnson (but play on the right wing, not RB).

Sell: Everyone else that's not in the youth team, and start again.

Not by a long shot!!! Agger is as soft as a CB gets
No, no he's not. He's like a pique - obviously not as good, but a composed centre back who can actually pass the ball is much better than a clown like kyriakgos. He's a solid enough CB, for a top 6 team anyway. Just a shame he hasn't had a run of games as the manager doesn't have a clue.
 
So you think you'll overthrow Tottenham and Manchester City as top four challengers in a single year?

Depends, next year it is possible if we can get in a new manager [assuming Hodgson doesnt do something miraculous], some quality signings [NESV said the summer is where we will be getting our big bucks] then, yes, it is definately possible. Likely? No.

The yeat after that we will have to be aiming for it.
 
Depends, next year it is possible if we can get in a new manager [assuming Hodgson doesnt do something miraculous], some quality signings [NESV said the summer is where we will be getting our big bucks] then, yes, it is definately possible. Likely? No.

The yeat after that we will have to be aiming for it.
agreed. to be honest i would pretty much write this season off, even if you get a top manager and the players in jan you want you're still gonna be playing catch up. providing you get the mentioned in the summer, you still face a hugh fight, having said that, i dont see why you would be disadvantaged against the other runners
 
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