New Australian Nation Rules FM 2012

[Nero_Diavolo]

AUSTRALIA
NEW NATION RULES​

I'm planning to re-create the Australian football league system to become much more organised, and connect the amateur clubs, semi-professional clubs, and A-league clubs like most other countries in the world, allowing teams coming out of obscurity to becoming champions of Asia, and possibly the World.

I'm not expecting many FM-Base users to be very interested in downloading this data base except for other Australian users. How far down I go will depend on the interest of people in downloading the completed database, and how many express interest to help.

I'm more than happy to do most of the editing myself, but to make the database more accurate and comprehensive I would like help from other Australian users to give me more information on clubs in their local competitions, e.g. what their reputation should be, and any club information I can't find on the Internet, and to help review partly finished database for errors, etc.

The other main area, although not important would really complete the database is club logos. If someone would be interested in creating a logo pack I will find logos for as many clubs as I can along with their IDs from in the database so they can e made usable in the game.

Even simple things such as feedback, ideas, or discussion, positive or negative will also help.

Below is my proposed structure of the league system, I don't think I've missed anything but I may have, and at this stage it is only a draft so feel free to point out mistakes etc. but anyways here it is...

DRAFT OVERVIEW

League Competitions

Hyundai A-League

• Remains as top division
• Finals Series removed
• Will include 9 current Australian Clubs
• Wellington Phoenix removed to New Zealand
• North Queensland Fury returned
• New franchises based on real world bids + Fictional (but realistic) franchises including:
  • Western Sydney Rovers
  • Canberra United FC
  • Geelong City FC
  • Tasmania United
• 3 teams relegated to Hyundai A2-League

Hyundai A2-League

• Composed of top state league teams based on 2011 real life results
  • Top 4 New South Wales Premier League
  • Top 4 Victorian Premier League
  • Top 3 South Australian Super League
  • Top 3 Football West Premier League
  • Top 3 Queensland State League
  • Top 2 Northern New South Wales State League
  • Top ACT Premier League
• Top 3 promoted to Hyundai A-League
• Bottom 4 relegated to State Premier Leagues

State Premier Leagues

• Each State has own sub-division (8 sub-divisions) of 16 teams
  • Top 16 teams from each state based on 2011 real life results
    • remaining divisions from each state filled down based on 2011 results
• Top 2 from each state qualify for nation-wide play-offs
  • Total 16 teams
  • 2 Legged Knock Out
  • 4 promoted to Hyundai A2-League
• 24 teams relegated to State League
  • 3 from each state
  • teams relegated into sub-divisions of same state
    • Bottom 3 teams of Victorian Premier League relegated to Victorian State League
    • Bottom 3 teams of NSW Premier League relegated to NSW State League
    • etc.

State League

• 8 sub-divisions (1 per State) of 16 teams
• 24 Teams promoted
  • 3 from each state
  • Promoted into Premier League of same state
• 24 teams relegated
  • 3 from each state
  • relegated to Division 1 of same state

State Division 1, 2, etc.

• Remaining State Divisions are in same format as State League (excludes lowest if City Divisions are below)

City Premier League, Division 1, 2 etc. (dependent on how far down the league system goes)

• Each city has own sub-division of 16 teams within statewide division
• Top teams from each premier division qualify for Play-Offs against teams from other divisions in same state
  • Play-Off winners promoted to lowest State Divisions
• 3 teams promoted and relegated between PL, Div 1, 2, etc. of same city

Cup Competitions

FFA Cup

• Nation wide KO cup
• Includes every team in Australia
• Single Leg, Extra Time, Penalties, No Replays

FFA Super Cup

• Hyundai A-League Winner V FFA Cup Winner
• Single Match, Extra Time, Penalties, No Replays

Hyundai Trophy

• KO Cup
• A-League, A2-League teams Only
• Single Leg, Extra Time, Penalties, No Replays

State Cup

• KO Cup
• Each State has own cup
• Only teams from State Premier Leagues and below (i.e. not A-League, A2-League)
• Single Leg, Extra Time, Penalties, No Replays

State Super Cup

• Each State has own Super Cup
• State Premier League Winner V State Cup Winner (of same state)
• Single Match, Extra Time, Penalties, No Replays

Youth Competitions

• Each club will have 2 youth teams
  • ​U18s (uses own divisions)
    • League Competitions
      • ​State U18 Premier Leagues
        • ​Each State has own
        • 16 teams
        • Champions or Top 2 from each state qualify for National U18s Play-Offs
        • Bottom 3 teams from each state relegated U18 Division 1 of own state
      • ​State U18 Division 1, 2, 3 etc.
        • ​Each state has own
        • 16 teams
        • 3 teams promoted
        • 3 teams relegated
    • ​Cup Competitions
      • ​State U18 Cup
        • ​Each State has own cup
        • Every U18 team in each state
        • Single Leg, Extra Time, Penalties, No Replays
      • ​State U18 Super Cup
        • ​Single Match, Extra Time, Penalties, No Replays
        • State U18 Premier League V State U18 Cup Winner (for each state)
  • ​U21 or U23 (Uses First Team divisions
    • League Competitions
      • ​Same as First team Divisions
    • ​Cup Competitions
      • ​FFA U21/U23 Cup
        • ​Every club has team entered
        • KO Cup
        • Single Leg, Extra Times, Penalties, No Replays

Sorry I know it's a lot of information to take in, and you probably didn't read a fair bit, but hopefully your interested in downloading it when it's completed! Just to remind you that this proposal is still a draft at this stage.

Leave any feedback and ideas and thanks for reading this.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

UPDATE

There have been ongoing issues in the league system proposed above regarding the promotion and relegation between the A2-League and the State Premier Divisions. As I have been unable to find a solution to this issue, I have decided to create and alternative league structure.

This will be similar to the Brazilian system where clubs play in both National Divisions and State Divisions, and National and State have their on separate Pyramids.

National System

Each division contains 16 teams who play each other twice for a total of 30 matches.

3 teams promoted and 3 teams relegated from every division.

The State system will be the same however will only play each other once. for a total of 15 games.

All cup competitions remained as planned. Youth competitions will be unchanged.

I have also made new Continental rules for Asia, based upon the new real life rules (where Australia is awarded 2.5 places) but was unable to replicate them exactly due to restrictions within the editor. Includes AFC Champions League, AFC Cup, AFC President's Cup and a fictional AFC Trophy.

 

[lordtom]

Sounds good, always wanted to manage Canberra.

 

[AussieOchoa]

this is very good mate. if it goes ahead i will definately download and do a story on it i can help with the information for all the ACT stuff if you need it good luck!

 

[mickiac]

****** confusing but sounds great! Remember prize money for the cup because I re-formatted the Scottish League and forgot about prize money!

 

[bobthecat]

cant wait if this gets done

 

[hufcforever]

would deffo download!

 

[rturtle]

Sounds great - I've never really managed in Australia because I figure it'd get boring after a season or two, but I will if this gets completed.

 

[joel_thornton45]

Mate this looks great and i would def download and play heaps. Just some quick questions... to what point in the league system would the clubs be filled with Regens? Also I'm assuming the new A-League clubs would be filled with Regens? Maybe is could be a good idea to put some Wellington players in the new clubs and delete the Wellington club completely or have no players in the new teams and give them a high transfer budget and wage budget which would be realistic.

Also it may be a good idea to check out this and play it in FM11:
Australian State Leagues - Sortitoutsi.net - Football Manager 2011 Forums

This guy recreated the Australian League system and in the teams down to the third tier were pretty much filled with real players.

---------- Post added at 08:56 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:29 PM ----------

Also i found this which may be useful to you! It would be so cool if you made all the team that are possible expansion teams.
Expansion of the A-League - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Nero_Diavolo]

Mate this looks great and i would def download and play heaps. Just some quick questions... to what point in the league system would the clubs be filled with Regens? Also I'm assuming the new A-League clubs would be filled with Regens? Maybe is could be a good idea to put some Wellington players in the new clubs and delete the Wellington club completely or have no players in the new teams and give them a high transfer budget and wage budget which would be realistic.

Also it may be a good idea to check out this and play it in FM11:
Australian State Leagues - Sortitoutsi.net - Football Manager 2011 Forums

This guy recreated the Australian League system and in the teams down to the third tier were pretty much filled with real players.

---------- Post added at 08:56 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:29 PM ----------

Also i found this which may be useful to you! It would be so cool if you made all the team that are possible expansion teams.
Expansion of the A-League - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

At this stage every club below the A-league will be filled with regens but depending on how things go I probably will put real players for the top division teams in each state. The hardest thing with making real players is getting the ability and attributes right which will also depend on what information I can get from other users from here as I know very little about the other state league competitions and there players other than South Australia where I live.

All the new A-league clubs will be filled with regens at the start but I will give try to give them good budgets and give them a chance of avoiding relegation. All the Wellington players will be released on free transfers so the new clubs will be able to sign some of these players also.

As for all the possible future expansion clubs in that article, I have one for every possible Australian Bid (not considering any outside Australia, after all it is the Australian league), the four mentioned in my opening post as well as Illawarra FC for the South Coast bid. Very boring name I know but very open to any suggestions to change this! All the other new clubs' names are based on the name proposed in their possible bid.

I will definitely take a look at that database, thanks for the link.

Hope this answers most of your questions!

 

[maxotaxo8624]

This is and awesome idea. Good luck!

 

[joel_thornton45]

At this stage every club below the A-league will be filled with regens but depending on how things go I probably will put real players for the top division teams in each state. The hardest thing with making real players is getting the ability and attributes right which will also depend on what information I can get from other users from here as I know very little about the other state league competitions and there players other than South Australia where I live.

All the new A-league clubs will be filled with regens at the start but I will give try to give them good budgets and give them a chance of avoiding relegation. All the Wellington players will be released on free transfers so the new clubs will be able to sign some of these players also.

As for all the possible future expansion clubs in that article, I have one for every possible Australian Bid (not considering any outside Australia, after all it is the Australian league), the four mentioned in my opening post as well as Illawarra FC for the South Coast bid. Very boring name I know but very open to any suggestions to change this! All the other new clubs' names are based on the name proposed in their possible bid.

I will definitely take a look at that database, thanks for the link.

Hope this answers most of your questions!

Nice work mate. Well in regards to you adding players. I am pretty sure they are already in the game, just have to have Australia loaded which is lucky for you! All of the A-League is obviously all filled, all of the Vic Premier and state leagues of the same level are filled with real players and even in the case of NSW, Victoria, SA and Qld their state league 2 often have quite a few real players in each team. So you would hardly have to add anyone.

 

[AussieOchoa]

oh, and if you havn't mentioned it, increase the subs bench. only having 4 available is SOOOO annoying! make it 7, or 6.

 

[Nero_Diavolo]

Nice work mate. Well in regards to you adding players. I am pretty sure they are already in the game, just have to have Australia loaded which is lucky for you! All of the A-League is obviously all filled, all of the Vic Premier and state leagues of the same level are filled with real players and even in the case of NSW, Victoria, SA and Qld their state league 2 often have quite a few real players in each team. So you would hardly have to add anyone.

OK well that's good then, and if not already in the first team squads I might add in young players from clubs that have the potential to play A-League level or higher if anybody knows any from their local knowledge.

oh, and if you havn't mentioned it, increase the subs bench. only having 4 available is SOOOO annoying! make it 7, or 6.

Yes will definitely do this and your right it is! Not sure what I'm going to do regarding squad restrictions. Will expand the squad limit from 23 possibly to unlimited not sure though. Would like to change it from a foreigner to a homegrown rule but then most of the clubs won't have enough homegrown players in their squads and it won't work. I would have to edit all the squads and make existing players regarded as homegrown or add in 'nothing' players that are homegrown to give them enough players as home grown or something to that effect

 

[AussieOchoa]

OK well that's good then, and if not already in the first team squads I might add in young players from clubs that have the potential to play A-League level or higher if anybody knows any from their local knowledge.



Yes will definitely do this and your right it is! Not sure what I'm going to do regarding squad restrictions. Will expand the squad limit from 23 possibly to unlimited not sure though. Would like to change it from a foreigner to a homegrown rule but then most of the clubs won't have enough homegrown players in their squads and it won't work. I would have to edit all the squads and make existing players regarded as homegrown or add in 'nothing' players that are homegrown to give them enough players as home grown or something to that effect

Sounds good. I can help with the ACT stuff as said before as i know a lot of people that have that potential, or even higher. I think you should add in an ACTAS squad, sort of a reserve squad for the AIS team possibly?

Also yeah, homegrown rule would be better if it worked. Good luck

 

[Saints4Life]

Yes, that would be ****** cool.. have you thought about feeder teams, like having a nonplayable school team as a feeder team

 

[AussieOchoa]

Yes, that would be ****** cool.. have you thought about feeder teams, like having a nonplayable school team as a feeder team

I don't think you need a nonplayable school one. Schools would be alright, but playable. I play for a feeder team for CCM in real life. Still in U16's though. Not non playable, playable would be good. Just depends how much details he wants to go into.

 

[Saints4Life]

yeah

---------- Post added at 01:33 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:12 PM ----------

has anybody played fm 12 yet, and if so how good is it

 

[Nero_Diavolo]

Sounds good. I can help with the ACT stuff as said before as i know a lot of people that have that potential, or even higher. I think you should add in an ACTAS squad, sort of a reserve squad for the AIS team possibly?

Also yeah, homegrown rule would be better if it worked. Good luck

I was thinking about removing all the state institute teams because in the game they don't really work as they do in real life, but if I can get them to work as they do correctly (which I doubt) I will keep them in. By default they are non playable I think, not sure on this though.

Yes, that would be ****** cool.. have you thought about feeder teams, like having a nonplayable school team as a feeder team

I don't think you need a nonplayable school one. Schools would be alright, but playable. I play for a feeder team for CCM in real life. Still in U16's though. Not non playable, playable would be good. Just depends how much details he wants to go into.

I think making school teams wouldn't really work because there are just so many schools. And only making 20 or so per State wouldn't really be adding much to the game, and because school teams generally aren't very good. Would be a different story in for example the USA where most of their sport and youth development is done through school, whereas here it is done through the clubs and the institutes.

As for feeder teams, I'm presuming the feeder teams you play for is its own separate club also? So in this case in the game the club would be set as a feeder club to CCM and essentially you would be in the U18 squad of your club in the game. I stand corrected if that's not how it is and could you explain it as well?

Adding to that I could create you, or anyone else here who wants to in the game, for the team they play for, but with realistic CA/PA of course I don't think it would take anything away from the realness of the database if done right.

 

[AussieOchoa]

I was thinking about removing all the state institute teams because in the game they don't really work as they do in real life, but if I can get them to work as they do correctly (which I doubt) I will keep them in. By default they are non playable I think, not sure on this though.




I think making school teams wouldn't really work because there are just so many schools. And only making 20 or so per State wouldn't really be adding much to the game, and because school teams generally aren't very good. Would be a different story in for example the USA where most of their sport and youth development is done through school, whereas here it is done through the clubs and the institutes.

As for feeder teams, I'm presuming the feeder teams you play for is its own separate club also? So in this case in the game the club would be set as a feeder club to CCM and essentially you would be in the U18 squad of your club in the game. I stand corrected if that's not how it is and could you explain it as well?

Adding to that I could create you, or anyone else here who wants to in the game, for the team they play for, but with realistic CA/PA of course I don't think it would take anything away from the realness of the database if done right.

Yeah, my club is separate. Belconnen United. But we do feed into CCM, and they do an annual friendly and everything. I don't believe we get payed an annual fee tho. We train with them once or twice a year though I would love to be in the game, but I reckon only with potential to make fringe of the A-League I reckon one or two of my friends have potential for EPL though. So it might be worth adding them

 

[Nero_Diavolo]

Yeah, my club is separate. Belconnen United. But we do feed into CCM, and they do an annual friendly and everything. I don't believe we get payed an annual fee tho. We train with them once or twice a year though I would love to be in the game, but I reckon only with potential to make fringe of the A-League I reckon one or two of my friends have potential for EPL though. So it might be worth adding them

Oh yeah, I have heard of your club before I'll set your them up as a feeder to CCM in the database if they are not already. As for adding the extra youth players and ourselves, I won't really worry about that until most of the database down to the fourth (second state divisions) are done.

By the way, do you think the older youth divisions should be U21 or U23? (U18 is the younger one I'm sure your aware of and I'm pretty much 100% sure with that.)