The Arsenal Thread

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On topic, you ever think the likes of Sir Alex, Wenger & co. low-key want their clubs to go on a few years of complete destruction after their retirement/resignation, for their own egos?

No doubt both love the clubs, no doubt both support them, but deep down there's bound to be that little bit of satisfaction in seeing them fail a little bit too.

Sir Alex's squad management could've been better, handing over Moyes a lot of declining/on the way out players, and Wenger seems to have every man and their dog on contracts running down.
 
RhQQ said:
On topic, you ever think the likes of Sir Alex, Wenger & co. low-key want their clubs to go on a few years of complete destruction after their retirement/resignation, for their own egos?

No doubt both love the clubs, no doubt both support them, but deep down there's bound to be that little bit of satisfaction in seeing them fail a little bit too.

Sir Alex's squad management could've been better, handing over Moyes a lot of declining/on the way out players, and Wenger seems to have every man and their dog on contracts running down.
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They can certainly cause the decline by trying too hard to retire in glory. There's been rumors that Fergie cancelled 2011 retirement after losing the league to City in last minute. Then he proceed to buy and give a massive contract to a notoriously unreliable glass-man Van Persie. The gamble worked and he got his glorious retirement, but in the end that transfer ended up costing United more than it was worth.
 
RhQQ said:
On topic, you ever think the likes of Sir Alex, Wenger & co. low-key want their clubs to go on a few years of complete destruction after their retirement/resignation, for their own egos?

No doubt both love the clubs, no doubt both support them, but deep down there's bound to be that little bit of satisfaction in seeing them fail a little bit too.

Sir Alex's squad management could've been better, handing over Moyes a lot of declining/on the way out players, and Wenger seems to have every man and their dog on contracts running down.
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How can you 'love the club', if you hand pick a completely unqualified replacement and set him up to fail. All to the detriment of the club you love?
 
Scouseinthehouse said:
How can you 'love the club', if you hand pick a completely unqualified replacement and set him up to fail. All to the detriment of the club you love?
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Yeah he just comes to every other game because he hates the club.

He thought Moyes would mould into a long term United manager, probably saw a bit of himself in him. Got it wrong, but its not like he didn't tick any single box in what the club were after at the time: a stable, young manager, who was over performing duties at Everton with the limited funds available to him. There was potential, but it failed, and we've been adapting the other PL's club approach of short term fixes since.
 
RhQQ said:
Yeah he just comes to every other game because he hates the club.
He thought Moyes would mould into a long term United manager, probably saw a bit of himself in him. Got it wrong, but its not like he didn't tick any single box in what the club were after: a stable, young manager, who was over performing duties at Everton with the limited funds available to him. It failed, and we've been adapting the other PL's club approach of short term fixes since.
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Hey, you're the one suggesting he put his ego ahead of the club.

Can't have it both ways.

IF he hand picked a man NOWHERE near qualified to run a club the size of Utd, with a dressing room full of ego's the like he'd never encountered, a man that let's not forget had won absolutely NOTHING in 11 years at Everton, with the awesome distinction of getting knocked out of not one, but TWO different European Competitions in the space of a month, and in so doing turning Utd into a Country wide laughing stock as soon as the appointment was made; then that' the very LAST example of him 'loving' his club.

I'mma safeguard my own legacy by suggesting the club follow me with the most bizarre and unfit choice available.

But I'm doing it because I love Utd and want nothing for the best for them ......

*Edit* And I aren't suggesting he did that before this blows up. That was your inference. I'm just exploring the ramifications on him if that were the case.
 
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Tyton said:
The gamble worked and he got his glorious retirement, but in the end that transfer ended up costing United more than it was worth.
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Have to strongly disagree here, that signing brought us a record breaking premier league title. So RVP will forever be considered by most fans as positive considering the huge role he played in it.

Plus, people really overhype the situation Moyes was left in, whilst the midfield was dire, all other parts of the squad was decent. He didn't help himself by changing all the backroom staff and having a terrible transfer window. Even if it wasn't all down to Moyes, a lot of it was, he turned down Thiago and constantly earmarked Fabregas who was never moving that summer.

Moyes didn't have it easy, but he cocked a lot of it up himself before he even really started
 
Scouseinthehouse said:
Hey, you're the one suggesting he put his ego ahead of the club.

Can't have it both ways.

IF he hand picked a man NOWHERE near qualified to run a club the size of Utd, with a dressing room full of ego's the like he'd never encountered, a man that let's not forget had won absolutely NOTHING in 11 years at Everton, with the awesome distinction of getting knocked out of not one, but TWO different European Competitions in the space of a month, and in so doing turning Utd into a Country wide laughing stock as soon as the appointment was made; then that' the very LAST example of him 'loving' his club.

I'mma safeguard my own legacy by suggesting the club follow me with the most bizarre and unfit choice available.

But I'm doing it because I love Utd and want nothing for the best for them ......

*Edit* And I aren't suggesting he did that before this blows up. That was your inference. I'm just exploring the ramifications on him if that were the case.
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I meant it as a subconscious thing, rather than a calculated deceiving plan. He probably had a fair idea Moyes wouldn't hit the ground running (which would make SAF look like even more of a God in the process), but probably thought he would've got time and would've got it right in the long run. There was definitely no malice in choosing Moyes, I'm sure he feels actually somewhat guilty for him being sacked/getting passed around clubs since.


zzeezzy said:
Have to strongly disagree here, that signing brought us a record breaking premier league title. So RVP will forever be considered by most fans as positive considering the huge role he played in it.

Plus, people really overhype the situation Moyes was left in, whilst the midfield was dire, all other parts of the squad was decent. He didn't help himself by changing all the backroom staff and having a terrible transfer window. Even if it wasn't all down to Moyes, a lot of it was, he turned down Thiago and constantly earmarked Fabregas who was never moving that summer.

Moyes didn't have it easy, but he cocked a lot of it up himself before he even really started
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Yeah, agree. 24M for a PL title is a bargain. Whatever damage was done, it wasn't because we signed RVP.
 
Related aside. I'm trying to decide which was more embarrassing.

Utd going full-on batshit crazy and appointing the complete incompetence of David Moyes Football GENIUS! No less to follow an absolute club legend.

Liverpool going just as batshit crazy and appointing the passionless, clueless relick that is Roy Hodgson. Albeit on the cheap as the two charlatans running the club didn't have a pot to **** in.

Or Everton appointing the antipathy of what they claim to stand for and how they want their football played, and a caught criminal no less, with Sam Allardyce.

It's tough to split.
 
zzeezzy said:
Have to strongly disagree here, that signing brought us a record breaking premier league title. So RVP will forever be considered by most fans as positive considering the huge role he played in it.
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I agree, I'm just saying it was short-term strategy. Fergie didn't care what he leaves behind, he just wanted his glorious exit. RVP lead you to that one title and fair play to that. But after the first year he's done **** all and was a huge primadonna in the squad with massive wages.
 
zzeezzy said:
Have to strongly disagree here, that signing brought us a record breaking premier league title. So RVP will forever be considered by most fans as positive considering the huge role he played in it.

Plus, people really overhype the situation Moyes was left in, whilst the midfield was dire, all other parts of the squad was decent. He didn't help himself by changing all the backroom staff and having a terrible transfer window. Even if it wasn't all down to Moyes, a lot of it was, he turned down Thiago and constantly earmarked Fabregas who was never moving that summer.

Moyes didn't have it easy, but he cocked a lot of it up himself before he even really started
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Moyes lost me when he spent 2 months of a transfer window chasing after Fellaini and Baines instead of trying to sign anyone else. His incompetence was clear to see when he missed Fellaini for 22 million due to that clause in his contract then ended up shelling out closer to 30 at the end of the window in an attempt to save face.

Moyes beat himself, the team was decent and with a 1 or 2 midfield signings could have been better but his love affair of chasing after former players was his downfall. I mean I liked Baines and Fellaini at the time but if you can't get them, you move onto the next target. Wasted window and he killed his chances with it.
 
Scouseinthehouse said:
Or Everton appointing the antipathy of what they claim to stand for and how they want their football played, and a caught criminal no less, with Sam Allardyce.
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Him, he does not deserve these players. So much potential to make that team play well, money to spend and they hire Sam. Anybody else than him or Pulis would have done it.

Also sad to see in reddit and some arsenal threads the treatment what Walcott gets. He deserves better.
Hoped to see him leave after this weekend so he could get proper send off and his 400ths game. Hope he wont get pooed by Arsenal fans when they play Everton on 03.02.
12 years in Arsenal 399 games - 108(G) 78 (a). Most goals coming from playing as right winger. Not bad stats and have to consider that horrendous ACL injury at start of 2014.
 
Well, if you do sign Mkhitaryan and Aubamayang it will be decent considering the mess you were ion.

But I'm really confused how you will fit both Aubamayang and Lacazette together.
 
Theatre of Dreams83 said:
So what your saying is that nothing will be different.... :P
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Nope, not under Wenger anyway. If they brought in a new manager who is relevant in the modern game he could do some awesome things with this side with a few additions like CB and CM.

One thing I was thinking maybe Wenger making a big signing like this in Aubamayang is his last hoorah at trying to get some success before he retires. Bit like Fergie did with RVP. it won't work though unless they make further defensive additions.
 
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