The Liverpool Thread

[Scouseinthehouse]

Alexis Sanchez has started 12 games in the league and champions league with 8 goals and 5 assists. That's more than 1 goal contribution per 90 minutes. That's Messi/Ronaldo type ****!

Messi. Injuries are catching up with Ronaldo.

 

[dilakh2]

Thank you. But on Bobby and Phil ..... you might like to compare those players on their respective seasons. In most every aspect I think you'd find one of the Brazilians ranking out on top.

Right here, right now form there's nobody playing better however you cut it. That's not a L'pool centric opinion. That's just the level the numbers will back-up they're both playing at.

I wouldn't swap Bobby for any forward in the PL, apart from maybe Aguero lol. He is so vital to the way we play. If he could just be more clinical he would be worldclass.

 

[Scouseinthehouse]

I wouldn't swap Bobby for any forward in the PL, apart from maybe Aguero lol. He is so vital to the way we play. If he could just be more clinical he would be worldclass.

Frightening to think how Danny Ings would start for most Premiership sides. Divock too most likely. And Sturridge would start for virtually everyone. Yet none of them are in any danger of even spelling Firmino who's just getting better and better and is absolutely integral to what we do as you said.

He's like our own little secret. Everyone outside L'pool fans (opposition fans/ pundits et all) always gush over Phil. When the equally key man to the team and where most everything great we do stems from is the other Brazilian.

 

[Scouseinthehouse]

..... And btw, you should know full well about having a luckless day in that end of the pitch against Burnley.

Ironically I think that was our best result this year so far.

They learned immediately from the mistakes there (as much as they dominated the game per se); and the refocussed belief to be patient and keep playing our football until the openings come instead of panicking and having Coutinho wildly web it from 30 yards has served them well in the way they've consistently dismantled every average deep lying team since.

Utd and their bunkering in that deep they set up over Goodison excepted. .

To play into the above, just watching the tape of the Palace game back, and at 2-2, the camera pans to Klopp and you can clearly see the manager say 'Just keep playing football. Keep playing football.' It's like he's not arsed about conceding (although naturally he'd like to keep clean sheets I'm sure), but how they react to conceding as he knows if they don't panic, and keep playing their football, they'll invariably score.

Burnley we did panic and reverted back to type from previous years. Now, the mental strength within this group can no longer be questioned the way they keep rebounding from setbacks in games. Hull score ..... Sound, we've blamend one in before they've even stopped celebrating the stands. Swansea go in front early and are on top? No panic. See this period out and our football will beat these. Palace score 2 after you've been completely on top ..... No panic. Don't revert back to previous times down here. Keep playing our football and we'll batter these.

Burnley really has served as a good teaching tool and wake-up call to totally focus everyone on the task at hand.

 

[Tezzz]

To play into the above, just watching the tape of the Palace game back, and at 2-2, the camera pans to Klopp and you can clearly see the manager say 'Just keep playing football. Keep playing football.' It's like he's not arsed about conceding (although naturally he'd like to keep clean sheets I'm sure), but how they react to conceding as he knows if they don't panic, and keep playing their football, they'll invariably score.

Spot on this. As you know I recently read the book on him and for a second I thought I was reading a new chapter! Brilliant brilliant man.

 

[PatrickLFC]

No, in that photo it says United have created 133 chances, I'm assuming it's an updated stat after yesterday's fixtures, so unless we created 0 opportunities against Chelsea & Burnley (which was definitely not the case) then the lad's post before was a little off.

He said "in the games they didn't play us", not "in the games before they played us", think you misread that

 

[zzeezzy]

Fergie always said you don't win anything without a good defence, I still stick to that sentiment and believe it to be true. If you are going to win Premier League your going to have to tighten up and stop conceding as many as you are currently. You can't rely on always scoring more if your conceding every game., it's just not something that wins titles ultimately.

 

[spook]

https://streamable.com/fz60

 

[damola3]

Fergie always said you don't win anything without a good defence, I still stick to that sentiment and believe it to be true. If you are going to win Premier League your going to have to tighten up and stop conceding as many as you are currently. You can't rely on always scoring more if your conceding every game., it's just not something that wins titles ultimately.

I don't think Liverpool's defence is as bad as made out. Karius has looked a bit suspect but will come good. At least statistically, Liverpool have been quite unlucky with the number conceded. They are statistically the hardest team to play through. Mustering a decent pass completion ratio to get in the final third is difficult. It's really about concentration in vital moments.

I'm not really sure about any definite title contenders until Christmas. Anything can happen and it would be unwise to rule Liverpool out. Remember that no team is and will run away with the league. It's the best title race for years. Thus far, the managerial super league hasn't disappointed as all of the big shots and big possession teams have blown the rest of the league away. 2-3 bad results can see you far off the top.

 

[zzeezzy]

I don't think Liverpool's defence is as bad as made out. Karius has looked a bit suspect but will come good. At least statistically, Liverpool have been quite unlucky with the number conceded. They are statistically the hardest team to play through. Mustering a decent pass completion ratio to get in the final third is difficult. It's really about concentration in vital moments.

I'm not really sure about any definite title contenders until Christmas. Anything can happen and it would be unwise to rule Liverpool out. Remember that no team is and will run away with the league. It's the best title race for years. Thus far, the managerial super league hasn't disappointed as all of the big shots and big possession teams have blown the rest of the league away. 2-3 bad results can see you far off the top.

I'll be the first to admit I didn't even fancy Liverpool for top 4 this year, so far I am being proven wrong. Like you say though still 28 games to go or something like that. Got to admit I didn't even factor in that they weren't in Europe which is huge advantage when making that prediction at start of season. For some reason thought they were in Europa League this year.

Wouldnt necessarily say their defence is terrible, just too leaky and not of the strength title winning teams usually are in that department, at the moment anyway.

 

[lxl Ra lxl]

Wouldnt necessarily say their defence is terrible, just too leaky and not of the strength title winning teams usually are in that department, at the moment anyway.

The defences of the top 5 have been pretty poor overall anyways imo if you don't rate Liverpools as one of the stronger ones.

 

[damola3]

I also wanted to comment on the bottom end of the table. By old standards, Middlesbrough are relegation fodder, however Hull, Sunderland and Burnley exist. Their shots on target ratio are some of the poorest ever seen in the premier league. To stay up, you need an attack. Remember that 1 win is worth 3 draws. Defense isn't neccesarily the biggest factor, however Hull and Sunderland have been shocking. Sunderland's strategy has been 'let Pickford save everything' and Hull were conceding historical highs of 23 shots a game 7 matches in! Burnley have had incredible luck at the back and are overdue a few hidings which will come soon. Middlesbrough can defend, however if their attack is as persistently weak, they will finish close to the other 3 near the bottom.

 

[zzeezzy]

The defences of the top 5 have been pretty poor overall anyways imo if you don't rate Liverpools as one of the stronger ones.

Not sure about that, Spurs have been solid this year so far and Arsenal to a lesser extent. They conceded 4 against you but apart from that I think their defence has been good this year. Then factor in Chelsea last 4 games 0 goals conceded under Contes preferred formation.

 

[damola3]

Not sure about that, Spurs have been solid this year so far and Arsenal to a lesser extent. They conceded 4 against you but apart from that I think their defence has been good this year. Then factor in Chelsea last 4 games 0 goals conceded under Contes preferred formation.

The top 5 have been relatively similar defensively apart from Conte's which have arguably been the best so far. Lloris has a 90%+ save percentage which artificially supresses their figures. It's really about the ability to concentrate in vital moments, the ability to see out games and resilience.

Just to give a heads up to you all, Sunderland is the easiest 3 points you'll get this season.

 

[zzeezzy]

The top 5 have been relatively similar defensively apart from Conte's which have arguably been the best so far. Lloris has a 90%+ save percentage which artificially supresses their figures. It's really about the ability to concentrate in vital moments, the ability to see out games and resilience.

Just to give a heads up to you all, Sunderland is the easiest 3 points you'll get this season.

Even if it's the goalkeeper contributing to that record still very much counts... Doesn't matter how goals are not conceded at the end of the day.

I just looked at it.. Liverpool have conceded 8 more than Spurs, 4 more than Chelsea and 3 more than Arsenal. If Arsenal hadn't conceded so many at start of season with that makeshift defence when Koscielny was out and they used Rob Holding it would of been better defensive record.

 

[Scouseinthehouse]

The defences of the top 5 have been pretty poor overall anyways imo if you don't rate Liverpools as one of the stronger ones.

In general in football I think it's the next era of the way the games going more than anything. Teams at the very top are taking more risks to score more goals to keep up with each other. The more risks they take, the more they'll naturally concede.

Defence first teams, with defensive minded managers, are in the main being passed by as the game evolves again into an exciting, attacking era.

As for L'pool's defence, I wrote on the myth still circulating that they are poor compared to everyone else before Saturday contained in here: #30036

 

[Scouseinthehouse]

..... Just to give a heads up to you all, Sunderland is the easiest 3 points you'll get this season.

They're a great bet to topple Derby's lowest ever points total. 2 points from 10 games is mad. I'm actually real sorry about this as Sunderland is always a great place to go. Real good people. They deserve FAR better.

And the absolute clueless clown managing them not only incredibly managed Utd, he was even more astoundingly handpicked by Ferguson! That still blows me away how that ever happened.

Mores the petty that he only lasted the one season. . Great fun whilst it lasted. .

 

[damola3]

Even if it's the goalkeeper contributing to that record still very much counts... Doesn't matter how goals are not conceded at the end of the day.

I just looked at it.. Liverpool have conceded 8 more than Spurs, 4 more than Chelsea and 3 more than Arsenal. If Arsenal hadn't conceded so many at start of season with that makeshift defence when Koscielny was out and they used Rob Holding it would of been better defensive record.

My point being that Liverpool already have the points on the board and are already higher than Spurs. Lloris's unsustainable save percentage counts for nothing. We look at these stats for an accurate reflection of the future. What they show is that Liverpool won't be that unlucky in terms of goals conceded although their backing isn't the best in the league. They also show that Tottenham's luck will soon run out. Goals conceded in the past doesn't matter as long as you know that the defence will perform capably in the future.

It's like me saying that United won't score enough this season due to the draw with Burnley. This wouldn't be a fair analysis. If you could simulate that match multiple times, United are blowing Burnley away in the majority of scenarios. United are very unlikely to be goalless after 37 shots in the same way that Liverpool probably won't be as unlucky in terms of goals conceded. What matters is the resilience of the Liverpool players and the ability to concentrate at the back in order to minimise mistakes. I'm talking about general mental strength.

This lot of top teams is one of the best defensively in the league we'll every see. Don't be fooled by the Cliché. Liverpool's defensive setup is among the best in the league along with Arsenal, Tottenham, City (excluding individual errors) and Chelsea.

 

[Scouseinthehouse]

Spot on this. As you know I recently read the book on him and for a second I thought I was reading a new chapter! Brilliant brilliant man.

Is that the German guy Elmar Nevelings book mate?

Heard that referenced a lot on various things with glowing reviews.

 

[damola3]

Klopp’s Liverpool: Poised to Make the Leap | StatsBomb

This article is a bit more informative. Last season, it was more defensive errors that tactical setup.