The Liverpool Thread

[Joel`]

May I inquire the difference between chances created and key passes?

A key pass sets up an attack. A chance created is ambiguous. i.e. Arteta could hit a 30 yard pass to set Walcott free down the right, who then taps it 5 yards for RVP to score. Arteta played the key pass, Walcott has 'created' the chance, but his job is relatively simple compared to Arteta's.

EDIT: Although I personally dislike both terms, they're both pretty ambiguous in meaning. I know of plenty of people who'd take a key pass as an assist, whereas I would not.

 

[Mike.]

A key pass sets up an attack. A chance created is ambiguous. i.e. Arteta could hit a 30 yard pass to set Walcott free down the right, who then taps it 5 yards for RVP to score. Arteta played the key pass, Walcott has 'created' the chance, but his job is relatively simple compared to Arteta's.

EDIT: Although I personally dislike both terms, they're both pretty ambiguous in meaning. I know of plenty of people who'd take a key pass as an assist, whereas I would not.

They are a bit woolly, but it gives you something to analyse for deeper players, such as Modric, gives you a good into the role they play, especially deep lying playmakers.

 

[LFCMarshall]

If created chance is the easier one to set up, surely it backs up what im saying! Downing has been giving the striker chances, even if they were easy, the strikers have been missing them.

My whole point was that downing has been contributing this season just the strikers letting him down..

 

[Joel`]

They are a bit woolly, but it gives you something to analyse for deeper players, such as Modric, gives you a good into the role they play, especially deep lying playmakers.

Yeah I see the purpose, and there's nothing really better that can be used.

 

[Joel`]

If created chance is the easier one to set up, surely it backs up what im saying! Downing has been giving the striker chances, even if they were easy, the strikers have been missing them.

My whole point was that downing has been contributing this season just the strikers letting him down..

It supports your claim that your strikers are about as much use as a third armpit, yes.

 

[LFCMarshall]

It supports your claim that your strikers are about as much use as a third armpit, yes.

which is exactly what im saying the problem has been this season, yet godcubed seemed obsessed on name dropping all the players with better stats in other areas!

 

[Joel`]

which is exactly what im saying the problem has been this season, yet godcubed seemed obsessed on name dropping all the players with better stats in other areas!

Because he's saying Downing has been unimpressive, which he has. If a key pass also creates a goal, it gets credited as an assist as well, however it also shows a player's general footballing ability and brain to create and set the framework for the attacks, which is far more important to analysing player performance.

 

[LFCMarshall]

Because he's saying Downing has been unimpressive, which he has. If a key pass also creates a goal, it gets credited as an assist as well, however it also shows a player's general footballing ability and brain to create and set the framework for the attacks, which is far more important to analysing player performance.

Downing hasn't been as bad as other signings , im not saying he has been amazing, but he hasn't been awful.. if the strikers would have put these chances away, downing suddenly looks to be playing loads better

 

[Joel`]

Is it bad that I have to refrain from responding to your idiom (and why it makes no sense) when there is a perfectly good debate about our so-called 'strikers'?

My post detracted from the debate in no way. Your post however, focusing on a metaphor rather than the content, is.

Downing hasn't been as bad as other signings , im not saying he has been amazing, but he hasn't been awful.. if the strikers would have put these chances away, downing suddenly looks to be playing loads better

32nd in the league for key passes for a supposed creative outlet for a team isn't going to look good whatever other stats you throw at him.

 

[Steve*]

Ok to kinda stick to the topic of our strikers.
How do people feel about our strikers? I think Suarez would be far more effective from out wide than up front. The lad couldnt score in a brothel really, he has the skill to trick players and get past his man but his end product is dire. Dare I say it but if Carroll was left on his own up front and Suarez refrained from shooting so much it would surely give Carroll more chances to score and build up his confidense. It really couldnt hurt as Suarez isnt doing much anyway.

But point being made, we need a clinical finisher and I doubt our ability to get one due to the fact we wont be in the CL next season. Or most likely the season after.

 

[LFCMarshall]

Ok to kinda stick to the topic of our strikers.
How do people feel about our strikers? I think Suarez would be far more effective from out wide than up front. The lad couldnt score in a brothel really, he has the skill to trick players and get past his man but his end product is dire. Dare I say it but if Carroll was left on his own up front and Suarez refrained from shooting so much it would surely give Carroll more chances to score and build up his confidense. It really couldnt hurt as Suarez isnt doing much anyway.

But point being made, we need a clinical finisher and I doubt our ability to get one due to the fact we wont be in the CL next season. Or most likely the season after.

Id prefer Suarez with a CF role, in a 4-2-3-1 shape ... although we need a striker in front of him

Dare i say it, Torres would have been dreamy

 

[Steve*]

Id prefer Suarez with a CF role, in a 4-2-3-1 shape ... although we need a striker in front of him

Dare i say it, Torres would have been dreamy

So you think maybe like a trequistera role? An attacking minded AMC who cuts inside and creates chances?
I think somebody like Carroll could do well if he got the proper service and got some confidence. Failing that I heard that Llorente could be leaving Bilbao in the summer. Doubt he would come to Liverpool though

 

[Mike.]

So you think maybe like a trequistera role? An attacking minded AMC who cuts inside and creates chances?
I think somebody like Carroll could do well if he got the proper service and got some confidence. Failing that I heard that Llorente could be leaving Bilbao in the summer. Doubt he would come to Liverpool though

Inside Forward, he's definitely more effective from out wide.

 

[Mike.]

Stick to the topics at hand before i start handing out infractions

 

[Steve*]

Stick to the topics at hand before i start handing out infractions

Sorry Mike. :wub: you really

@your post above that:
Yeah I think he would be more effective out wide also. Was just asking was that what Marshall meant.
Personally I think converting to the wing could make Suarez an all around better player like it did with Kuyt when he first came here. Very different types of players but he doesnt have the composure or finishing ability to be considered an all out Striker.

 

[LFCMarshall]

I thought the teresquarta role, he looks good at linking up play, little one two, and his trademark 'nutmeg'.. i just think he'll be able to influence it more in the centre

Lucas - New CM
Suarez - Gerrard - Downing
New ST

or something like that, then it solves Mikes worries about gerrard and gives suarez a wide role!

 

[Metz]

.....Why would we get relegated?

You never know. Didn't Manchester City once with the league and got relegated the next season?

 

[Ride The Walrus]

Suarez should be played out wide, cutting in, but then we'd have nothing up top.

 

[Steve*]

Suarez should be played out wide, cutting in, but then we'd have nothing up top.

I agree but can Carroll do much worse up front alone instead of Suarez?
To be fair Suarez has been poor since returning from his ban

 

[Mike.]

Suarez should be played out wide, cutting in, but then we'd have nothing up top.

He isnt great up top anyway, either you get the best from Carroll by truly supplying and trusting him, or you cut your losses and sell him