The Liverpool Thread

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mccollio09 said:
That's kind of a politician's answer really isn't it? You haven't actually answered any of my perfectly valid points. Seriously, Jewell has a better record than Martinez. So does Lambert and Rodgers this season operating on smaller incomes and playing similar styles. No one is considering them yet for a big job.

Anyway, all seems to be a pointless, Kenny rumours dying down for now.
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Paul Lambert has been plying his trade in the Premier League for one season and has already been linked with other jobs like Aston Villa. Oh and Brendan Rodgers has even been linked with filling the Chelsea position, not sure where you have been.
 
mccollio09 said:
That's kind of a politician's answer really isn't it? You haven't actually answered any of my perfectly valid points. Seriously, Jewell has a better record than Martinez. So does Lambert and Rodgers this season operating on smaller incomes and playing similar styles. No one is considering them yet for a big job.

Anyway, all seems to be a pointless, Kenny rumours dying down for now.
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Not a politicans answer, me telling you not to make ****** assumptions about what I said. You could simply have just asked why i though that way.

I already explained why i think he works, and what he would bring to Liverpool, I would also consider Lambert and Rodgers. I dont think Jewell could have translated his work to Liverpool, I do think the other three would. Never said he was the top choice, but that he would be a good choice. And as I said to Irish, he wouldn't be too far down my list.

Both managers have been linked to big jobs. Rodgers was heavily linked to Chelsea before he quashed it. Lambert has also been linked to Villa, and now in some areas (albeit prematurely )Liverpool, which prompted Norwich to say they would fight tooth and nail to keep him.
 
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Can't blame them for only giving us small funds, after last season's dealings I have no confidence in our ability to sign players.
 
Irish Scouse said:
1. Holloway got relegated while doing it.

2. United can attract bigger names.
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1. Holloway had to get his team up from the championship, who incidentally, are once again in the playoff final this season and could be up again after having lost a lot most of their best players (they can have Adam back mind)

2. So basically he's good enough for pool but not for United? Not good enough for me I'm afraid, I know we've been behind united for years but still the second most successful team in England and most successful team in Europe, not quite ready to descend to a bottom quarter prem manager just yet. We'll still have some pull on getting those 'bigger names' too as far as managers go.
 
LFCMarshall said:
Fair play. you've got me there... another thing i may be proved wrong about although he has done nothing special so far
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I'm not say he will be a certain success, but that he has qualities that would translate well (arguably better) at a bigger side. Although I really dont know where FSG are going with this, playing it fast and loose with leaks, not a good idea.
 
mccollio09 said:
Martinez is very much flavour of the month because of Wigan's amazing run. If we're looking for a club who, to sum up Mike's post plays great attacking play without picking up too many points just out of principle, then we might as well shortlist Ian Holloway whilst we're at it.
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They've also won 5 of their last 6, and lost 3 in 15. Scored 5 less than a Liverpool side that received far more investment. Their form was an almost immediate reaction to Martinez's tactical switch, showing he's tactically switched on and intelligent.
mccollio09 said:
When I think of Wigan under Martinez I think of a team in permanent relegation threatened status with great flair and creativity and having absolutely no defensive positioning sense whatsoever and without being particularly lethal in front of goal (also having a very negative goal difference every season!)
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And who decides that they're permanently relegation threatened? They always survive, so it's harsh for people to immediately pin them down as relegation favourites for the next season. He operates with a very small fan base and a shoe string budget and still manages to successfully incorporate his philosophy.
 
mccollio09 said:
2. So basically he's good enough for pool but not for United? Not good enough for me I'm afraid, I know we've been behind united for years but still the second most successful team in England and most successful team in Europe, not quite ready to descend to a bottom quarter prem manager just yet. We'll still have some pull on getting those 'bigger names' too as far as managers go.
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So you'd rather pay a **** of a lot more to employ a 'big name' to satisfy your ego of still existing as a big club, rather than give a relatively successful, talented ambitious manager a go. Not saying Martinez is the best choice, but your dismissive attitude is sad. United has the kind of pull to attract any manager in the world when Fergie leaves, but I'd still take Moyes or Solskjaer over most of them, excluding maybe Guardiola.
 
Joel` said:
They've also won 5 of their last 6, and lost 3 in 15. Scored 5 less than a Liverpool side that received far more investment. Their form was an almost immediate reaction to Martinez's tactical switch, showing he's tactically switched on and intelligent.


And who decides that they're permanently relegation threatened? They always survive, so it's harsh for people to immediately pin them down as relegation favourites for the next season. He operates with a very small fan base and a shoe string budget and still manages to successfully incorporate his philosophy.
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The Swiss Ramble: Wigan Athletic

What they are working with is quite ridiculous.
 
The ideal man for the (potential) Liverpool job... dare I say it.... DAVID MOYES!
 
Joel` said:
They've also won 5 of their last 6, and lost 3 in 15. Scored 5 less than a Liverpool side that received far more investment. Their form was an almost immediate reaction to Martinez's tactical switch, showing he's tactically switched on and intelligent.


And who decides that they're permanently relegation threatened? They always survive, so it's harsh for people to immediately pin them down as relegation favourites for the next season. He operates with a very small fan base and a shoe string budget and still manages to successfully incorporate his philosophy.
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First off, definitely not going to defend our 'investment' this season, we've made some shocking signings, and I mentioned my feelings on that front on this thread earlier today.

Some rival fans would argue (and they certainly did for Rafa and his Istanbul turnaround), that the media portray you to look a genius by correcting your own mistakes. No one would be talking about Martinez's amazing run if he hadn't got his own team in that positon in the first place. Granted it's an impressive run they've had towards the end of the season, but do you let 2 months good work cancel out the other 3/4 under par part of the season?

Point 2, the table decides they're permanently relegation threatened, they're there or there abouts every season: Wigan league finishing positions

I'm not saying he's a bad manager, I just don't think he is Liverpool standard.
 
Joel` said:
Think it sums it all up when their annual turnover is £43m. That's basically just TV money and PL money.
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Mmm, crazy isnt it.

Although I dont think it matters who they get if they dont get the overall structure right. They need a Chairman who actually knows about football and how to run a football club to come in, and a director of football too.
 
Joel` said:
So you'd rather pay a **** of a lot more to employ a 'big name' to satisfy your ego of still existing as a big club, rather than give a relatively successful, talented ambitious manager a go. Not saying Martinez is the best choice, but your dismissive attitude is sad. United has the kind of pull to attract any manager in the world when Fergie leaves, but I'd still take Moyes or Solskjaer over most of them, excluding maybe Guardiola.
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Not at all, and don't know why you feel I need to "satisfy my ego?" I just think that there are much, much better names out there who do have a proven record at the highest level, like AVB, Rafa or one of the top managers that'll probably get the push at the Euros and for all of whom = no compo and no need to spend a "**** of a lot of money".

Moyes has done a **** of a lot more to prove himself than Martinez has, even they're on a different level.
 
mccollio09 said:
First off, definitely not going to defend our 'investment' this season, we've made some shocking signings, and I mentioned my feelings on that front on this thread earlier today.

Some rival fans would argue (and they certainly did for Rafa and his Istanbul turnaround), that the media portray you to look a genius by correcting your own mistakes. No one would be talking about Martinez's amazing run if he hadn't got his own team in that positon in the first place. Granted it's an impressive run they've had towards the end of the season, but do you let 2 months good work cancel out the other 3/4 under par part of the season?

Point 2, the table decides they're permanently relegation threatened, they're there or there abouts every season: Wigan league finishing positions

I'm not saying he's a bad manager, I just don't think he is Liverpool standard.
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There's nothing inherently wrong with making mistakes, everyone does. It's when you fail to learn from them there's an issue. Your tactic could work for 37 games of the season, and then fails in one game. Is that a mistake? You'd be justified in selecting the same successful tactic, it's how you respond and react to its sudden failure that tests your ability.
 
mccollio09 said:
Not at all, and don't know why you feel I need to "satisfy my ego?" I just think that there are much, much better names out there who do have a proven record at the highest level, like AVB, Rafa or one of the top managers that'll probably get the push at the Euros and for all of whom = no compo and no need to spend a "**** of a lot of money".

Moyes has done a **** of a lot more to prove himself than Martinez has, even they're on a different level.
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Because you spent half your post asserting Liverpool being the most successful club, and thus deserve a good manager because of that.

Prove Moyes has done more. Success is relative, both are achieving far more than that is expected of them. Neither has a trophy. Neither has 'top level' experience. There was a time when Everton were languishing at the bottom as well, and now they're solid top half. On current form, you could argue that Martinez is about to replicate the same feat. Also, Everton have been slow starters and only started picking significant points up in the second half - a criticism you levelled at Martinz. ****, even United are typically stronger in the second half of the season, but you wouldn't criticise Ferguson for that because the end product is consistently there.
 
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