The Liverpool Thread

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damola3 said:
Good god! This is why I don't like hype trains. The point was that there are times where you have to grind out a result and keep a clean sheet. I have to say that the Burnley result was unlucky but the defence has been nothing spectacular. There surely has to be a balance? You've referenced Sir Alex Ferguson's side who were incredibly resilient and capable of nicking and protecting a result if need be. Just look at Spurs who seem to have balanced everything out nicely and are 2nd despite losing key players. They've conceded 3 league goals albeit lucky. It's getting increasingly difficult to see Liverpool not making the top 4 by there's a reason I don't jump on hype trains.
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And you are why I hate statistics. You see the game in clear black and white and what should be this and what should be that. Most of the stuff you've tried to show about Klopp's Liverpool don't stack up to what we see. Which then leads you to analyse a completely different game to what he plays and talk about the lack of traditional FB's or DM's which will ultimately cost him when he doesn't utilise specialists in that way.

You've a dogmatic way of analysing and pigeonholing to a statistical standard. Which it rarely plays out like on a football field with human error and emotion involved.

Soz abar us like if the perceived 'hype' is not to your liking. But he's building something VERY special at ours and we'll shout it from the rooftops the longer this exhilarating ride goes.

*Edit* A football fan criticising other football fans for 'hype', or more so being excited about their team and the exhilarating attacking football they're producing.

Man alive people need to have a SERIOUS look at themselves and what being a football FAN is ALL about.
 
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Isn't Liverpool the perfect example of why stats are never the full picture? FSG have been trying to Moneyball everything, which looks at stats and perceived under/over valuations based on stats, since they arrived. It can work in baseball, but I think we've proven that it doesn't work in football. Stats are important, but they're far from the be all and end all
 
Scouseinthehouse said:
And you are why I hate statistics. You see the game in clear black and white and what should be this and what should be that. Most of the stuff you've tried to show about Klopp's Liverpool don't stack up to what we see. Which then leads you to analyse a completely different game to what he plays and talk about the lack of traditional FB's or DM's which will ultimately cost him when he doesn't utilise specialists in that way.

You've a dogmatic way of analysing and pigeonholing to a statistical standard. Which it rarely plays out like on a football field with human error and emotion involved.

Soz abar us like if the perceived 'hype' is not to your liking. But he's building something VERY special at ours and we'll shout it from the rooftops the longer this exhilarating ride goes.

*Edit* A football fan criticising other football fans for 'hype', or more so being excited about their team and the exhilarating attacking football they're producing.

Man alive people need to have a SERIOUS look at themselves and what being a football FAN is ALL about.
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I don't see how anything I've said is dogmatic or how anything I've said about Liverpool very wrong. All I've said is that Liverpool would play high intensity gung-ho attacking football with high shot volumes without being great defensively. So far, I've been right. You claim stat statistics never stack up to what's shown on the pitch.

What about Mane? He went on a 5 month dry spell last season. The numbers showed that he was misfiring last season. He's joined Liverpool with a flurry of goals and evened out his goal expectation. My point being is that you have to separate what happens in reality to the noise. The reality is that you won't score 5 goals every game for the entire season.

Optimism is good and it's more than reasonable to be optimistic as a Liverpool fan thus far. I just don't like the over-the-top reactions based upon a few games. The top team in Europe I can think of that doesn't play with a proper holding midfielder is Real Madrid. Looking at Liverpool's defensive record this season, I'm quite right to have doubts. The same with Milner at left back who's only played a couple of games. Remember the Kolarov hype?
 
PatrickLFC said:
Isn't Liverpool the perfect example of why stats are never the full picture? FSG have been trying to Moneyball everything, which looks at stats and perceived under/over valuations based on stats, since they arrived. It can work in baseball, but I think we've proven that it doesn't work in football. Stats are important, but they're far from the be all and end all
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When FSG joined, it was just in its infancy and analytics hadn't really taken hold. It's not just about collecting stats but what you can derive from them. All of the signings this summer are moneyball signings. Mane, Matip, Karius, Wijnaldum (ish)and Klavan all profile well statistically. Arsenal have been doing it for years and acquired a sports analytics company. They have a statistical model to measure player valuations.
 
All of the signings this summer were KLOPP signings.

It has f-all to do with any perceived money ball strategy outside of coincidence with Bostons ideal.

If you can't find a logical reason to compartmentalise everything it's like you can't accept anything.
 
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Scouseinthehouse said:
All of the signings this summer were KLOPP signings.

It has f-all to do with any perceived money ball strategy outside of coincidence with Bostons ideal.

If you can't find a logical reason to compartmentalise everything it's like you can't accept anythi.ng.
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They were all Klopp signings with analytics taken into consideration. You are one of the few premier league clubs with a Director of Research and ahead of most of the footballing world in terms of analytics. Liverpool have spent a lot on research into analytics and the signings are no coincidence. Most clubs now use a mixture of stats and scouts when recruiting a player.
 
1 more week of International tedium then we can finally get back to winning a league title.

This is a LONG 16 days.
 
Wythenshawe's Anthony Taylor to referee the United game.

About right they'd put an actual Mancunian in charge. Nottin' like opening yourself up to controversy.

On the plus side the referee actually being from Manchester makes up for Utd not being so there is that .....
 
^ I swear, you and Jose have a personality clash, it's why you hate him so much :D Excuses already, hint of nerves? ;)
 
RhQQ said:
^ I swear, you and Jose have a personality clash, it's why you hate him so much :D Excuses already, hint of nerves? ;)
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I seriously dislike him for the same reasons most everyone in the Utd thread did before he got the gig and the whole rhetoric changed. The fella's an A1 *****.

Nervous? Cautious. It's Utd. Anything can happen. But nervous? Nah. Seen absolutely nottin' from Utd to suggest you can live with how L'pool are currently playing. Love that you've just had the weekend off whilst we've been going two a days. Your lads are going to be beyond goosed at the end of next Monday night. They'll certainly know they've been in a game.

Last time we lost at Anfield was ironically Utd back in January 16 games ago. Which was another game we completely dominated but De Gea turned Superman again. Which would be a concern if he hadn't turned Superman in March on the biggest stage of all in Europe. But this time we'd learnt (as has so often happened when Klopp's played a team twice) and scored two despite his efforts.

Quietly optimistic you'll get licked 3 or 4. These Reds are currently mustard!
 
It's why I hate Internationals

Edit; let me rephrase that, it's the thing I hate most about internationals.
 
I'm personally awaiting the long 4 paragraph points on how Wijnaldum is important and why we'll miss him by Scouse.

It's always gonna come. :)
 
Switched to watching the Gibraltar- Belgium game on-line in the hope Origi gets on to boost his confidence and development.

Wijnaldum's a blow given his form. See how much fitter Can has gotten over the break and if he's ready to start. Personally, presuming Lallana's fit, I'd just drop Coutinho back and move Firmino the side of Sturridge.

But either Can or Sturridge to step in is another indication of how much stronger the group is from last season.
 
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