The Manchester United Thread
- Thread starter MisterStubbs
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Just about confirms that you will resort to anything to back up a flimsy point
I don't need to provide links because it's already been reported a million times that firstly, Chelsea were interested in Shaw. Secondly, they have been scouting him for a long time and believed 100% him. From that, it's very logical and fair to draw the assumption that they would have been ready to meet Southamptons valuation because they have a lot of cash to spend and need a LB which they believe Shaw is perfect for. Many media outlets reported that it's the wages that deterred Chelsea who were only willing to offer 60k p/w while United were willing offer 100k p/w. Only Jesus knows why you get so defensive about it because it's completely okay to use finance as a weapon to overtake the competition. Chelsea and City did the same after all
You are really trying to squirrel me by saying that Shaw is going to United over Chelsea because only United met Southamptons exaggerated valuation and it has nothing to do with wages at all despite the fact that nearly every media outlet has him agreeing to a very lucrative contract with United. Nonetheless, I will make it very clear to you why my assumption is fair-
1) Chelsea have cash to spend especially after Luiz sale. Around £150m
2) Chelsea need a LB
3) Chelsea have long been admirers of Luke Shaw
So it's pretty logical to draw from this that they would have been willing to spend £30m on a player they greatly admire despite him being only 18 years old because they know he can give them 10+ years of service. The problem is the wages. Why is wages the problem? Because once you give someone a lucrative contract, it becomes impossible to move him on. Even if you pay £30m for someone and still offer him an average contract, at least you can move him on even if you have to take a loss. In the earlier scenario, you can't and he becomes a drain on your resources.
After the Torres debacle, their has been a noticeable shift in Chelsea policy where they refuse to offer exorbitant wages any more because of the huge FFP hit they have to suffer year after year if the transfer fails. At least if they don't offer exorbitant wages, they can move the player on, take the hit for one season and move on instead of having to suffer it year after year. That was the main sticking point I believe which led Chelsea to apparently go for a more short-term measure in Filipe Luis
But since you love links so much - http://metro.co.uk/2014/06/10/manch...ansfer-race-with-160000-a-week-offer-4756168/
Thats something I found after a literally 5 second search on Google. I am pretty sure I can find more. But nonethless, if you are just going to ignore everything I say until I give you an article that explicitly states that 'Chelsea were ready to met Shaw's valuation but wages deterred them' then their is no point continuing. I have based my argument from what I can interpret from several different articles that is based on a solid foundation
And again, I really don't know why you are so defensive about it
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Muhhaa
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End of story, Shaw & his family saw that Chelsea act like **** to young players and preferred United. ./closed.
Agreed. United act really well with young players ... Can't dispute that. A brilliant example would probably be Pogba. More to the point though, Shaw will be ready to step into the first-team if he comes at Chelsea so it's not like he will have to wait for his chance or something like McEachran or Chalobah. If he did have to, you have a point
Oh... my... god.... literally beyond words. You name like 1 in 100 who United haven't been successful with when it comes to youth. Don't even try and compare us to Chelsea in that regard.
Oh and for your own information, despite what you will want to believe, SAF said he had already gone behind their backs with his agent and had contact with Juventus... them bridges were burnt... you can't go back then... especially under someone like SAF who doesn't stand for any ****,
M
Muhhaa
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United were fair with Pogba, he was talented but not ready yet. His agent was a ****.
As you can see from my entire post, I wasn't comparing Chelsea and United in that regard. Just pointing out that the particular argument really doesn't apply in the case of Shaw
Agreed mate. Still a bit hilarious how they went back to Juventus after a season and were quoted £60m. Then again Chelsea did the same with Matic so meh
Wait, what? After he left you, he basically walked straight into the Juve team and immediately established himself in a far, far stronger midfield. It's not like he left United, was developed in cup games for 2/3 years and then made the first team: he was good enough to start at United when he left.
wkdsoul
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He left United, due to Rafael starting games in CM ahead of him, being a sticking point. The agent probably didnt help either, but this **** him off more.
Yep, I understand that. This guy is trying to pass Pogba off as a raw, unpolished talent though, which he wasn't.
Did Matic want to leave or did manager sell him?
Oh, btw, this is Manchester United. Globally most followed club on almost every continent. It has biggest value on the market, biggest brand in sports world, even more than NYY or LAL. United's 100% stock value is expected to be worth more than 5 billions. 5.000.000.000 in numbers. You can buy my whole country for that money. Funny, that's only 1% and 3.33% how much America and Russia spends on weapons on yearly base. That has nothing to do with United, but it's a cool fact.
So imagine how much money can United offer for wages? It's not just pure money from the club, it's the sponsors and all other ****.
And even even without money factor, it's still Manchester ******* United, one of the biggest and most successful clubs in history. If United seriously want a player, there's a big chance he'll get him. Only way United lost Lucas and Hazard is because SAF didn't want to pay hefty agent fee. He was right and wrong. Agents are getting to much money, but that's the time we're living at. United needs to adopt, just like it did 20 years ago.
People forget that United was 'first' in England to spend enormous money to get players. You can argue it's Uniteds money, but still, spending big was never the problem. That's why I don't get United fans who slate Chelsea and City for their money. I like how both of those clubs are projects, they are not play toys, they never were. However, they will almost certain always be second choice to United when comes to players, if the given money is around the same. Accept that, just like I accept that what Real wants, Real gets. It's simple as that, lifestyle in Spain is amazing, only blind love for United would stop someone from moving there. Especially when you get older and want to start a family.
/pointless self-discussion over
I completely accept everything you say mate. I just feel that whatever happens, CL will be a factor in a players decision. How big a factor depends on the player. For example, Hazard wasn't ready to consider any club which wasn't in the CL when he made his move. That's why Chelsea weren't even mentioned until they won the CL. This is something which I have repeated a lot but many people are happy to straw man me and say 'Oh Alcaraz said no player will come to United without CL hahahahaha'. Not true
I just find it frustrating how some people still have this arrogance about them .... 'Oh we could have gotten Kroos easily but LVG said no' or 'Pogba was all ours until we decided to pull the plug'. Arrogance which is even worse when you consider the season United just had
Anyways just to make myself clear, I agree with what you said. Chelsea/City will always be second to the likes of United/Liverpool in certain aspects. Again how much these aspects weigh in a players decision making calculus when he makes a move depends on the player. It's obvious that to someone like Hazard, money and CL was more important than playing for a club with tradition and history. It's obvious that for Shaw, money is more important than playing for how boyhood club. Fair enough. I don't see anything wrong with it. I just wish people would stop being so defensive and accept things as you did
And manager sold Matic
wkdsoul
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Yeah but with Hazard being a forgeigner surely the traditional/historical clubs to him would be the clubs from his childhood, not another country? For families and people the 'big team' at the time is always a rotating influence, was liverpool, was united, with the age Hazard is when he started paying attention to the prem could have been 04/05 05/06 when he was 16/17 so the big club was Chelsea, back to back winners?
not that i dont think hes a money grabbing git, using chelsea and a madrid stepping stone, just playing devils advocate,
How is he a money grabbing git? He chose Chelsea because we could give him the most playing time. If he was truly a money grabber, he would have gone to City and accepted more competition.
As for the stepping stone aspect, who cares? I remember saying at the time, it's a win win situation for us.
And yet. United could reasonably had 2 of them. What you think anyone isnt is going to have to pay £60m for Pogba?
United took themselves out of the running, then Arsenal rejected contact (thats when Wenger spoke to him)
Except it does. United are constantly near the top of the 5 leagues in Europe when comes to young players. Only a fool picks out an exception and uses it as the rule. Awful point to make