The Manchester United Thread

zzeezzy said:
How many times, Otamendi was better than him last season, best CB in La Liga.
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Which doesn't mean **** all.

A lot easier to be defending, when you're not playing for a team that gets instantly booed if it actually tries defending.

zzeezzy said:
He was a huge part of Valencia achieving CL place. I don't see how this equates as 'he doesn't have **** on Ramos'?
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You don't see how being huge part of team that "achieved CL place", doesn't have **** of being huge part of a team that achieved: World Cup, Euro 2 times, Champions League and La Liga 3 times?

Okay.
 
[video=youtube;M2SbZJNfX0M]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2SbZJNfX0M[/video]
 
Tyton said:
Which doesn't mean **** all.

A lot easier to be defending, when you're not playing for a team that gets instantly booed if it actually tries defending.
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Sorry but doesn't that sum it all up? It's a lot easier to be a defender in a team that doesn't hardly have to do it because they are always on the front foot in games apart from the odd big team here and there. I don't see how defending at Madrid is harder than defending at Valencia, they are a much smaller team who have done well to get top 4. Most teams in La Liga give them a good game, most teams against Madrid show up and get a pummelling.
 
Oh and about the Ramos has won all this ****.... it doesn't mean anything..... sure he has played a small part but that Spain side was one of the best ever. Otamendi is hardly going to have all them honours when he is playing for inferior teams.
 
What the..... How come people are belittling players achievements now?

To be a starter in a world cup winning team is amazing. When you add that hes a starter in league and champions league winning teams surely you have to give credit?
 
Think its time people put this otamendi/ramos debate to bed for a bit, either one is a good signing so just see what happens
 
sunilvk7 said:
Yeah, he can easily add 10 goals in a season when the highest he ever scored in a season was 7.
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Add some assists and excellent counters he starts and you've got yourself 10.

sunilvk7 said:
Anyways it's sort of weird to argue on attacking qualities of a CB.
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Er, you were making a case that he's rushing out needlesly. Clearly quite often its beneficial to the team, so I don't see why is it suddenly weird to discuss it.
 
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Tyton said:
Add some assists and excellent counters he starts and you've got yourself 10.
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Does that include him playing a quick pass to Ronaldo around the half way line then him taking on 5 players before scoring? :P
 
Average Joe said:
What the..... How come people are belittling players achievements now?

To be a starter in a world cup winning team is amazing. When you add that hes a starter in league and champions league winning teams surely you have to give credit?
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It means nothing when the other player you are comparing to has been in inferior teams and doesn't have the possibility of winning them, it doesn't really mean anything as regards to comparing player to player now. We can only go off the present and what we have seen recently, honestly Otamendi was better last season in the same league playing in an inferior team.
 
zzeezzy said:
Oh and about the Ramos has won all this ****.... it doesn't mean anything.
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Dude you're the one who always whines to sign proven players. Then when proven player is possibly available, you're whining that being a proven player doesn't mean anything.

Have you by any chance been diagnosed with split personality disorder?
 
zzeezzy, you were just arguing yesterday that we need to sign a high quality CB in order to win the premier league. Ramos is a high quality CB, probably the highest quality, so why the **** are you complaining?

Also you were saying how every team has a high quality CB to help them win trophies and now you suddenly don't care because he had a quality team around him. please make up your mind.
 
Tyton said:
Dude you're the one who always whines to sign proven players. Then when proven player is possibly available, you're whining that being a proven player doesn't mean anything.

Have you by any chance been diagnosed with split personality disorder?
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I don't remember saying I want highly decorated players, I've always wanted the right signings in the right positions.

Infact I've said repeatedly we should have a policy which signs the player 'before' they go onto the big clubs and then sell for high prices. Such as Vidal at Leverkusen, Griezzmann at Sociedad, Di Maria at Benfica etc. you get the idea. That has always been my take and preferred approach of how we should buy players.

We've recently started doing it again in a way with players like Depay and Darmian.
 
zzeezzy said:
I don't remember saying I want highly decorated players, I've always wanted the right signings in the right positions.

Infact I've said repeatedly we should have a policy which signs the player 'before' they go onto the big clubs and then sell for high prices. Such as Vidal at Leverkusen, Griezzmann at Sociedad, Di Maria at Benfica etc. you get the idea. That has always been my take and preferred approach of how we should buy players.

We've recently started doing it again in a way with players like Depay and Darmian.
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So you want us to be a feeder club? Got it.
 
zzeezzy said:
It means nothing when the other player you are comparing to has been in inferior teams and doesn't have the possibility of winning them, it doesn't really mean anything as regards to comparing player to player now. We can only go off the present and what we have seen recently, honestly Otamendi was better last season in the same league playing in an inferior team.
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You could argue the other way also. Otamendi has more opportunity to show his defensive ability in a team like Valencia. So would appear the better defender. I dont know the stats but id bet Otamendi has higher completetion rates in tackles won, aerial duels won, interceptions and so on, simply because he has more chances per game to perform them than Ramos. Just like Ramos will more than likely have a better pass completion rate, more key passes, chances created, assists and goals.

You can swing statistics and whatnot which ever way you want to suit your argument regarding both players so its irrelevent.

Both are good players. One has proven it time and time again. One needs that chance to prove he can be just as good. Swings and roundabouts.
 
Tyton said:
Add some assists and excellent counters he starts and you've got yourself 10.



Er, you were making a case that he's rushing out needlesly. Clearly quite often its beneficial to the team, so I don't see why is it suddenly weird to discuss it.
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I was talking about him rushing out when defending and leaving gaps like sort of Jones and David Luiz does. Nothing to do with attacking at all.
 
Puddz said:
zzeezzy, you were just arguing yesterday that we need to sign a high quality CB in order to win the premier league. Ramos is a high quality CB, probably the highest quality, so why the **** are you complaining?

Also you were saying how every team has a high quality CB to help them win trophies and now you suddenly don't care because he had a quality team around him. please make up your mind.
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I have never said I don't want Ramos, I'm just saying why I think Otamendi is the better signing now. Simple.

Although I still think transfer fee is way over the top, if we get him, going to be paying at the very least £42m.
 
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