Fair enough but we've got to be realistic and ruthless from now on, if we want to seriously improve and have success under the next manager. I'm not just basing it off today really, a lot of those mentioned have not been good enough for a long time. We've had like this cycle of players (majority I mentioned, not all) under 3/4 managers now and we've achieved nothing really other than a few domestic cups. Sure there is the Europa League as well but we got a very fortunate run of games and were a John Guidetti open goal miss from going out.
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Fair enough but we've got to be realistic and ruthless from now on, if we want to seriously improve and have success under the next manager. I'm not just basing it off today really, a lot of those mentioned have not been good enough for a long time. We've had like this cycle of players (majority I mentioned, not all) under 3/4 managers now and we've achieved nothing really other than a few domestic cups. Sure there is the Europa League as well but we got a very fortunate run of games and were a John Guidetti open goal miss from going out.
You are not going to get rid of 9 players. Because here's the thing: You would need to replace the bodies, and you want to do so with quality, whether its quality experience or quality youth, and that takes money. Even United dont want to needlessly spent money.
Pereira (you've been moaning about how we dont use him all season)
Fellaini (sell)
McTominay (decent young back up)
Sanchez (who is going to buy him?) Valencia (get rid at end of season)
Young (great servant, still good enough for squad)
Mata (more than good enough for squad/first team)
Darmian (going back to italy)
Jones (better to sell Rojo)
Fellaini (sell)
McTominay (decent young back up)
Sanchez (who is going to buy him?) Valencia (get rid at end of season)
Young (great servant, still good enough for squad)
Mata (more than good enough for squad/first team)
Darmian (going back to italy)
Jones (better to sell Rojo)
Theatre of Dreams83
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Some of those reasons are a bit naff Mike. "better to sell rojo' isn't a reason to keep Jones honestly. They both need to go if you ask me, Rojo has stolen a living this season doing next to nothing. Yeah I've been moaning about Pereira because he has talent but is a lost cause now, I think he is going to go so kinda given up on him making it here.
Mata is really done here in my opinion, too many people get caught up in sentinels and that he's a nice guy off the pitch. His last several performances haven't been good enough and I think he has well and truly had his day at United. Good in the final third on his day, but doesn't do enough to fit in this type of pressing team we're trying to have.
Scouseinthehouse
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The problem with flipping so many would be far greater than even that in so far as the impact of the most important part of any football club. The changies. Many ‘fans’, naturally as is the nature of fandom, rarely if ever consider the person behind the player. And all the vital, inter-connected relationships within that. You go cull a number like that, all in one go, or even start leaving out experienced, well liked veterens right now as has been mooted, and you seriously risk messing up the changing room dynamic and losing the club.
This isn’t directed at you z, but WAY too many now think transfers are like doing it on a video game and don’t consider the human element at all.
This. There is a reason why the dressing room atmosphere matters. You need to have people who are liked and who get the club in it. Plus, that experience helps.
They aren't naff. Unlike you, I actually think with realism. You sell both defenders, you then need to sign two defenders of better calibre to make it worth it. This isnt football manager pal
Honest to god, I despair at some of the back and white thinking in football these days, these guys are not just footballers, they are people, mates, with lives. There's a reason why many transfers take a while, its not just the finances
Also mata has never been more successful at any club more than he's been here. And Mata can absolutely press. Has everyone forgotten how aggressive he was under LVG and early Jose? I'd be inclined to shift him into central midfield a la Silva and Silva
If a club with our scouting network can't find a defender better than Jones or Rojo to sign then we mayswell pack it in.
Let me get this straight, we should retain these players because they are 'human' and 'mates'?????? ****** professional footballers who aren't cutting their way and most of them are coming to end of contract. Why do they deserve any new contracts at all????????
Don't get me wrong I get the whole dressing room atmosphere aspect but for how long do we accept mediocrity in order to move some of these guys on???
I get that perhaps I was a bit O.T.T with the amount of players, but no one can seriously think that any of them are worth keeping much longer.
You retain some of then if you actually dont some of your major players to not hate you. And because its ******* expensive.
For example, why would you get rid of Mctominay and Periera, who are free and homegrown, to replace them with expensive bench fillers? That's utterly mental
And yes at least 5 of the players you mention are worth keeping
Scouseinthehouse
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z, if you can step away from being a typical ‘Sky generation, we MUST buy the best in every position and buy them NOW!’ type of ‘fan’ for a moment, question for you?
You like and want Pochetino right? So in this hypothetical, BANG! Wish granted, he’s Utd’s manager.
Now I presume you believe he’s a top coach right? So why would you think he can’t teach and coach these lads and inprove them as players? That’s a coaches job after all.
You’ve just come off the archytyple, short term ‘cheque book manager’ who you detested. And claim you want a proper coach in his place. So let him do a big part of that remit and work with the lads he inherits to improve them and by association the overall squad. And add bits in stages as you go. Yanno, being as you steadfastly want to ‘build this the right way’ and all
You can’t have it all ways when it suits mate. If you want to things done right, you need to have the paitience to see it through in stages and treat what you have at any particular time with respect whilst they’re a part of the football club.
You like and want Pochetino right? So in this hypothetical, BANG! Wish granted, he’s Utd’s manager.
Now I presume you believe he’s a top coach right? So why would you think he can’t teach and coach these lads and inprove them as players? That’s a coaches job after all.
You’ve just come off the archytyple, short term ‘cheque book manager’ who you detested. And claim you want a proper coach in his place. So let him do a big part of that remit and work with the lads he inherits to improve them and by association the overall squad. And add bits in stages as you go. Yanno, being as you steadfastly want to ‘build this the right way’ and all
You can’t have it all ways when it suits mate. If you want to things done right, you need to have the paitience to see it through in stages and treat what you have at any particular time with respect whilst they’re a part of the football club.
I think Pereira will not sign a contract and leave anyway, that's the only way he was on my list because I think he doesn't want to be here much longer. McTominay is one of the worst united youth products I've seen for quite a while that have had the amount of first team games under his belt. What is he even especially good at? I don't want to hate on him but we need better rotation in terms of quality for that midfield. When Pogba and Matic (under Ole) goes from this midfield, so does all our quality seemingly.
I think that most of you will see next season if that list of players are still here why we should of moved them on. I'm not going to blow my own trumpet but when there was this big debate here several months ago who is better Jones or Smalling? Virtually everyone apart from myself and one or two others were saying Smalling is always the more reliable of the two. If Jones isn't injured he's an error away from costing us a goal.
Anyway lets see how we get on with Spurs next Sunday because that is where the real test lies for Ole so far. I'm glad that he admitted if we play anything like we did today they'll beat us. I personally don't think that the Newcastle level of performance would be good enough for Spurs. We need to put in a performance like the first 3 games under Ole.
Hold on Scouse, I never said we needed to replace them with world-class quality did I? most of the players I mentioned are coming to end of contract. I agree with you about Pochettino but these players are either past it due to age, won't suit his style or have had too many chances (like Jones and making us concede needless goals).
I wan Pochettino to come in and work with the players that I believe deserve it and will thrive under him. I'm not wanting any big-money signings other than Koulibaly because he's one of the very few CB's like Van Dijk type of attitude in world football.
Let me give an example, I'd rather see Jones gone next season and Tuanzebe here rather than seeing all the current CB's we have keeping him on the periphery again. Most likely meaning he goes out on loan once again or just leaves.
Scouseinthehouse
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I’ll give you some living, breathing examples right back. Was Milner past it when Klopp inherited him? Lallana? Lovren? Henderson? All still mainstays at Anfield. The jobs the likes of Joe Allen and Lucas did early helping to take us to two major finals that first year? I could go on but these were all players many L’pool fans wanted binning in the same way you’re completely dismissing Utd lads here.
You work with what you have and work with them to try make them into better players until you can bring in significantly better as you inprove as a club.
What was one of the key values your greatest ever manager stuck by through his life? As big a **** as he could be at times ..... Loyalty. You can’t expext these lads to go out and give you everything if you you haven’t treated them right and given them an equal chance. It’s basic human relationships thatbare so integral to a team.
If Pochetino’s the man you thibk he is, he’d be of the same values if he got the job. If he isn’t, you’re basically asking for someone cut from Mourinho’s cloth.
You work with what you have and work with them to try make them into better players until you can bring in significantly better as you inprove as a club.
What was one of the key values your greatest ever manager stuck by through his life? As big a **** as he could be at times ..... Loyalty. You can’t expext these lads to go out and give you everything if you you haven’t treated them right and given them an equal chance. It’s basic human relationships thatbare so integral to a team.
If Pochetino’s the man you thibk he is, he’d be of the same values if he got the job. If he isn’t, you’re basically asking for someone cut from Mourinho’s cloth.
We can't keep everyone just so they can get yet another chance under a new manager. I'd much rather we see some of these moving on and Pochettino working with some more of the youth on the fringes of first team next season week in week out, rather than seeing the likes of Valencia/Jones/Rojo/ etc.
I don't really want us to totally follow Klopp anyway because in my opinion he took a season or two too long to get those players out before making the much needed additions you needed from the start of his reign. Such as goalkeeper and centre-back, which pretty much backs up what I'm saying.
I don't really want us to totally follow Klopp anyway because in my opinion he took a season or two too long to get those players out before making the much needed additions you needed from the start of his reign. Such as goalkeeper and centre-back, which pretty much backs up what I'm saying.
Nope. Champions League and Europa League with Chelsea, PFA team of the year under Benitez, PL top assists under Benitez. Never got anywhere close to that kind of performance or trophy chest in 5 years with you.
Anthony
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The manager has to go!!
A club like ours just cant sit on our hands and let this bullshit continue? Five wins out of five against relegation fodder is just not good enough!!
The REAL Manchester United under Fergie would have gotten at least 7 wins out of 5!!
I'm out.
I mean his performances, got more goals and assists, and created more chances than he did at Chelsea, in less games and less minutes.