The Manchester United Thread

Looks like I have missed lot of football news this week.

RVP making some noise and I haven't read full quote either, Kagawa saying we are playing long ball game and Barca signing Halilovic.

What Kagawa said was spot on but shame that it would only get him into more trouble. Not sure how Moyes can improve our performances at all, he is looking way out of his depth and teams with lot inferior players are looking so comfortable on the ball and playing some good football.

1 season without CL isn't the end of the world but if things don't start to improve at the start of the next season then he has to go but the problem is we might miss out on some good managers if they are available in the summer.
 
Would love to see how Michael Laudrup would set us up tactically, I can't help but imagine a fluid front four of Van Persie, Rooney, Kagawa and Mata.
 
1798596_593624664057245_1654486432_n.jpg


lol
 
sunilvk7 said:
Looks like I have missed lot of football news this week.

RVP making some noise and I haven't read full quote either, Kagawa saying we are playing long ball game and Barca signing Halilovic.

What Kagawa said was spot on but shame that it would only get him into more trouble. Not sure how Moyes can improve our performances at all, he is looking way out of his depth and teams with lot inferior players are looking so comfortable on the ball and playing some good football.

1 season without CL isn't the end of the world but if things don't start to improve at the start of the next season then he has to go but the problem is we might miss out on some good managers if they are available in the summer.
Click to expand...

Thing is ... It could very well be more than one season. Liverpool, Chelsea, City and Arsenal are already better than United and they will only look to improve their squads in the summer if they retain a place in the CL
 
Alcaraz said:
Thing is ... It could very well be more than one season. Liverpool, Chelsea, City and Arsenal are already better than United and they will only look to improve their squads in the summer if they retain a place in the CL
Click to expand...


Not really, Liverpool currently benefits a great deal from not having mid-week game. They will need to improve the squad significantly if they hope to compete on all fronts next year.

Similarly I'd argue best thing for United right now is to bust out of europa league spot. This will allow Moyes to just focus on BPL , offload all the deadwood and rebuild the squad much more aggressively.
 
Tyton said:
Not really, Liverpool currently benefits a great deal from not having mid-week game. They will need to improve the squad significantly if they hope to compete on all fronts next year.

Similarly I'd argue best thing for United right now is to bust out of europa league spot. This will allow Moyes to just focus on BPL , offload all the deadwood and rebuild the squad much more aggressively.
Click to expand...

But on the other hand, they will also suddenly have a great deal lot more money due to the CL which will allow them to improve their depth massively
 
Tyton said:
Not really, Liverpool currently benefits a great deal from not having mid-week game. They will need to improve the squad significantly if they hope to compete on all fronts next year.

Similarly I'd argue best thing for United right now is to bust out of europa league spot. This will allow Moyes to just focus on BPL , offload all the deadwood and rebuild the squad much more aggressively.
Click to expand...

Our team is as good as any team maybe except City. Problem is elsewhere.

Rooney, RVP, Mata, Januzaj/Kagawa. That's a top 4 better than anyone in the league, just that the one who is managing is, is not good enough at the moment.

While other teams try to improve, we will also spend and improve and even without CL our revenue is better than anyone in the league, so that's not at all a problem.
 
sunilvk7 said:
Our team is as good as any team maybe except City. Problem is elsewhere.

Rooney, RVP, Mata, Januzaj/Kagawa. That's a top 4 better than anyone in the league, just that the one who is managing is, is not good enough at the moment.

While other teams try to improve, we will also spend and improve and even without CL our revenue is better than anyone in the league, so that's not at all a problem.
Click to expand...

Definitely got to wonder who would buy in to what Moyes is doing here though. Not only that but no CL, all the really good players out there will surely have better offers.

Our best hope I'd imagine is signing young highly talented players, but even they will be hard. The likes of Carvalho, Shaw, Griezmann, etc.

There is not a hope in **** we will be getting Vidal or Kroos... they are the best players in the world who will not be wanting to come to this mess, currently.

Most frustrating thing is I've said all a long that we have the players to be playing much better, if it was one or two playing under themselves then you could point the finger at them, but as it's so many players who are playing poor... the blame is going to the manager and the coaching staff.
 
Tyton said:
Not really, Liverpool currently benefits a great deal from not having mid-week game. They will need to improve the squad significantly if they hope to compete on all fronts next year.

Similarly I'd argue best thing for United right now is to bust out of europa league spot. This will allow Moyes to just focus on BPL , offload all the deadwood and rebuild the squad much more aggressively.
Click to expand...
I really don't get all this business about not wanting Europa League football. For big clubs it may seem to be a distraction, but surely then you can just play your youngsters in it, giving them a chance on the big stage? If they lose, there's no problem; if they win, then you get more money. It's a win-win situation.
 
WOES?

Manchester United have been struggling this season, and one of the major problems is a lack of goals from open play. United have had to rely on goals from set pieces since putting 4 past Swansea on the opening day of the season, and Phil from Live Life United believes the reintroduction of Wayne Rooney may be part of this problem.
Since Wayne Rooney returned to the starting line-up following the 4-1 win against Swansea, Manchester United failed to registered an open play goal in the Premier League, with this unwanted record continuing in the 2-1 defeat against West Brom Albion this weekend.


In a country where power is appreciated over technic, running over positioning, tackling over tactical intelligence and directness over possession, Rooney has been hyped up for possessing these ‘ideal’ qualities. In last 5 matches,Rooney has been hailed by pundits, journalists and fans for his good performances due to his non-stop running, determination and work rate. With Rooney scoring 3 goals via free kick in last 3 matches, all this has served as a smokescreen, for Rooney struggles the #10 role .
If we analyse Rooney’s stats from the past 5 Premier League matches, he has made 34 long passes and only 4 through balls with an average pass accuracy rate of only 74%, very poor for someone playing as a playmaker.
Rooney has been unable to provide any threat in between the lines as he does not have the quick feet and quick thinking to play in most congested area.When there were opposition players around him, he’s been poor holding up the ball and finds himself unable to escape with the ball to create openings.
Due to his limitation, Rooney’s frequently drops deep to find himself a little bit of space, thus playing long diagonal ball to the wingers hence the whopping 34 long passes, not good enough for a player whose primary role is to inflict damage higher up the pitch.
With Rooney unable to offer any options and threat through the middle, United have opt to attack through horribly out of form wingers. Unfortunately something easily dealt with by defending deep and limiting the space at the byline so that our wingers and fullbacks have difficulty providing quality crosses.
As a result, United have looked short of ideas and penetration in the final third of the pitch, with opposition teams easily stifling United’s predictable attacking play.
Following United’s 2-1 defeat to West Brom, David Moyes admitted:
“We lacked an intensity and spark to our game, and in the end they deserved the win, I can’t argue with that. In the first half we had a lot of the ball and tried to move it – we probably controlled a lot of the game – but I thought for all our possession we didn’t create a lot of opportunities. And when we did, we didn’t take them.”
​
“Possession without cutting edge” is a recurring theme for his side since taking over the helm from Sir Alex and with the 2-1 defeat to West Brom, Moyes has said that he needed to evaluate the players at his disposal. The problem is that he has been chopping and changing all the outfield players… except Wayne Rooney.
He made a number of changes in the second half but left Rooney on, even though he had one of his poorer games so far and seemed short of ideas playing in the hole. The decision to sub off Shinji Kagawa at half time instead of moving him inside and pushing Rooney to the left or higher up was confusing, especially as Kagawa was one of the players likely to create something, with Nani.

During the 4-1 defeat against Manchester City, Moyes played Rooney in the hole with Welbeck ahead of him. It proved to be disaster as Van Persie has been compensating for Wayne Rooney’s shortcomings in that area with his technical abilities. If Welbeck was played behind Wayne Rooney against City, I believe it will make a whole lot of different in that match with Welbeck better equipped to beat opponents in that area.
The problem with Wayne Rooney is that he is not a #9 type of striker who playing high up the pitch looking to make a run behind the opposition back four as he likes to drop deep nor he is a playmaker or ”trequartista”with the guile, craft and technical abilities to impose damage in between the line as he lacks the touch, the hold up play or the quick feet to skip past defenders in the most crowded area on the pitch.
Wayne Rooney is still a very good all around player but I don’t think he is suited to be playing as a playmaker, David Moyes needs to find the best position for Rooney and the best way to utilise his strengths but clearly, his strengths are not made for the role of #10.
As an alternative, perhaps David Moyes should start utilising Shinji Kagawa more in the #10 role.
Sir Alex had been trying hard to bring in a playmaker toward the end of his tenure, as can be seen in his pursuit of Wesley Sneijder, the best #10 at that time. Missing out on him, in the end managed to bring in Shinji Kagawa who was named the best player in Bundesliga for the past 2 seasons.
Sir Alex’s transfer activity clearly showed that he was aware of the weakness in that area for United, and he thus attempted to rectify it.
Kagawa debut season was interrupted by injury, this year he is keen to make up for lost ground. Perhaps Moyes should give him the chance to.





I know it's a bit old article but I still really question where this team is going with Rooney in it. (Particularly when he somehow justifies constantly no matter what being in the no.10 role).
 
Last edited:
[h=1]TIME ISN’T THE GREAT HEALER FOR MANCHESTER UNITED[/h]WRITTEN BY JON WILMOT ON MARCH 1, 2014. POSTED IN BLOGS

“You’ll get plenty of time lad, don’t worry”

Last year, when Sir Alex Ferguson finally decided to call time on his tenure at Manchester United, the tributes to him, naturally, poured in. The footballing fraternity fell over themselves to pay homage to a man who had stamped his identity onto the club with such unremitting force, it seemed impossible to imagine anyone else at the helm.
In all of those tributes, two words shone through above all others. Genius. Unique. There are few who would disagree with those terms; even those who despise the club would most likely, if pushed hard enough, begrudgingly accept those glowing adjectives were merited.
Unique, in particular, is a word I keep returning to now. Following Ferguson was not only a daunting challenge, it was unparalleled in world football. No other elite club on the planet had one man in charge for such a duration, and the task facing his successor was inevitably a monumental one. It has become increasingly apparent that the demands were so high there was a need for a manager of repute; one with a redoubtable CV and the swaggering self-belief to instil and retain faith in difficult times, and provide comforting evidence he could, and would, turn things around should the need arise.
That United chose a different path is well-documented. So far, it’s been a failure. No-one would disagree how abysmal the season has been. The woeful capitulation to a desperately mediocre Olympiakos this week merely encapsulated the months that preceded it; the team constricted by archaic tactics, a notable lack of leadership, ponderous passing, and miserable individual performances. Perhaps the most worrying thing of all was the apathetic attitude of the players: their disinterest and distinct lack of effort remains the abiding memory of the game. No movement, no closing down, no desire to drag themselves back into the match. All the hall-marks of Ferguson’s era have faded alarmingly. The entire performance, coupled with Van Persie’s disparaging comments after the match – as well as various other rumblings over the season – leaves the inescapable impression that the players are losing all belief in the manager.
Yet as United stagger from one aimless performance to the next, as fans’ reaction morphs from anger to disbelief to resigned acceptance, the same mantra is heard: the manager needs more time. Gary Neville has spoken on this issue this week:
“The way in which Manchester United have always worked is to give the manager time and I believe in that philosophy. Managers are getting sacked after 70 days but to even think of sacking a manager after seven months is nonsense, so I think [United] will support Moyes.
You look at the people on the board, and we’re talking about the Glazer family and whether they’ve ever been put in this position before. I don’t think for one second it will be crossing their minds at this moment in time.
I truly believe Moyes will get given the opportunity at Manchester United to complete his work. The people who are there believe in the philosophy around the club.
It probably jars against what most clubs are doing these days but, that’s the Manchester United way and always has been and they would have to change that philosophy. I have to say at another football club, whether it be Chelsea – we saw with Andre Villas-Boas who was sacked – or Tottenham, Moyes would be in a lot more trouble.”
Neville is right. Such a drastic decline would have seen Moyes fail to last the season at any other top club, either in this country or abroad. And while there are mitigating factors – mainly a squad that is still too reliant on ageing defenders and mediocre midfielders – the problems are nowhere near as severe as has been portrayed. They are the current champions. They have had ?70m worth of talent added to the ranks. United should comfortably qualify for the Champions League places rather languishing in sixth or seventh place. The players have under-performed, but it is the manager who has fallen short.
As Neville states though, the indication from the club still seems to be that Moyes is secure in his post. This premise – that he simply needs more time – comes from the idealised notion that United are not a club who sack managers, that stability and longevity are philosophies synonymous with the club. It’s even been pointed out that the last time they fired a manager was 28 years ago.
It’s a skewed train of thought. That statistic is singularly based on the fact Ferguson’s reign endured for so long. The idea that another manager will replicate his success simply by hanging around long enough entirely misses the point of all those tributes: Ferguson was unique. A one-off. The chances of finding someone to deliver a similar level of impact are miniscule, if not non-existent, and expecting or hoping that will happen by simply giving him the same amount of time in charge is nothing short of ludicrous.
The criteria for judging a manager should only ever be based on one factor: performance. It has to be results-driven but it’s more than that: he has to demonstrate progression, and convince that, whether now or with a reinforced squad, he will achieve the required level of success. The history of the club becomes largely irrelevant in this matter. Supporting a manager and backing him unequivocally are the correct things to do but always with one caveat: make sure you’re backing the right horse.
Moreover, the idea that United have always had managers for long periods of time is a fallacy. As a club, we have been privileged to have experienced both Matt Busby and Ferguson in charge, but they are the exceptions rather than the rule.
No-one is advocating the revolving door policy that Chelsea have adopted in the last decade. Neither do the fans want continual change. In an industry where patience has become the rarest of commodities, there is a certain pride in refusing to submit to the hire-and-fire approach demonstrated by so many clubs. But, ultimately, all that matters is what happens on the pitch. All that matters is performance. And at the moment there is not of shred of evidence it will significantly improve under the current leadership. And while it should be acknowledged there are deficiencies within the squad, Moyes has merely exacerbated them.
Comparable examples can be sought both in this country and across Europe of teams who have changed manager this season: Bayern Munich, Real Madrid, Chelsea, Man City, and even Everton have all overseen transitions in this campaign with far greater purpose and accomplishment than United have achieved. At all of those clubs, even in a period of change, the manager has been able to perform convincingly.
There’s also numerous examples of clubs prematurely dispensing with managers being the correct decision. No-one would claim that Chelsea should have stuck with Andre Villas-Boas. No-one would argue that Liverpool (a club who are also rich in tradition and history) were wrong to part ways with Roy Hodgson. The mistakes were identified and rectified. I understand Gary Neville’s views, and I agree with some of what he says, but even he cannot believe Paulo Di Canio should have been given longer at Sunderland.
The idea, therefore, that merely more time will be the solution to United’s woes is flawed. While it is true that any new manager requires patience to implement his ideas and some leeway to stamp his authority on the team he inherits, there has to be
confidence in what he is doing, belief that he is able to elevate the club back to the standards they should be operating at. Unfortunately, Moyes hasn’t provided that.
United will be better next season, even if Moyes survives the summer. They may cement themselves back into the top four, or challenge for silverware. But in the crucial matches and moments when trophies are won and lost, it can often boil down to the impact of the manager. There’s little to suggest Moyes, even with better players, has the attributes to prevent United ultimately falling short. His record, while at Everton, of no wins in 64 away matches against the top four is corroboration of that. As the manager of United he will improve; it’s just highly doubtful he’ll improve enough.
At present, it appears the only thing keeping Moyes secure is a desire for stability. If that is the reason, then it makes little sense. The only criteria should be whether the Glazers remain confident Moyes will, sooner rather than later, deliver glory and success back to Old Trafford. If they do retain that faith, then it surely cannot be based on the evidence of this season.
 
The idea of wanting our team to lose in the hope the manager gets sacked is appalling. That's all I will say.
 
Mike. said:
The idea of wanting our team to lose in the hope the manager gets sacked is appalling. That's all I will say.
Click to expand...

1. Ive actually changed my mind about wanting to lose to Lfc if it means Moyes getting the sack. Cos, judging by Lfc's position (after yesterdays' match) it may mean that they will win the EPL and I REALLY dont want that to happen (thats the understatement of the year actually).
2. Especially since Moyes, unfortunately, wont be sacked even if we do lose (by a big score or otherwise).
3. The idea that a patently unfit for the job manager (who has done nothing in his career before joining us as well as nothing since joining us to show us any hope he knows how to get us playing better more consistently) should be given time to destroy us completely is even more appalling. Especially since by winning the said matches nothing will be gained in comparison (cl places are way out of reach and, well, he's to blame for that).
 
Van Gaal and De Boer does sound very tasty though, got to admit that.
 
MANUMAD said:
1. Ive actually changed my mind about wanting to lose to Lfc if it means Moyes getting the sack. Cos, judging by Lfc's position (after yesterdays' match) it may mean that they will win the EPL and I REALLY dont want that to happen (thats the understatement of the year actually).
2. Especially since Moyes, unfortunately, wont be sacked even if we do lose (by a big score or otherwise).
3. The idea that a patently unfit for the job manager (who has done nothing in his career before joining us as well as nothing since joining us to show us any hope he knows how to get us playing better more consistently) should be given time to destroy us completely is even more appalling. Especially since by winning the said matches nothing will be gained in comparison (cl places are way out of reach and, well, he's to blame for that).
Click to expand...
Trophies are not the only measure of a manager's success, so it's inaccurate to say that Moyes has done nothing in his career pre-United. He's done wonders on a small budget at Everton, albeit without winning a single trophy.
 
TheFalse9 said:
Us and Spurs were bigger clubs than Ajax, in terms of budget and squad quality, than Ajax when he was approached.
Click to expand...

Yes but no offence to Liverpool and Spurs but United is a totally different machine at the moment. Ok this season has been ***** for us but if anything that makes it even more appealing as a project.

Plus the fact that IF the stories are true, he would be coming with a fellow Dutch icon in Van Gaal.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

FMBase

Beta

Resources

Back
Top