Tactical problems

[duca015]

Ok, to diregard that you are actually playing with Milan which has some specific players that may or may not be able to do what you want them to do, lets start with basics...

First of, look at the instruction of players, for roles that you chosen for them...

FB-sup for both wings are ok, if this is what you want. CD-def, this could be problem. When you give them CD -def instructions, they are instructed to hold the line. Cover role mean they are meant to be always behind ball, and them to tackle hard on player with ball. Stopper role mean that they ought to pursuit ball and leave the line. When you have DM in front of the line, they are even more inclined to hold the line so when the ball is in area between defense and midfield four, they push back, so they do not close down nearest player. They do this until their anticipation and decision making tell them that it is time to close down or to make offside traps. Is this what you wanted?

Anchor man is player that will man who will close down everyone that has the ball in front of two CD-s. And he is type of player that may let the ball pas, but he wont let pass player with ball, so this mean he will make fouls in dangerous area. Is this what you wanted? In attack, he will be mainly on center, play simple passes without risk and without complication. This mean that if your midfielders are covered he will pass ball back most of time.

Your two CM-s are AP -att and BBM. BBM will come deep to get the ball, then dribble with it until he find safe pass and then he will push forward. AP will try to be between lines of opponents midfield and defense, try to receive ball there and then dribbling at defense trying to create space for pass forward or to shoot. Who will get the ball to him? And how? During transition both BBM and AP-att will be aggressive with ball, they will run with it, and look for direct pass over defense, and their only option will be on the wings which are already in line with opponent D-line. So even if this succeed, your wingers will mostly cross into empty box, as neither your BBM, or AP, and not even your TM will be on time to come to the end of cross he will be set little deeper to help to start counter attack. So here is one huge problem, your plan basically mean that you expect from your BBM to come deep to get the ball, then to find some way to deliver it to your AP, as no one else will try to do it, and your AP will be well covered by opponent as he is between the lines. After some unsuccessful tries he will then look for other options, and again, there is non, as your TM is deep in line with defense, and most of time he will not be able to keep ball between two CD-s, and your wingers are in line with opponent defense and most of time, pass behind them will not be successful.

And then your wingers. When they are on attack duty, they look to be as closer to opponent goal as possible, they look to receive ball in space run with it and cross it as soon as possible. So they are not included in build up at all, they just sit in line with defense waiting for this ball... So what are you trying to do with this setup is practically impossible to do. You have one player from who you wanted to be up and down player that try to connect everyone else that are hiding behind or in opponent defensive block.

And then your TM is sitting in line of defense, rarely he will try to move from CB-s, as he supposed to be physically dominant player that can handle this duels, receive ball, hold the ball and then pass it to near player. Only problem with this is that with this setup, all your players are far from him, they need time to come in, and he will have to keep ball much longer, while he is surrounded with at least two opposition players. So I hope you see here why this role is problem for you...

Apart from this, there is also problem that you instructed all of your four midfielders to dribble more. So this mean more risk that you will lose ball while they doing it, and then you will more often then not be caught out of position defensively. And you are not aware of this because you did not bothered to read what description of roles offer for you to read.

Now another question - do you expect to score most of your goals from crosses? Is this your goal going forward? Because this will be situation when you, somehow, manage to get to ball to opponent 30-meters you will have two overlapping FB-s and wingers on attack and at least 3 players in box (winger from opposite side, TM and AP, sometimes even BMB). Now problem with this is that you do not have (again) anyone outside box, you are committed too many players forward and your DM is far too deep to pick up ball if it was covered by defense. So this leaves you with CD-s that are pushing back, and DM that is trying to protect the middle and you are WIDE OPEN on side. Now I hope you see how this could be a problem?

 

[jee]

I don't understand why players behave the way you say...

1.- cd-de. They will hold position until their anticipation and decision making tell them that it is time to close down or to make offside trap. Of course i want that. What else can they do? Closing down like crzy losing position? Try useless ofsside traps? Go deep until they crash to my gk? I don't understand.

2.- A-de. This is exactly what i want. If the ball passes, the player can't. All my players should do that. Actually, everybody, anytime in risky positions should do that (not inside the box, of course). Attacking is also exactly what i want. Don't do strange things. Just pass the ball to the closer player and stay back to stop counters.

3.- AP and BBM. Who will get the ball to the Ap? Many players. A-de, with a short pass. BBM after coming deep to get the ball. Fb if they push forward. My w-at. My tm if we send him a long ball can pass back to my ap. If my bbm gets the ball and can't pass it to the ap because he is covered, he should pass to the wings.Then wings should run out the defense. If it is not posible, just go back and start again. That's what a rational football player should do. Do i need to instruct this to my players?
We could also send a long ball to my tm and he could pass back the ball to somebody. He has 4 (at least) options. wings, ap and bbm.

4.- Wingers. Traditionally, they have Attack duties in FM terms as they (or at least one does) make aggressive runs forward, get the ball, dribble at the fullback, beat him and cross.

5.- TM. all players are far from him. Why far? AP should be very close as he will try to be between lines of opponents midfield and defense. BBM shoud make runs forward. Wingers when they are on attack duty, they look to be as closer to opponent goal as possible,

6.- goals from crosses? Yes, that's the first and main scoring plan, as i already said.

7.- too many players forward and DM is far too deep? That's true, but shouldn't be a huge problem as although he is far too deep, i have so many players pushing forward that opponent should have nobody in the front. Otherwise, there would be many of my players free. The situation should be, 2 strikers of the opponent agains my cb and my a-de. 3 against 2. If they are trying to counter, even when they are outnumbered, just make a foul. That's ok because A- de is type of player that may let the ball pas, but he wont let pass player with ball.

For sure it is my fault, but advices i've read in this thread seem contradictory to me. All i read about fm is contradictory. People say one thing and the opposite. I understand nothing. I come here with questions and get no clear idea.

If i had to say what i learnt after 122 posts i would say nothing.

Do you know why i set this midfield trio? Because i read this:

The "AM" Triangle

The "AM" Triangle consists of DM-DM-AM or MC-MC-AM - they are fundamentally the same, but the DM's provide better protection in front of the defense, and the MC's provide better pressing of the opposition, as they are stationed higher up the pitch. This midfield set up consists of 2 more defensive players, and a more attacking player. In almost all central midfields, you will require at least 1 defend duty, and 1 support duty - the addition of a 3rd duty means you can choose generally to have another support duty or an attacking duty (the attacking duty is probably better for the balance of your team - the sheer fact you have 3 central midfielders means your attack is often more isolated, and depends more on midfield support - so the extra forward runs are important).

If you refer back to the 4 general duties of a central midfield, you can specialize them a little more by spreading the tasks around. Your AM is a good bet for supporting attacks, and creating chances - so you can have a specialized holding player, and a linking player. You can provide a solid base to protect your defence and begin attacks with this pair, and it can be a little more defensive than in a 2-man midfield. You could set it up as follows:

• Central Midfielder (Defend)
• Deep Lying Playmaker (Defend)
• Anchorman (Defend)
• Half Back (Defend)
• Defensive Midfielder (Defend)
• Ball-Winning Midfielder (Defend) - as long as partnered with a DLP(S) to cover position

with:

• Central Midfielder (Support)
• Deep Lying Playmaker (Support)
• Regista (Support)
• Ball-Winning Midfielder (Support)
• Box to Box Midfielder (Support)
• Defensive Midfielder (Support)

and in the AM position:

• Advanced Playmaker (Support/Attack)
• Trequartista (Attack)
• Enganche (Attack)
• Inside Forward (Support/Attack)
• Attacking Midfielder (Support/Attack)

Note, I would recommend the "Attack" duties in the AM position to help the balance of your team. But that is not to say the support roles won't work either - this depends on your set up.


Maybe the midfield trio i set is not the best and ideal but i don't understand why it is such a disaster

 

[duca015]

Ok, have you tried this setup? On which mentality, with which shape? How did it turn out for you?

I can tell you that on more defensive/counter mentality, it could turn out to be ok, but just ok. On control or attacking mentality it would be disaster, and on standard mentality it would be bad.

Regarding your comments:

I don't understand why players behave the way you say...

1.- cd-de. They will hold position until their anticipation and decision making tell them that it is time to close down or to make offside trap. Of course i want that. What else can they do? Closing down like crzy losing position? Try useless ofsside traps? Go deep until they crash to my gk? I don't understand.

Sorry, I misunderstood what you wrote... Yes, there could be different solution to this setup, and yes, they could be combination of chasing and closing down, but no, nothing is exactly wrong with this setup neither ...

2.- A-de. This is exactly what i want. If the ball passes, the player can't. All my players should do that. Actually, everybody, anytime in risky positions should do that (not inside the box, of course). Attacking is also exactly what i want. Don't do strange things. Just pass the ball to the closer player and stay back to stop counters.

Ok, I was just asking. So you managed to set them up as you intend to. Good. You finished your defense and it looks good. If you combine proper mentality, shape and right choice roles, you should be ok by just normal setup without TI and PI.

Now we coming to hard part.

3.- AP and BBM. Who will get the ball to the Ap? Many players. A-de, with a short pass. BBM after coming deep to get the ball. Fb if they push forward. My w-at. My tm if we send him a long ball can pass back to my ap. If my bbm gets the ball and can't pass it to the ap because he is covered, he should pass to the wings.Then wings should run out the defense. If it is not posible, just go back and start again. That's what a rational football player should do. Do i need to instruct this to my players?
We could also send a long ball to my tm and he could pass back the ball to somebody. He has 4 (at least) options. wings, ap and bbm.

Problem is that you have picture in your head, but you actually dont look at what is happening in game. In real life, your AP would do what you asked him to do, but if he do not receive ball enough, he would come deeper to get a ball. Not in game. He would be stacked between opponents midfield and defense, waiting for DM, BBM and maybe FB-s to get the ball to him. Problem is that he is only player that opponent have to cover and thus he will be covered, and he will not move back to get the ball, but he will push even more forward.

So as it stands, although you, and I am guessing here, planed to use AP to be your main playmaker, he would be effectively out of game just by your gameplan. So your main creator would be BBM.

That combination is not bad, far from it, but you have to create some movement to create space for AP to actually receive ball and to actually have some time with it to do something, otherwise, it is useless. And movement and space should be made by your FC and wingers. And you have there problem.

4.- Wingers. Traditionally, they have Attack duties in FM terms as they (or at least one does) make aggressive runs forward, get the ball, dribble at the fullback, beat him and cross.

Your problem is that you do not get when they making runs. With attack duty, they will be first one to push and try to pin defense. With supporting duty, they will wait for right moment to push forward, when there is actually space for them to use, and they will run with ball, dribble at fullback and make a cross. In mean time, they will actually try to help your team to keep ball and to create space.
Now, they are not creating any space, as they sit in line with opponent fullbacks, they are not helping in keeping the ball as they have hard time getting ball ( I assume that you would be frustrated if your FB is right to opponents winger, and yet, he receives ball over head of your FB, so same thing apply here also), and thus, they will have hard time to have actually any influence on game.
Also, they are always wide, they are hugging the line, so they are quite easy to pick up if you do not create space. On the other hand, even W on support duty is much harder to pick up by defense, as they usually concentrate on more advanced players, so he has space to receive ball and then try to dribble past opponents infront of him and by this create movement and space.
Also, you can use WM to have similar effect, but if you setup properly, he would not sit exclusively out wide, he would not dribble exclusively by line, but he would occasionally cut inside and create some different looks and situations that you could use. If you set them up properly, they could be even useful when they are in line with opponents D-line. And when they do run byline and cross, they will act as real wingers. This will also create more space for your FB to overlap leaving them time and space to send good crosses to box.
But hay, this is just me talking nonsense, why in **** would you want to use wide players little narrower, right...

5.- TM. all players are far from him. Why far? AP should be very close as he will try to be between lines of opponents midfield and defense. BBM shoud make runs forward. Wingers when they are on attack duty, they look to be as closer to opponent goal as possible,

Because this is what he does, he sit in line or little infront of D-line, receives ball and then hold it, or flick it to near player. And why there is not near player, man, are you blind when you are looking at your tactical screen? I mean, only if you are blind you do not see HUGE HOLE between your TM and your midfield! And just by choosing TM role, he will be first thing your team will be looking at when they win the ball.

6.- goals from crosses? Yes, that's the first and main scoring plan, as i already said.

It is not a problem, I asked you are you aware of this.

7.- too many players forward and DM is far too deep? That's true, but shouldn't be a huge problem as although he is far too deep, i have so many players pushing forward that opponent should have nobody in the front. Otherwise, there would be many of my players free. The situation should be, 2 strikers of the opponent agains my cb and my a-de. 3 against 2. If they are trying to counter, even when they are outnumbered, just make a foul. That's ok because A- de is type of player that may let the ball pas, but he wont let pass player with ball.

Try it out and you will see this situation more then once. If you choose just CM-sup instead of BBM, you would have somewhat different situation, as CM-sup would not run AT DEFENSE, but he would wait for an opening, he would be more patient with ball in his possession, but BBM is running with ball at defense, and if you loos it, your complete midfield is behind their midfield players, and your guess is that they will continue marking your players!? Are you mad? They will push forward, force your A-de to push forward and try to stop them, then there would be probably oppening on wing, ball goes there and puff, your A-de is also out of play , so one of your CB-s is trying to close down his winger, they move diagonal ball to other side, and puff you only have keeper to defend opponents move...

But hay, they will cover your players, it is more important then using perfect situation to hit you with break and score. Right...

For sure it is my fault, but advices i've read in this thread seem contradictory to me. All i read about fm is contradictory. People say one thing and the opposite. I understand nothing. I come here with questions and get no clear idea.

This is your biggest problem. You think that you can setup 3 players perfectly, and then move to other part of team not thinking on how they are connected. Your defensive setup is ok, you always point out on your defensive problems, but you do not understand that you need balance in your team in order to achieve good defense. You can not give ball away, you can not push forward as soon as you have ball, and expect not to be scored on.

And now, I have another question - how do you plan to defend - by closing down opponent, or by keeping good defensive block? How do you plan on attacking, by using counter attack or trying to have most of possession and by waiting for right moment to strike.

By this setup of yours, you plan to attack on fastbreak. But if you have AP role, this will slow your attack down most of time, as your players will look for him. By having TM, you may loose time in passing ball to him instead of free winger that actually has a space...

And if your goal is possession football, who will control the ball? You have no one supporting move?

 

[jee]

1.- Mentality and shape. Counter and flexible. Counter because i wanted more direct playing with solid defence. No idea why flexible. I don't understand what does shape mean and how it affects what happens on the pitch.
Results i've already explained. Around 50 goals scored 30 conceeded, around 70 points.

2.- I assume my defense rols and duties are, in general terms, ok. I mean gk fb-su cd-de cd-de fb-su a-de is not a bad idea.

3.- Ap-at. It seems a problem because he doesn't come deep to get the ball, he is marked always, he doesn't have space and he doesn't suit with a counter tactic. Am i wrong?

4.-"But hay, this is just me talking nonsense, why in **** would you want to use wide players little narrower, righ". Exactly. I want him open wide, creating space in the middle for my 2 midfielders to exploit. I think you are saying that they are not involved in creation, but if i set a support duty the won't be agressive enough. What do you think if i move them to AMR and AML w-su? They would be attacking enough, but with support duty they are supposed to come deep to help.

5.-TM. Well, i think this is a too specific role that affects all the team. Maybe i should change to af-at which is more neutral. I mean, with a af, my players won't start sending long balls stupidly.

6.-Counters after crosses. AS far as i understood, changing my bbm to cm-su would solve this?

7.- Team connection. Well, i have 6 roles that seem to be ok. gk fb-su cd-de cd-de fb-su a-de, even 7 if i change bbm to cm-su. Wingers are inalienable so we have 9. Tm has been changed to af, 10. We just have 1, the ap.

8.- Plan to defend. Defend deep, i don't want the ball. Attacking plan, counter, direct and fast passing. The idea is: we are defending, when we get the ball just quickly pass it to the creator who will decide what to do: wingers, striker or midfield combination. That's why i need a creator (playmaker). Don't care about possession.

9.- Edit: I've been trying this set up and it's a complete disaster. Conceeding like crazy. A lot of thinks must be changed. What things? No idea. I tried a lot of different options (TIs, OIs, PIs) and still the same. Hoping you can say something constructive.

10.- Edit again: I played the same game 60 times trying any posible combination in the midfield and tweaking with Ti, Oi and Pi. I lost 54 draw 2, won 4. I played 10 times the same game with a plug and play tactic and won 7 draw 2 lost 1. The tactic is awful, the worst ever.

And I still don't know why.

11.- And edit again: Concret issues i've been able to identify:
- Conceeding a goal in first 10 minutes almost in every game.
- I outnumber (yes my team outnumbers) the opponent, they have no space, but, i don't know how, they manage to create chances.
- Huge problems defending in the middle. Although there is no space, they make 2 passes and... abracadabra! Their are in front of my gk.
- Huge problems defending crosses. Altough the player who crosses the ball has 1 and usually 2 of my players very close he manages to cross. Inside the box, i outnumber the opponent but... abracadabra! 2 guys against 5 of my players but goal.
- My attacking is just nothing. I don't even cross midfield.
- Huge problems defending long shots, or, at least, shots from outside the box. My players do nothing, just look at the opponents to trigger shot.
- Opponents dribble very easiley 1, 2 or even 3 of my players.

Remember I'm Milan, and my opponent was lazio, away. Note Lazio plays 4-1-2-2-1.

 

[duca015]

1.- Mentality and shape. Counter and flexible. Counter because i wanted more direct playing with solid defence. No idea why flexible. I don't understand what does shape mean and how it affects what happens on the pitch.
Results i've already explained. Around 50 goals scored 30 conceeded, around 70 points.

As I said previously, shape and mentality can be very good weapon if you know what it mean... Counter mentality will give you more cautious approach. It does not mean necessarily fast paced attacks, but choosing less aggressive options that are available to your players. If there is space, your team will use it, if not, they will try to keep the ball and wait for opening, without risk and too much forward runs. In defense, they will be less aggressive, they will try to be behind the ball, they will wait longer until they start closing down, and they will be in general more disciplined.
Shape is something that is giving you an options. For example, Highly Structured shape will give you more static team, which will be separated in basically two units. Attacking duties will be more involved with attack, support duties will be more involved in transition, and defensive duties will be more involved in defense. How much they will be aggressive in their duties depends on their roles and team mentality.
Highly fluid teams will be a bit different, as your team will try to defend as one and to attack as one, it will shorten space between players and give them permission to roam from position more and to exchange places and cover each other when situation requires it. I personally prefer more fluid formation because i like narrow formation and this give you in my opinion much better offensive potential. It can, however, be problem defensively, as sometimes team can be a bit too aggressive and play freely...
With flexible shape, you are in between, so you gain no benefits from shape, but you do not face penalties neither.
Since you already play pretty narrow formation, and your midfield and your attack is pretty far one from another, I would try to play bit more fluid. This will allow your players to pressure opponent as team, to attack player with ball more aggressively, and to move and cover any potential holes in your defense. Offensively, it will give you bit more movement and bit more creativity, which could be crucial to break opponent.
You could also experiment with width... Although it may seem bizarre sometimes, simple change of width can bi difference between winning and loosing. I played narrow formation, and opponent also played narrow formation, as they brought to much players trough middle in counters, I had huge problems defensively, and my attack was inefficient. So I changed to wide width, stretch them, made their pressing ineffective and created space for my strikers and destroyed them.
You already have pretty narrow formation, so you do not need exactly to play narrow to bring your players more together, but you can experiment and try to play with more width. This will bring your wide players and FB-s in better position to close down crosses without any instruction. Otherwise, you can set your FB-s to stay wider and set instructions to close down opponent wingers and FB-s more (in opponent instructions). If you have problems with balls trough middle, try to make your CB-s more aggressive and to bring FB-s m closer to them positional, so they would close channels that opponent is trying to use. When defending middle, you can make your two CM-s a bit less aggressive, so they would not venture too far from their positions, and wide players more aggressive, so they would be more involved in closing down in middle of pitch.

Watch out on how you loose ball when you have it in possession and how your team is fearing with transition defense.

2.- I assume my defense rols and duties are, in general terms, ok. I mean gk fb-su cd-de cd-de fb-su a-de is not a bad idea.

3.- Ap-at. It seems a problem because he doesn't come deep to get the ball, he is marked always, he doesn't have space and he doesn't suit with a counter tactic. Am i wrong?

Yes, as I said, defense looks good, but keep in mind that just setting up defensive roles will not give you stable defense, but sometimes you need to make them more or less aggressive, to push them up or pull them closer to your goal in order to defend yourself properly.

Regarding Ap. That is only my assumption based on my try and fail experiment, but you may find way to make it work. But if you see that your BBM has more passes then your AP, more dribbles then your AP and if you notice that either BBM or AP is hitting wall (loosing too much ball during trying to beat his man off the dribble), then you may want to rethink on how you will set them up. Also, shape and structure, as well as width may create some space that these two could use more effectively, so experiment and understand how to use them in right way against which formations ... It will help you more afterwords when you face opponents that play in similar way.

4.-"But hay, this is just me talking nonsense, why in **** would you want to use wide players little narrower, righ". Exactly. I want him open wide, creating space in the middle for my 2 midfielders to exploit. I think you are saying that they are not involved in creation, but if i set a support duty the won't be agressive enough. What do you think if i move them to AMR and AML w-su? They would be attacking enough, but with support duty they are supposed to come deep to help.

I do not mind on how you want to play and use your team, but I am telling you that this will be problem more often then not, and that your two wingers will be more often covered and cut off from rest of team, but again, I may be mistaken. So experiment and watch on how much they are actually effective. Your attack is one dimensional, so you may want to have alternative plan if they show to be useless...

5.-TM. Well, i think this is a too specific role that affects all the team. Maybe i should change to af-at which is more neutral. I mean, with a af, my players won't start sending long balls stupidly.

Try it. But I think he would be too disconnected from rest of your team, as he will always try to push forward. This may give your AP and BBM more space, however, so it is certainly wort of try... But be aware that you may try to find another solution if you see it is not working out, if he has to keep ball too long, if he is too isolated, then you may want to bring him closer to your midfielders ( DLF or F9, maybe Trequatista role). I use TM role only if I have one more striker beside him, and usually I tick off to him to roam from position, sometimes even to move into channels, to make him more involved in build up, as this is what I want him to do. With two man attack I usually combine TM-sup and DLF-sup with same player instructions, as they generally position themselves differently on pitch, but they act in similar manner when they do have ball. Just this one change can open space for you...

6.-Counters after crosses. AS far as i understood, changing my bbm to cm-su would solve this?

Not solve, but it will give you more stability in transition. He will not dribble with ball, he will be option for back pass, and usually he will be behind ball so you will have one more player who will close down early and keep your back three in check before rest of your team comes to their defensive positions. I am not shore how much it will be good option when you are with ball, you have to try it out.

7.- Team connection. Well, i have 6 roles that seem to be ok. gk fb-su cd-de cd-de fb-su a-de, even 7 if i change bbm to cm-su. Wingers are inalienable so we have . Tm has been changed to af, 10. We just have 1, the ap.

AS I said, try it out, see what is working, what is not, try to understand why, do not get frustrated. Start new experimental save and save and load before every game, try different options and see what is going on. You will understand much more from there then from anything else I, or anyone else would tell you. I can give you a pointer, but I can not solve you a problem. You have to decide what is working best for you...

8.- Plan to defend. Defend deep, i don't want the ball. Attacking plan, counter, direct and fast passing. The idea is: we are defending, when we get the ball just quickly pass it to the creator who will decide what to do: wingers, striker or midfield combination. That's why i need a creator (playmaker). Don't care about possession.

And what happens when it is not working. Even best strategies do not work all the time and you need to change something... Generally, combination of playmaker and counter attack is bad idea, as opponent can man mark your Playmaker and slow you down. Even only passing that one extra pass to playmaker can make difference whether your wingers will be open or not. And when they are covered when your AP do get the ball, you may be little too opened when/if he loses ball or send wrong pass. So try it out, see how it is working out, but be aware what may happen and think about another solution.

AP can be created from CM as well, he will act as AP, but rest of team will not necessarily look for him in every attack. This could be solution that you are looking for...

9.- Edit: I've been trying this set up and it's a complete disaster. Conceeding like crazy. A lot of thinks must be changed. What things? No idea. I tried a lot of different options (TIs, OIs, PIs) and still the same. Hoping you can say something constructive.

10.- Edit again: I played the same game 60 times trying any posible combination in the midfield and tweaking with Ti, Oi and Pi. I lost 54 draw 2, won 4. I played 10 times the same game with a plug and play tactic and won 7 draw 2 lost 1. The tactic is awful, the worst ever.

And I still don't know why.

11.- And edit again: Concret issues i've been able to identify:
- Conceeding a goal in first 10 minutes almost in every game.
- I outnumber (yes my team outnumbers) the opponent, they have no space, but, i don't know how, they manage to create chances.
- Huge problems defending in the middle. Although there is no space, they make 2 passes and... abracadabra! Their are in front of my gk.
- Huge problems defending crosses. Altough the player who crosses the ball has 1 and usually 2 of my players very close he manages to cross. Inside the box, i outnumber the opponent but... abracadabra! 2 guys against 5 of my players but goal.
- My attacking is just nothing. I don't even cross midfield.
- Huge problems defending long shots, or, at least, shots from outside the box. My players do nothing, just look at the opponents to trigger shot.
- Opponents dribble very easiley 1, 2 or even 3 of my players.

Remember I'm Milan, and my opponent was lazio, away. Note Lazio plays 4-1-2-2-1.

[/QUOTE]
They are aggressive, they close down you early, cover your wingers and you have problems moving ball forward. This is problem I was talking about. Then, when you do not have ball, your team is loosing more stamina trying to get the ball back, so you are prone to individual mistakes also.
I already give you some advises on how to defend middle of pitch and how to defend crosses better. Try it out, and see what happens. You also may want to think about pushing your defense little bit further upfield, as it may prove beneficial, push them back a little, and bring your midfield closer to his half.
Make your striker more agile, as this is problem I have anticipated that you may have. Make his defense to chase him down the field, move him into channels, give him roaming option... This also could stretch his midfield and defense enough, so you could find some way to bring ball forward....
Also, if you feel pressured, try only by changing mentality to attack, control or standard. Or just by making different width, different shape. But when you are making changes, do only one thing at time, this way you will get full picture what is best way to deal with problem you have. When you see something good, leave it, then check if you can improve it further by changing another thing. Again, only one change at the time.

It is all try and fail...

When I started, I lost to much worse opponent who was defending deep, playing defensive football, drawing me up field to close him down and then hitting me on break. I created pretty good 4-4-2 counter formation, previously I have destroyed Sampdoria in two games, beat Bordeaux, but I did not understood why I could not beat this opponent. And I tried, and i tried and I tried and result was similar to yours against Lazio. Now, I know what I was supposed to do. Just to be more aggresive, to change mentality to attacking, to close them down early and to make my formation a bit wider. But back then, man, that was brutal...

 

[duca015]

Currently I am playing this formation and I have perfect defensive record... Look at it, you may find something that you can use from it...

However, I do change some things depending on situation to situation. If opponent has two strikers, I change both of my CB-s to CD-def role. If they play narrow formation, I play wide or fairly wide. I always mark single striker (OI instructions) and always close down opponent wide players. (also OI instructions). I also may change TM to DLF-sup sometimes, as I said, it gives me different movement and opportunity to create different movement of my team.

In 15 games, i conceded only two goals.

View attachment 166527View attachment 166526

View attachment 166525

 

[jee]

Shape: My brain is about to explode so let's try to keep things as simple as posible. Flexible shape.

Mentality: I changed to control

TIs. Mark tighter, stuck in.

With these shape, mentality and TIs I immediately stopped conceeding from crosses because as you said i'm wider so my fb are closer to wide opponent players so they can't even send a cross. Adding tight marking and stuck in to this, they hardly ever cross (around 10 crosses/match)

Roles and duties: I started doing changes, according to what was happening in front of my eyes during matches. Well, that's a big problem because i've no way of knowing if what i think is happing is actually happening or it is the opposite. Anyway, i set:

gk

fb-su cd-de cd-de fb-su

bwm-de dlp-su

w-su am-at w-su

af-at

You'll say: Why?

gk nothing to say.
Defense the same as before.
Midfield. Two guys there. I had huge problems conceeding from middle combinations so i thought having my two cd-de and 2 more guys could help me. (i don't know how to explain it. I have 3, 4 or even 5 players, against 2 opponents. They make a pass and suddenly are in front of my gk)
W-su. Nothing to say. Wingers are inalienable.
Am-at. Well, you said my ap-at in my 4141 was always marked. I thought, let's put the creator deeper, so he is not going to be market, unless the opponent starts closing down like crazy. That worked (i think) because my dlp-su is free to play. Discarted the idea of having a higher creator, i changed to am-at because i want him to link with wingers and af, not slowing down my play: I mean, receive the ball, open to flank and run inside the box to finish. More or less i think he is doing that.
I'm very happy with my bwm-de. When attacking he just stays back allowing my dlf-su to go forward. When defending is the opposite: my dlf-s holds the position and the bwm running everywhere trying win the ball.
Af-at. I still don't know what to do with this guy. I change it later if any idea comes to my mind.

When attacking, my opponents are packed back and i have no space. My players were trying to go forward like crazy, even trying to dribble 2 or 3 opponents. Well, i thought let's try to be more patient so i set work ball into box.

I also noticed my crosses were uneffective. 2 reasons: i am outnumbred inside the box (3 forwards 5 or 6 defenders) and my players are not tall. I set low crosses and it come better but not enough because i'm not scoring a ****.

The result is that i'm playing the opposite that i was trying. From fast counter to slow control.

In 3 diferent games i lost 1, won 1 and draw 1. 3 goals scored 3 conceeded.

I'm now conceeding from combinations in the middle. I don't know how to describe it. In front of my box are 2 or 3 opponents. I have at least 4 even 5 and six (4 defenders 2 midfielders) but they make a pass and i don't know how, they are alone in front of my keeper. I don't know what's wrong, if the players are stupid or what. I outnumber them , i set mark tighter and stuck in. How are they allowing the opponents to do that passing combinations?

I played 3 more matches.

I removed work ball into box because it was resulting on the opposite that i was trying to do and it wasn't effective neither. I set more direct passing. It gave more higher tempo and more agressive attacking. I think it improved my attack as long as opponent has now less time to pack his defense.

I'm conceeding from corner kicks. I should do something about it. Later. I think defense is ok, in general.

Now i'm scoring more. I do a lot of crosses but % is low. I did 42 crosses in one game only 3 succeeded. I scored 2 goals from this crosses. Should i change my crosses to whipped? I think this is not (the main, at least) problem. Here the problem is that i'm outnumbered inside the box. I only have my at-af and my am-at (sometimes a winger) inside. What do you think i could do? I moved my 2 dm to midfielders with same roles and duties, trying they could come inside the opponents box but it resulted into a huge space between defense and midfield so i discarted. What do you think i could do about it? How can i get to have more players inside the box without changing formation? Is it possible? If not, what can i do?

I'm consistently conceeding 1 goal every game. The opponent doesn't create chances but manages to score 1 goal.

I don't create enough chances. Only crosses and crosses which are uneffective according to the number of them.

My striker has low rates.

I change my Am-at to ss-at and my af-at to p-at. I want them inside the box. SS-at is supposed to to do that and p-at won't move as much as an af-at, so he is also supposed to be inside the box. I also change to mixed crosses.

Now ss and p are inside the box but crosses, althought slightly better, still unnefective 6/39 in first game.

I set a new TI: look for overlap. I thought this would produce two effects: lower tempo (which is not good) and involve more my wings in finishing. If my fb overlap, wingers will be narrower so they will be inside the box. Next match one of my wingers scored 1 goal from a cross and i saw more my wingers inside the box. Good?
Crosses 9/35. Better? Not sure because the opponent was the worst team in the league.

Conceeding from nothing. As usual, opponent creates 0-1 ccc 0-1 hc but they score 1 goal. It's like i must conceed 1 goal no matter how the match goes.

It's enough for today.

What do you think about all this?

Other questions (more concret)

Do you think dlp is slowing down my direct passing style?
Don't you think my attacking is too unidimensional?
I'm not happy with my am and striker. Any combination suggested according to my direct passing and crosses style?

Edit: i forgot. THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR HELP

 

[duca015]

Shape: My brain is about to explode so let's try to keep things as simple as posible. Flexible shape.

Mentality: I changed to control

TIs. Mark tighter, stuck in.

With these shape, mentality and TIs I immediately stopped conceeding from crosses because as you said i'm wider so my fb are closer to wide opponent players so they can't even send a cross. Adding tight marking and stuck in to this, they hardly ever cross (around 10 crosses/match)

Ok, now, you find out a way to stop opponent attacking you this way. This is good.

Roles and duties: I started doing changes, according to what was happening in front of my eyes during matches. Well, that's a big problem because i've no way of knowing if what i think is happing is actually happening or it is the opposite. Anyway, i set:

This is reason why I told you to load and save before game. To see against same opponent and same formation and style how some changes are working out for you. When you see difference against same opponent, then you can understand what did you do and why. Otherwise, you are even more confused then you were before.

gk

fb-su cd-de cd-de fb-su

bwm-de dlp-su

w-su am-at w-su

af-at

You'll say: Why?

gk nothing to say.
Defense the same as before.
Midfield. Two guys there. I had huge problems conceeding from middle combinations so i thought having my two cd-de and 2 more guys could help me. (i don't know how to explain it. I have 3, 4 or even 5 players, against 2 opponents. They make a pass and suddenly are in front of my gk)
W-su. Nothing to say. Wingers are inalienable.
Am-at. Well, you said my ap-at in my 4141 was always marked. I thought, let's put the creator deeper, so he is not going to be market, unless the opponent starts closing down like crazy. That worked (i think) because my dlp-su is free to play. Discarted the idea of having a higher creator, i changed to am-at because i want him to link with wingers and af, not slowing down my play: I mean, receive the ball, open to flank and run inside the box to finish. More or less i think he is doing that.
I'm very happy with my bwm-de. When attacking he just stays back allowing my dlf-su to go forward. When defending is the opposite: my dlf-s holds the position and the bwm running everywhere trying win the ball.
Af-at. I still don't know what to do with this guy. I change it later if any idea comes to my mind.

I have few remarks regarding formation, but I will comment latter...

When attacking, my opponents are packed back and i have no space. My players were trying to go forward like crazy, even trying to dribble 2 or 3 opponents. Well, i thought let's try to be more patient so i set work ball into box.

Dude, this is what I meant when I said you need to read explanation what each role do. Watch in PI screen on which role has dribble more instruction ticked on. Winger has dribble more, AF has dribble more. So you are giving them permission to be aggressive with ball and dribble more. Work ball into box will not prevent them from dribbling.

I also noticed my crosses were uneffective. 2 reasons: i am outnumbred inside the box (3 forwards 5 or 6 defenders) and my players are not tall. I set low crosses and it come better but not enough because i'm not scoring a ****.

This is not surprising, as you made it easy to opponent to pick up your players.

The result is that i'm playing the opposite that i was trying. From fast counter to slow control.

In 3 diferent games i lost 1, won 1 and draw 1. 3 goals scored 3 conceeded.

I'm now conceeding from combinations in the middle. I don't know how to describe it. In front of my box are 2 or 3 opponents. I have at least 4 even 5 and six (4 defenders 2 midfielders) but they make a pass and i don't know how, they are alone in front of my keeper. I don't know what's wrong, if the players are stupid or what. I outnumber them , i set mark tighter and stuck in. How are they allowing the opponents to do that passing combinations?

Look, if you are trying to make successful counter attacking formation, then you need not to expect from your team that they will going crazy and score loads of goals from counter. First, your players will usually have to run for half of pitch in order to get to situation from where they can score. Second, opponent has defense too, so they will try to slow you down. If you do not have a plan on how you will attack, then your attack will be slowed down most of times.
I found out that 3-4 players counter is good way to achieve what are you trying to do, as long as they arrive in different manner and attack different zones, and they spread out in space.
I do not know how old are you and if you do remember this, but one of the most effective counter attacks I have ever seen was Roma counter attack from beginning of 2000-s... They had Batistuta as TM/AF, they had Totti behind him as Trequatista, and Cafu as winger. Fast ball to Batistuta, who then pass the ball into space to Cafu, who sprints byline and then he has two options to send ball to Batistuta or to send low cross to edge of area to Totti, or to finish himself if there is space. And they were deadly attacking like this.
But all three of them did little in defense, they main goal was to provide quick outlet pass and attacking options.
But sometimes, they faced opponent that did not leave them space, who did not attacked in numbers, so they had to change, and you will have to change as well when you face similar opponent. And it is easy to spot this. If they have one or two midfielders behind Totti (your AM) most of time, then you have to think of some other way of attacking them.

Regarding your problems in middle, you are not closing them enough, not force them to make mistake and they have enough time on ball to find hole in your defense. I already said what can solve this problem for you. Make your DM in these situation more static (DM role for example), and make your CB-s more aggressive (when entering Player instruction, you have option to give them more closing down. If they have one striker, then you can leave one CB more aggressive, to challenge ball early and often, and other one to close down bit latter. When you are aggressive enough and when you limit them space and time, they will not find passes so easily and more often then not they will give bad passes that will be picked up by your players.

I played 3 more matches.

I removed work ball into box because it was resulting on the opposite that i was trying to do and it wasn't effective neither. I set more direct passing. It gave more higher tempo and more agressive attacking. I think it improved my attack as long as opponent has now less time to pack his defense.

Now, this is huge improvement you made right there... You saw problem and you made some changes that are logic and you sow that this was good thing. Bravo.

I'm conceeding from corner kicks. I should do something about it. Later. I think defense is ok, in general.

This is also one more upside of your change to direct passing... Do you understand why? When you are playing more direct, opponent has less time to close down on you early, to win the ball high upfield, as your players are spending less time on the ball. The second upside is that you are less likely to break your defensive shape, so they have less space, less time to use even if you loose the ball.

Now i'm scoring more. I do a lot of crosses but % is low. I did 42 crosses in one game only 3 succeeded. I scored 2 goals from this crosses. Should i change my crosses to whipped? I think this is not (the main, at least) problem. Here the problem is that i'm outnumbered inside the box. I only have my at-af and my am-at (sometimes a winger) inside. What do you think i could do? I moved my 2 dm to midfielders with same roles and duties, trying they could come inside the opponents box but it resulted into a huge space between defense and midfield so i discarted. What do you think i could do about it? How can i get to have more players inside the box without changing formation? Is it possible? If not, what can i do?

Now, this is problem with your gamplan and general idea on how will you attack. You have AF pinning the defense, then AM close behind him, and two wingers that are attacking wide. So all they have to do is to set narrow their defense, to overcrowd their middle and close down more your wingers, and 1. your wingers will not send quality crosses, as they will be crossing most time at pace, sometimes after dribbling even, 2. they overcrowded middle and there is small possibility that even with some TM type of player this will be high rate crossing success...
You do not need more players in box, but you need to find way to create space for your striker and your AM to come at the end of it...
This formation that I posted... I had similar problem, so what was solution? I have two strikers coming bit latter into box, slightly behind his D-line players, and three players (two wpm and RPM) that are coming late into box. So here, FB has options with ball. He can cross short to Treq, that is not behind his CB, he has option on high cross to TM, he has option on crossing to WPM on opposite side, or passing ball back to WPM on same side. IF he chooses latter, then he has options of crossing himself, passing to RPM on edge of box, or dribbling and shooting himself. And even with jam packed box I created different possibilities and different options. And even if I do not score from first try, there is always possibility that one of opponent CB-s will close down on players that are coming late to box, that will live one, or even both my strikers unmarked if GK fails to clear ball properly.

So question was, what you can do? You can create some options for player that is delivering crosses. You need decoy that will pin opponent defense, which will give space for other player to come bit latter to a box, and space for winger on opposite side to finish move. So putting either your striker or AM to some support duty would be good for you.

Another thing that you could do, you do not want to do, and this is to change one of your wide players to some other role, and create some different looks to your attacks. Lot of people like to put Inf, but I like even more wide AP role... He moves much more and create a lot of space for other players then INF... So, since you have Abbatte that is coming up anyway, my solution would be to change AMR to AP-sup, and give Abbate either attack mentality or give him get further forward PI. What will this do? Well, you will still have two (AM and Striker) players in box, but now you will have player that is coming late to box (so two layers), and player on side who will have much more time on ball to make better decision weather he will send cross to close or far post, to penalty area or will he send ball back to AP who then has also options... With RMD or INF it is similar, difference is mostly on how they are moving. AP will come much more in middle, INF is more static role until he decide he has good situation for dribbling at defense or moving into channels, and RMD is in constant movement, but mostly out wide.
If you chose some other role, then you want either your AM or ST on support role, to have similar effect of layering your attack and creating options.
This may bring number of crosses down, maybe to some 20-25, but it should also, most of time, raise success rate of crosses up.
You could also use Bacca ability as DLF, to change his role to DLF-sup, and this will create space between opponent GK and D-line that your Winger and your SS can move into, and that your FB/winger can target when crossing.

Beside these changes, you can find player that is dominant in air and set him on AM or FC position.

One more change I would suggest is to set DLP on defensive duty, as he would hardly ever be high upfield enough to effectively act as supporting role. So if he is not high enough, you might as well use him as deep sitting role that will provide you option of back pass, option of changing angles in attack and provide you even more defensive stability. Then also, you might try and change BWM to supporting role, so he could press higher upfield knowing that you already have one sitting player infront of defense.

I'm consistently conceeding 1 goal every game. The opponent doesn't create chances but manages to score 1 goal.

How they are scoring? From set pieces? From deep crosses? From passes over your defense? I can not help if you are not more precise...

I don't create enough chances. Only crosses and crosses which are uneffective according to the number of them.

My striker has low rates.

I change my Am-at to ss-at and my af-at to p-at. I want them inside the box. SS-at is supposed to to do that and p-at won't move as much as an af-at, so he is also supposed to be inside the box. I also change to mixed crosses.

Now ss and p are inside the box but crosses, althought slightly better, still unnefective 6/39 in first game.

I set a new TI: look for overlap. I thought this would produce two effects: lower tempo (which is not good) and involve more my wings in finishing. If my fb overlap, wingers will be narrower so they will be inside the box. Next match one of my wingers scored 1 goal from a cross and i saw more my wingers inside the box. Good?
Crosses 9/35. Better? Not sure because the opponent was the worst team in the league.

Ok, now you are thinking logical and this is good. Now you are beginning to understand what is going on out there.

Conceeding from nothing. As usual, opponent creates 0-1 ccc 0-1 hc but they score 1 goal. It's like i must conceed 1 goal no matter how the match goes.

It's enough for today.

What do you think about all this?

I have to tell you that you will concede. Especially in begging of season, as your formation is not fluid enough, your players are more prone to mistakes (bad passes, bad positioning, etc), so this will give some opportunities to opponent. But as game goes on, you will become more defensively stable, you will miss less passes, you will dominate possession more, and this will give you clean sheets more often. Just be patient. I think you are progressing very good.

Other questions (more concret)

Do you think dlp is slowing down my direct passing style?

Yes and no. He does slow you a bit, but this role is quite different then AP, as he is not sending final balls, but he starts moves, so once he setup move, there is no one else who will slow the move down. Even if you fail to capitalize on move, his deep position allow you to start the move again and control possession. Look at him as to Paul Scholes in his late stage of career. I think he is very good fit for what you are trying to do.

Don't you think my attacking is too unidimensional?

Yes, but, then again, I already told you it would be. But I guess you had to see for yourself...

I'm not happy with my am and striker. Any combination suggested according to my direct passing and crosses style?

Yes, I give you some advice in previous paragrafs, so you might try something out, see what is best solution for you...

Edit: i forgot. THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR HELP

no problem...

 

[jee]

As i expected, everything i did yesterday went down the drain. I don't understand why, i started a new save with same team, same players, same tactic and it just didn't work.

When i say didn't work is that i started conceeding a lot (specially from crosses, which was supposed to be fixed). My players were not attacking down the flanks. To sum up, i don't know why, players were not behaving like yesterday.

After getting frustratred, i decided to start from zero (again). I set a similar formation:

gk

fb-su cd-de cd-de fb-su

bwm-de dlp-su

w-su treq-at w-su

af-at

No instructions, mentality standard.

I played a match and was a total disaster. I had huge problems defending crosses and doing nothing in attack. To fix it, i did what you told me: change one thing and try. Ok, i changed mentality to control. That was even worse, so i changed mentality to counter.

Defense improved, but still problems with crosses. Here is important to say that counter mentality means narrower width so i changed it from balanced to fairly wide. Didn't work.
I removed that change and set some OIs: mark tighter, close down more, tackle hard and weaker foot to all wide opponent players. That improved my defense a lot. Even my attacking because i was able to trigger some counter after winning the ball as a consequence of closing down more wide opponent players.

Although it could be better, i consider my defense problem more or less fixed, so i started trying to improve my attacking. I want fast, direct and down the flanks attacking so i set clear ball to flanks. Didn't work. My players, the same that were doing before setting this instruction, were sending stupid long balls to nobody.
I removed clear ball to flanks and tried with more direct passing. THe same happened.
I removed direct passing and set pass into space. Here things were better but i think not due to the pass into space instruction. The improvement was caused by removing the direct passing orders. So, conclusion is my team is playing better withou any direct passing instruction.

Now we are attacking better, but not enough, because i still have big problems to score. I removed pass into space and i changed some roles and duties:

- fb to attack duty
- bwm to support duty
-dlp to defend duty
- tried several combinations am-st: treq, am, apm and ss - af, p and dlf.

I saw that when attacking i was dramatically outnumbered (4 against 6,7 or even 8) so fb-at is a good idea because they are now overlaping and helping. Also bwm.su provides some forward runs while dlp holds midfield.
Still problems with my am-st combination. I tried a lot of pairs but im not happy. Maybe here i should use some PI or TI. Note that i'm using 0 PI or TI. I could just try and fail but some orientation would help me a lot. I must fix it with any combination using the roles i said before. Complete forward, false 9 and tm are specific roles which are not easy to find and remember that this tactic must suit with most of the teams.

My wingers have also low ratings. Maybe they are not involved enough. I hope that fb.at can help them: sometimes my wingers try to dribble 2 opponents. Now with fb-at it is 2 against 2. Also overlaping fb will make my wingers narrower so they will be more involved in creation and finishing. Winger roles are inalienable.

Low % of crosses. I tried all posible crossing styles. Here the problem is that i'm outnumbered inside the box. I can't fix this until i fix my am-st problem and my winger have higher rates.

Tomorrow more.

Let me know what do you think about it.

Thanks in advance.

 

[duca015]

You have problem that you do not recognize what is opponent doing.

Yesterday, your gameplan worked because they attacked, or at least they tried to, so they have left you space behind that you can profit from with direct balls. Now, you are defended deep with stable defensive shape and hard tackling, so they are limiting space that you had. So when you started actually to control game little bit better and slowed down game (by moving from direct passing to less direct passing), things improved.

Also, your formation... your wings are too passive, both FB-s and both wingers are on support duty. Why dont you try at least once to put, for example, right FB to attack, and left winger to attack duty, so you could get some movement upfront, and to avoid complete isolation of AM and FC... Also, this will give you more layered attack, so you will have more aggressive wing on left, and if your initial attack break, he will move more inside, and play will move to other wing to overlaping FB that will bring winger to come to end of crosses on the other side, but it will also give more time for DLF to come to end of crosses and your DLP to come closer to opponent box and pick up loose balls and restart attack.

Also, why dont you try for once to your striker to support duty. He will be available to finish moves, just not in way he does right now, and you can get similar movement if you give him free movement and move into channels instruction (for DLF-sup). This will pull the defense out of box and give you space for more direct passes to your attacking winger and attacking AM. This will also give you more players in early attack build up, so you wont see as much long passes to no one. It is that simple.

Also if you have trouble controlling game, you might consider slowing down game, giving your GK instruction to pass to your CB-s and play out of defense. This will draw opponent forward and give you some space, but you have to recognize when they start to press you upfront, and tick off this, otherwise you will face different kinds of trouble.

 

[jee]

ONE QUESTION:

Where is the instruction pass the ball back instead of crashing stupidly against 8 defenders?

 

[WJ]

ONE QUESTION:

Where is the instruction pass the ball back instead of crashing stupidly against 8 defenders?

This brings more questions than answers. Who's doing it? What is his role? What is his PPMs?

It could be anything. You may have given him a role where he's asked to run with the ball (dribble) often. He may have PPMs that encourage it. Lower/safer Mentalities also encourage safer decision making, so that should encourage passes sideways/backwards more.

 

[jee]

Thank you very much everybody for your help.
This game is too difficult. I played 2 seasons and everytime is the same. Starting well and then conceeding like crazy. No matter if i change the tactic during the season. I tried everything but this is too much for me.

Just can't play this game. Maybe i'm not intelligent enough but i want to have fun not to be suffering everytime i load the game.

Somebody should think about that. I'm not going to play the game anymore. I'm not going to buy it anymore although i've played it since i was a child. Fm has became too difficult. Not everybody can have fun and, as far as i know, this is the purpose of a game.

For you to understand. I had 2 different tactics, even opposite: 1 counter direct football and 1 possession based. Using both depending on the match and changing it during the match if needed. First 20 games 16 wins 4 draw. Next 18 5 wins 13 lost.

What i've always liked of fm as how you can improve, progress. Now it is the opposite everytime i play: starting well and boom, losing and losing.

I'm not looking for any advice. Now is the opposite: I would like to give an advice. Let people have fun. Not everybody has enough time or talent (or both or whatever) to play such a difficult game. Fm lost a client. A client that has bought for the last 10 years at least.

Thanks again and good luck.

 

[jee]

I tried again a full season and results were more or less the same. First 19 games 13 wins 6 draw. Last 19, 7 wins 3 draw 9 lost.


The laughs came when i started the following season. Of course non stop losing and conceeding like crazy. I decided to try one thing. I made a "huge revolution" in my tactic: i moved my two midfielders from cm to dm with same roles and duties. Then i started to win again 10 of the following 12 matches. After that again losing and conceeding.

Is fm that stupid? If you move two positions tactic becomes again wonderful? I didn't change anything else.

If it is how it goes, that's completely stupid. Have you ever experienced that?

As i said in my previous post, fm has gone too far. This is not what i expect from a game. I bought it on xmas and will never play a real save. There is something wrong right here. Maybe i'm not supertalented, superintelligent, and supernothing. I'm just an average person who wants to forget about everything one hour a day playing fm.

Fm doesn't provide me this anymore. Somebody should think about it because i know i'm not the only one. Many of my friends have the same feeling.

I remember some of my epic saves in past editions of fm. They will never come back.

If changing only two positions the tactic becomes wonderful again, then what i said on post 34 is completely true. There is no other explanation.

Thanks for all. I hope what i wrote here makes somebody consider where fm is going.

 

[Keith Ang]

jee, im sorry but i like the challenge fm is posing us here. im sorry to hear that you r not getting the result u are hoping for. but hey mate its the same for most of us. Ac doesnt have a great team to start with and financially they arent great either. so expecting to win everything is not really logical.
if u feel that your tactics have too much flaws stick with one and work on that first. Again i would just like to remind you that most of us here dont go thru a season without a lost. even those top tactic makers. btw fm tried to make it as such that u cant really plug and play tactics anymore. well thats how i feel. and i like it. makes it more RL

 

[jee]

Hi,

after some weeks i tried again.

I had some success. I won 2 serie A with Milan. I started a new save with Almeria (Liga Adelante) and after promoting the first season, then a ended 6 playing europa league next season.


BUT...

Sorry guys, but game is totally random. There is no logic. Do you know how i did that? Very easy.
Always happens the same. Suddenly, without any explanation, tactic doesn't work anymore. I built a very solid 442, conceeding less thant 0.5 goals per game. Then suddenly i start conceeding like crazy,but absolutely like crazy. My players become stupid, own goals almost in every match.

What you have to do? Very easy. Don't waste your time tweaking tactics. It is random. Just save the game. Then play a game. Ok you lost 2-6 against carpi. Quit without saving and play the same match. Repeat the same until you win. Then your results will come back to normal. It worked for me every time i tried with any of the 20 tactics i have built that start working and suddenly become awful.

It's just like that. There is no logic, there is nothing. Absolutely random.

 

[jee]

After some seasons, i decided to start a new save.

i'm at the same point than 6 months ago. 10 games and sacked.

I watched 104 times (literally) a single match and i can safely say that i don't know what is wrong. Not a single issue. short pass, short pass, short pass, cross goal. 2 guys marking the guy crossing and 4 defenders against 1 striker inside the box. They score. What's wrong here? Absolutely nothing.

I really admire you. I don't understand how you do it. How can you get any info from watching a match. I can't believe there is information. I see nothing.

104 times. And i get no conclusion. Unbelievable.

What do you pay attention to? Where do you look at? Am i that stupid? I can't believe it.

 

[TheAverageOne]

It's just like that. There is no logic, there is nothing. Absolutely random.

...because in football everything is logical and top teams win every game.

 

[jee]

Please, could you be so nice to tell me what do you pay attention to when watching a game?

I keep watching full matches and, believe me, i get no conclusion. I conceed and don't know what happened. I score and don't knwo what did well. Or if it was just luck.

I don't understand what's happening on the pitch. When i think i've seen something, it is wrong, or what i do to fix it is wrong. Actually i don't know.

That's why fm is random for me. No idea why things happen. How do you understand it? I see the same winning or losing. I would say all depends on individual mistakes. And results show me i'm wrong.

 

[WJ]

I wouldn't know how to help you, even if I still wanted. I posted solutions and it gets ignored. I posted screenshots of issues - you can't see it. It's very, very strange.

One common mistake you keep making, is using a BWM as the only midfielder staying back and as I've said early on in this thread, he's going to leave gaps behind him and you can be punished for that.

Is this you, by the way? 20 games

You should really consider posting on SI. There are a lot more people with very good knowledge of the game, so you will get help from many viewpoints and hopefully one of those viewpoints will trigger something in the way you see things.