Is Messi Over-rated?

[sunilvk7]

if anyone was overated, its that fool pele... please, brasil was not the best league back then. i guarentee you pele would not have been able to hack it in todays time when players are fitter stronger etc.. for me he is the greatest. closely followed by titus bramble

And Messi would have done with such a heavy ball and players kicking all over the place when hacking was just a foul or maybe not?

Pele scored hat tick and brace in Semi finals and finals when he was a teenager. Only a fool would play down his achievements. If you read what the players who have seen him say about him, you will get an idea how good he was. He was just not a poacher, a complete player. Also back then Santos played friendlies with big clubs from Europe and they won the game for fun.

 

[wolfthegreat]

Um, as an Arsenal fan, I've seen the defenses Wenger has tried to build over the years. Believe me, "solid" is never what comes to mind when you've seen Silvestre and Squillaci play at the back.

wow you're talking bout the sub... Have you seen them play in the BPL or UCL this season? Also have you forgotten why wenger use them? Coz he didn't have a choice... I don't look at the defense he build in the past... I look at what it looks like now... Keep living in the past if you want to...

 

[Cai1234]

I feel that Messi isn't over rated but that he is over hyped. It is impossible to compare generations of football (pele/Messi) as the game has changed so significantly. Messi wasn't effective in the Bayern match as he has been over-used from a young age and he was injured. Yes, I also dislike it when someone says he is the greatest ever and I also feel that attacking players are over valued.

 

[Logorex]

wow you're talking bout the sub... Have you seen them play in the BPL or UCL this season? Also have you forgotten why wenger use them? Coz he didn't have a choice... I don't look at the defense he build in the past... I look at what it looks like now... Keep living in the past if you want to...

Lmao, I really wonder why I don't see Silvestre in the BPL...
Well, thanks, I'd love to live in that past...you know when we actually won legitimate trophies, not some fake preseason cup that we made so we'd have something to win.

 

[LFCMarshall]

I think the numbers quite clearly prove he is one of the best ever..

Overrated? no chance

 

[r1cky]

What does that have to do with anything? Sterling was awesome when he burst on to the scene. Not to mention that he's a much better player than Thiago or Callejon were at 18.. But I suppose that's because players develop later in the continent. Oh and a good English player is a lot less common than a good Spanish player!

Anyway, at the end of the day which ever league you think is "the best" is completely down to each individuals opinion. Although, people who say "Would love to see Messi play against Stoke!" are retarded, he'd probably score 6.

Well... We are talking about a players ability/how he would cope in a different league.. So considering that's the EXACT point I was making what I've said couldn't possibly have more to do with this topic! Sterling is a poor player and would struggle in Spain, he got carried by the momentum of being given a few first team games and that bubble soon burst. tbh Zaha is 3x the player Sterling is.

Anyway I agree with people having their own opinion, however saying someone is over-rated.. Especially when it's Lionel Messi is ridiculous. Whatever hype this lad has got he has earned and got the medals the warrant it. For someone to be over-rated they have to have a huge media hype with no substance... A lot like Wayne Rooney.

 

[Mike.]

Well... We are talking about a players ability/how he would cope in a different league.. So considering that's the EXACT point I was making what I've said couldn't possibly have more to do with this topic! Sterling is a poor player and would struggle in Spain, he got carried by the momentum of being given a few first team games and that bubble soon burst. tbh Zaha is 3x the player Sterling is.

Anyway I agree with people having their own opinion, however saying someone is over-rated.. Especially when it's Lionel Messi is ridiculous. Whatever hype this lad has got he has earned and got the medals the warrant it. For someone to be over-rated they have to have a huge media hype with no substance... A lot like Wayne Rooney.

If you look at Rooney's records, pretty difficult to say he's over rated, especially when the substance is there. Over-hyped yes, but not over rated. They are not the same thing. Same could be said about Messi. Over hyped, but certainly not over-rated. He is the best player on the planet. But sometimes there is too much talk about him.

 

[Vanjagl]

And Messi would have done with such a heavy ball and players kicking all over the place when hacking was just a foul or maybe not?

Pele scored hat tick and brace in Semi finals and finals when he was a teenager. Only a fool would play down his achievements. If you read what the players who have seen him say about him, you will get an idea how good he was. He was just not a poacher, a complete player. Also back then Santos played friendlies with big clubs from Europe and they won the game for fun.

TBH, this Messi would pwn those players. But, we will never know what would happen if Messi was born in Pele's time, he wouldn't even be footballer due his medical issues, but thats not the point. Well, it is, sort of. Technology today is much greater then in 50s and 60s, training is much more developed, as is whole 'be a footballer'. If he was born back then, and if we forget his medical condition 10 years ago, no one could tell how well would he develop. Same goes with Pele. What would happen if he was born in Messi's time? Would he score 2000 goals in 1500 games, or would he be eaten by modern defenders? Maybe... only way to measure someones greatness is by trophies that person won. And the fact is, Pele won World Cup, and Messi didn't. And someone would say 'What if some player comes from Cambodia, so he never gets a chance in winning it'? Well, yes. Take a look at Ryan Giggs. And Messi is Argentinian, they do have good players capable of winning World cup. For time being, Pele and Maradona are better, but Messi could easily beat their records.
Sorry for this ramble, it make sense in my head. And Sunil, I really didn't mean to quote you, I meant to quote guy you quoted.

 

[r1cky]

If you look at Rooney's records, pretty difficult to say he's over rated, especially when the substance is there. Over-hyped yes, but not over rated. They are not the same thing. Same could be said about Messi. Over hyped, but certainly not over-rated. He is the best player on the planet. But sometimes there is too much talk about him.

No offence, but trying to create a difference between 'over hyped' and 'over rated' is something that would solely be created for arguments sake. Realistically if you break it down... They are the same thing. My reference to Rooney is similar to what I said about Sterling, he's English so gets over hyped/over rated to fck.

How can there be too much talk about a player which is, like you say.. "The best player on the planet"

Surely he should be hyped for this as a role model for football standards and kids to look upto?

 

[Mike.]

No offence, but trying to create a difference between 'over hyped' and 'over rated' is something that would solely be created for arguments sake. Realistically if you break it down... They are the same thing. My reference to Rooney is similar to what I said about Sterling, he's English so gets over hyped/over rated to fck.

How can there be too much talk about a player which is, like you say.. "The best player on the planet"

Surely he should be hyped for this as a role model for football standards and kids to look upto?

No, because they are two different things. If you break it down they are two different things. No one should ever doubt his ability. But yes there can be too much talk. when you start to ignore the achievements of other players around him, then yes. For example Iniesta is probably the best midfielder in the world, very few talk about how important he is. When a simple finish by Messi becomes "one of the best goals of all time", then yes there can be too much talk. Football is much much more than Messi. There is a difference between him being the best in the world, and football talk entirely revolving around him. You can't compare Rooney and Sterling, because one is a serial achiever, and one is just getting started. Curious to see who is over-rating Rooney, because it sure isnt in England these days, if anything he gets more appreciation from the continent.

I could think of many players that people could and should aspire too. Scholes and Pirlo: the art of reinventing yourself when time catches up with you, Javier Zanetti, Buffon, Xavi, Iniesta.

Messi vs Ronaldo is a perfect example of over hype. If people listened to that, you'd think there was almost nothing in La Liga outside those two

 

[r1cky]

No, because they are two different things. If you break it down they are two different things. No one should ever doubt his ability. But yes there can be too much talk. when you start to ignore the achievements of other players around him, then yes. For example Iniesta is probably the best midfielder in the world, very few talk about how important he is. When a simple finish by Messi becomes "one of the best goals of all time", then yes there can be too much talk. Football is much much more than Messi. There is a difference between him being the best in the world, and football talk entirely revolving around him. You can't compare Rooney and Sterling, because one is a serial achiever, and one is just getting started. Curious to see who is over-rating Rooney, because it sure isnt in England these days, if anything he gets more appreciation from the continent.

I could think of many players that people could and should aspire too. Scholes and Pirlo: the art of reinventing yourself when time catches up with you, Javier Zanetti, Buffon, Xavi, Iniesta.

Messi vs Ronaldo is a perfect example of over hype. If people listened to that, you'd think there was almost nothing in La Liga outside those two

I repeat, when you break it down they are exactly the same thing. Sugar-coat it as much as you like but they clearly are. I'm yet to see Messi score an average goal and hear it get called "one of the best goals of all times" to be completely honest. He scores a LOT of quality goals... And it gets recognized, which is completely justified. Even if by his standards they aren't always the best goal ever scored just because he is the best. Rooney is clearly over-rated here... Absolutely everywhere you look in the media etc. Even watch match of the day, his connecting passes get pretty much promoted every time he pulls them off! Not quite sure how you're missing that lol.

I'm not quite sure about looking up to Scholes, for reinventing his game, he's always played CM.. Giggs would have been a better example. But that's my opinion. Iniesta reinventing himself..? He's 28! lol. The only people that compare Messi to Ronaldo are generally kids.

 

[Vanjagl]

I repeat, when you break it down they are exactly the same thing. Sugar-coat it as much as you like but they clearly are. I'm yet to see Messi score an average goal and hear it get called "one of the best goals of all times" to be completely honest. He scores a LOT of quality goals... And it gets recognized, which is completely justified. Even if by his standards they aren't always the best goal ever scored just because he is the best. Rooney is clearly over-rated here... Absolutely everywhere you look in the media etc. Even watch match of the day, his connecting passes get pretty much promoted every time he pulls them off! Not quite sure how you're missing that lol.

I'm not quite sure about looking up to Scholes, for reinventing his game, he's always played CM.. Giggs would have been a better example. But that's my opinion. Iniesta reinventing himself..? He's 28! lol. The only people that compare Messi to Ronaldo are generally kids.

How's Rooney overrated? And Scholes started as striker, then he moved to attacking mid, then in late mid 20s he started playing as advanced playmaker. Now Scholes is more deeper, trying to control the pace of the game. Giggs is good example as well.

 

[Mike.]

I repeat, when you break it down they are exactly the same thing. Sugar-coat it as much as you like but they clearly are. I'm yet to see Messi score an average goal and hear it get called "one of the best goals of all times" to be completely honest. He scores a LOT of quality goals... And it gets recognized, which is completely justified. Even if by his standards they aren't always the best goal ever scored just because he is the best. Rooney is clearly over-rated here... Absolutely everywhere you look in the media etc. Even watch match of the day, his connecting passes get pretty much promoted every time he pulls them off! Not quite sure how you're missing that lol.

I'm not quite sure about looking up to Scholes, he's always played CM.. Giggs would have been a better example. But that's my opinion. Iniesta reinventing himself..? He's 28! lol. The only people that compare Messi to Ronaldo are generally kids.

They are not the same thing.

Hype: Extravagant or intensive publicity or promotion.
Rate: A measure, quantity, or frequency, typically one measured against some other quantity or measure: "the crime rate"

I believe Rooney is over hyped ( too much talk, positive or negative, about him), but not over-rated (his actual ability)

You might have heard it, but I have. He scores goals of all kinds From the subime to the scrappy. But even his scrappy ones are lauded, when its just a scrappy goal scored by the best player in the world. I havent missed it, I just don't assume the MOTD covers all press, there are certainly more articles criticising his performances ( some quite justly so) and whether he has made it, than him being "over rated".

He is over hyped because stories on him, positive or negative, generate hits

I never said Iniesta reinvented himself. I was clearly referring to Scholes and Pirlo.

Scholes did reinvent himself. Scholes started as an attacking mid, dropped to box to box, and then became a deep lying playmaker. The roles he has players over the years are certainly not the same.

Pirlo did the same, from Trequartista down to deep lying playmaker.

Kids?! You might want to watch read the Spanish papers: AS, Marca, Sport, El Mundo: for the last 3 years its been Messi vs Ronaldo, alongside Pep vs Jose, and Barca vs Madrid, its like the unmissable sub plot. Almost every show and commentator compares the two

 

[r1cky]

They are not the same thing. You might have heard it, but I have. He scores goals of all kinds From the subime to the scrappy. But even his scrappy ones are lauded, when its just a scrappy goal scored by the best player in the world. I havent missed it, I just don't assume the MOTD covers all press, there are certainly more articles criticising his performances ( some quite justly so) and whether he has made it, than him being "over rated".

He is over hyped because stories on him, positive or negative, generate hits

I never said Iniesta reinvented himself. I was clearly referring to Scholes and Pirlo.

Scholes did reinvent himself. Scholes started as an attacking mid, dropped to box to box, and then became a deep lying playmaker. The roles he has players over the years are certainly not the same.

Pirlo did the same, from Trequartista down to deep lying playmaker.

Kids?! You might want to watch read the Spanish papers: AS, Marca, Sport, El Mundo: for the last 3 years its been Messi vs Ronaldo, alongside Pep vs Jose, and Barca vs Madrid, its like the unmissable sub plot. Almost every show and commentator compares the two

This is easily solved - Explain to me the difference between overhyped and overrated, clearly I've missed something in all the media stories I have seen down the years.
I watch nearly every Barcelona game and I'm yet to see commentators go crazy about an average Messi goal, I check sites such as sky sports footy news, goal.com and watch sky sports news every single day to see what's going on... I still don't see average Messi goals get exaggerated.

You referred to players reinventing themselves when time catches up with them, and then namedropped Iniesta.. But I guess I'm wrong again

I'd happily read Spanish newspapers but I have the slight disadvantage of speaking literally no Spanish whatsoever.

 

[Mike.]

This is easily solved - Explain to me the difference between overhyped and overrated, clearly I've missed something in all the media stories I have seen down the years.
I watch nearly every Barcelona game and I'm yet to see commentators go crazy about an average Messi goal, I check sites such as sky sports footy news, goal.com and watch sky sports news every single day to see what's going on... I still don't see average Messi goals get exaggerated.

You referred to players reinventing themselves when time catches up with them, and then namedropped Iniesta.. But I guess I'm wrong again

I'd happily read Spanish newspapers but I have the slight disadvantage of speaking literally no Spanish whatsoever.

Rooney is over promoted (over hyped). Everything he does is talked about, good or bad. If Rooney is benched, it means he is leaving and then you get 10 stories on where he will go. Since he got benched vs Madrid, there have consistently been articles about whether he is leaving or not. See Balotelli when he was here. Whatever he did, good or bad was in the papers. Even when it was nothing to do with his on the pitch ability. Or the press running article after article on Mourinho.

That is hype, excessive promotion and talk. It's not the same as people saying he is better than he actually he is (over rated). Players/people who get 10 articles on them no matter what they do

I was only referring to Scholes and Pirlo: the art of reinventing yourself. The rest were players people could and should look up to.

You are not missing much in the papers (but the sites have english translations), for the most part they forget about most of La Liga, no surprise Messi vs Ronaldo, alongside Pep vs Jose, and Barca vs Madrid is what sells.

 

[Cai1234]

I believe it is impossible to compare players from different generations and also impossible to pick the worlds best player as it is a TEAM sport. You might be able to pick the worlds best team(But UEFA and FIFA suck at that). Also there are different styles(eg west ham and Barca) and different positions making it near impossible to chose the best. In Tennis, snooker or any other one player team it isn't to hard but in a team sport it's hard.

 

[ajt09]

Rooney is not overrated. That's just utter, utter garbage. To put those two words in the same sentence is idiotic.

And on a sidenote enough with the football players=role models stuff. It's nonsense. That's not what they are paid to be.

 

[JP Woody]

Rooney is not overrated. That's just utter, utter garbage. To put those two words in the same sentence is idiotic.

And on a sidenote enough with the football players=role models stuff. It's nonsense. That's not what they are paid to be.

I think when it comes to England Rooney is totally overrated. Ive not seen him have a good game for England since 2004.

 

[ajt09]

I think when it comes to England Rooney is totally overrated. Ive not seen him have a good game for England since 2004.

Well, tbf if the other players are having a pretty poor game around him he does tend to suffer as there's no decent supply going through to him. And majority of the time he's pretty much marked quite heavily and struggles to get free to get the ball-but he does work very hard to compensate for other players mistakes so he's in positions that aren't natural so when he does get the ball, he can't do what he does best. But in the PL he's just absolutely superb. Admittedly, I have missed some England games but the ones I have seen when we've been poor, he's been devoid of a good supply and has suffered.

 

[Mike.]

I think when it comes to England Rooney is totally overrated. Ive not seen him have a good game for England since 2004.

He's had good qualifying games, but not good tournie games. Although you could extend that to most of the England side. But yes when you watch him for club, the disparity between that and country is massive by his standards so it stands out more than most.